Author Topic: HT, Donut map FT  (Read 3817 times)

Offline WilldCrd

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Re: HT, Donut map FT
« Reply #60 on: September 07, 2006, 10:10:15 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by whels
guess its time to follow up and take donut out of rotation.


Rooks have taken all of FT again, 3 bases and 25k mountains, make it
near impossible to retake. so 3/4s of clients now out of FT fun.




im confused, if its near impossible to take it back...how did teh horde take it in the 1st place?:huh
Crap now I gotta redo my cool sig.....crap!!! I cant remeber how to do it all !!!!!

Offline Dichotomy

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« Reply #61 on: September 07, 2006, 10:13:10 PM »
well I played FT for the first time tonight and thought it was incredible.  Got my tail handed to me repeatedly but one of the best MA nights I've ever had.  Opinion... rework the rest of the maps to have this feature on all of them.  I think it really would cut down on a lot of the conflict.  

Nice work sir
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Offline stickpig

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« Reply #62 on: September 07, 2006, 10:37:34 PM »
Thanks Dantoo

There you have it guys and gals...

No more speculation. The designer just told you what the intent was.

Any questions?
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Offline E25280

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« Reply #63 on: September 07, 2006, 10:38:36 PM »
I must admit a little bit of confusion.  We were always told in the past that HTC did not want to "split the community" in the MA by giving special rules or treatment to one area of the map or the other.

Similar reasoning for not creating a "furball arena" separate from the "war arena."

Guess that went out the window.  "Split the community" has been sanctioned.  So I must ask, why not go all the way?  Since the attempt has now "officially" been made to separate the community into an "furball area" that should not be touched by the "war", what is the point of having both on the same map at all?  Seems to me rearranging the bases in the DA, restructure of the AvA (which would actually upset me very much), or perminant opening/renaming of the Backup Arena would make just as much sense as this move, if not more.
Quote
Originally posted by Dichotomy
I think it really would cut down on a lot of the conflict.

Because, no, I don't believe this will stop either the griefing or the resulting whining.  Unfortunately, too many people get off on either or both.
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Offline mars01

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« Reply #64 on: September 07, 2006, 10:40:12 PM »
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when ever some tards take all the ft bases the ft guys shoud spend the week killing barracks and to make that easer send some bombers to the grunt training. that will keep the barracks dead longer. of coarse if some of the ft guys would take 5 mins out of vultching and keep the barracks dead in ft its doubtfull the tards would ever take and bases in ft.

LOLH Ice, you read my mind.  I logged in for the sole purpose to do just that.

Then I got a nice suprise and saw HTC reset the map and removed the griefer element by disableing strat.  Well I went to FT like a moth to a bug light.

I have to say I have not had that much fun in AH since the AHII beta nights.  HT thank you for giving us a place to fight even if it was only for tonight.

FT was incredible, I finally logged, hip pockets sagging - sa shot and fully spent.  That was awesome!

I have to say, Donut is by far the best map we have.  Even with fighter town raging there were fights going on, on all the fronts.  That tells me we finally have a map that everyone can play at any time.  WAY TO GO DANTOO-GRAND SLAM!

Quote
I am not a furballer by nature. I always called it the "Hole".

Furballers will no longer be called furballers, we are now called Holers LOLH :D

What a blast - thanks again HTC!
« Last Edit: September 07, 2006, 10:46:46 PM by mars01 »

Offline mars01

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« Reply #65 on: September 07, 2006, 10:44:00 PM »
WTF are you talking about E25280.

FT and Donut were a complete success tonight and no the community was not split.  It was fighting side by side sharing an arena where every game play style was allowed.  How in hell can you be disappointed with that???

Offline Mako15

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« Reply #66 on: September 07, 2006, 10:47:06 PM »
They're just bait to me. Let them try to take FT while I'm around....(haven't been on in 3 days cause of school and work :(....on the upside, my birthday is tomorrow, the 8th...I'll be 18 finally....send me presents! lol

Offline E25280

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« Reply #67 on: September 07, 2006, 10:54:08 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by mars01
WTF are you talking about E25280.

FT and Donut were a complete success tonight and no the community was not split.  It was fighting side by side sharing an arena where every game play style was allowed.  How in hell can you be disappointed with that???
Not disappointed, confused.   I believe you misunderstand my point.  Whether on the same map or not there are now in effect two entirely separate games going on.  Which is fine.  I just thought that in the past it was stated this was not what HTC wanted.

My point is, this is a half measure when the full measure is obvious.  Furballers want to furball 24/7 without being griefed.  Win the war types want to have full run of the map, even if their chosen course goes through a "furball" area.  

The half measure implemented still allows the griefing to occur.  Griefing = whining on the BBs.  I have to assume whining on the BBs = annoyance for HTC, or he would not have made this move.

The full measure would preclude any griefing.  No griefing, no whining, ostensibly everyone would be happy doing their thing.
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Offline Stang

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« Reply #68 on: September 07, 2006, 11:00:52 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by E25280

The half measure implemented still allows the griefing to occur.  Griefing = whining on the BBs.  
No, that's just whining, plain and simple.

Offline mars01

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« Reply #69 on: September 07, 2006, 11:12:35 PM »
Well your wrong to think we can't coexist on the same map as one community and it was proven we could tonight.  No troops, no ords = no griefers.  All that happend was the fight ragged on and a big part of the community that was not happy, is.

Honestly I would play the land grab game more if there were a fighter town on every map.  It's a nice change of pace when I have saturated my SA and had my fill fighting and I don't have to leave the arena to do it.

Then when I have had my rest taking bases I could go back to fighter town etc.  Split the arenas and I can't do this as easily as picking a field.

Also you are wrong in thinking having a fighter town splits the community.  It doesn't.  Just because there are two different styles of play here, doesn't mean the community is split.  Without the fighter town there are still two styles of game play.  One (strat) is totally accessable the other (Holers) is not so much.

Offline E25280

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« Reply #70 on: September 07, 2006, 11:23:03 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by mars01
Honestly I would play the land grab game more if there were a fighter town on every map.  It's a nice change of pace when I have saturated my SA and had my fill fighting and I don't have to leave the arena to do it.

Then when I have had my rest taking bases I could go back to fighter town etc.  Split the arenas and I can't do this as easily as picking a field.
Fair enough.  I guess I have never had a problem switching between the AvA and MA depending on what I felt like doing, so switching "furball" vs "war" arenas seems more logical to me.

Glad all had fun tonight.  Hopefully at some point this weekend I can join in by flying a little instead of only browsing the BBs. . .
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Offline bj229r

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« Reply #71 on: September 08, 2006, 04:09:24 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by E25280
I must admit a little bit of confusion.  We were always told in the past that HTC did not want to "split the community" in the MA by giving special rules or treatment to one area of the map or the other.

Similar reasoning for not creating a "furball arena" separate from the "war arena."

Guess that went out the window.  "Split the community" has been sanctioned.  So I must ask, why not go all the way?  Since the attempt has now "officially" been made to separate the community into an "furball area" that should not be touched by the "war", what is the point of having both on the same map at all?  Seems to me rearranging the bases in the DA, restructure of the AvA (which would actually upset me very much), or perminant opening/renaming of the Backup Arena would make just as much sense as this move, if not more.

Because, no, I don't believe this will stop either the griefing or the resulting whining.  Unfortunately, too many people get off on either or both.


I don't think having 3 bases set aside from the other 150 or so messes up the building battlers TOO much:furious
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Offline Waffle

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« Reply #72 on: September 08, 2006, 05:07:26 AM »
WTH???????  TURN IT BACK!!! I CAN'T DOGFIGHT IN C-47 ANYMORE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:furious :furious :furious :furious :furious :furious :furious

Offline Kweassa

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« Reply #73 on: September 08, 2006, 05:32:05 AM »
Let's see. When's the last time Skuzzy reset the arena over player request?

 ...

 None, to the extent of my knowledge over all the years I've spent with AH.

 Unless the arena settings were haywire or some kind of error occured, the MA always existed as it was. Nobdody could say anything that would make HTC fiddle with the rotations or reset it on purpose, just because a special group of people found it against their own interests/ What happened inside the MA stayed inside. The players took care of it. They've DEALT with it, like it or not. All the bad and grievous stuff like ord being wiped out, fuel busted down to 25% at all frontline fields (way back), CVs being left unprotected, people hiding CVs, suicidal jabos, tard runs, hording, losing HQ bases, all dars going down... etc etc.. nobody influenced HTC, until now.

 Then comes the "special interest group". People who can't stand the strat aspect of the MA. People so engrossed in their own fun, that they find it appaling even to try and defend or take back the fields they hold so dear. Despite the fact every base in MA terrains are supposed to be capturable, nobody should be allowed to interfere their own definition of fun. Therefore, everybody else who ain't a 'furballer' should stay out. They come straight to the boards, throw a tantrum, and voila, the map is reset. Troop transports are removed from the game.

 Maybe HT just got tired. Maybe a new rule is being written about running the MA. Whatever it is, one thing's clear is that its an unprecedented event - the whiners won over HT.
 
 It's interesting to think about what will come next. First, the whiners ask for a special place which serves their own definition of fun. The map makers bend over, the maps are accepted.

 Then, they want that special place to be turned into an official whiner sanctuary, free from every outside influence. A place where they don't even need to defend what they hold dear. Shut out rest of the MA, play the AvA game, and don't let anyone who disagrees enter the borders. Now, they got that too. The removal of troop transports has turned FT into the official Hitechcreations Bird Sanctuary for Endangered Species.

  What's coming next?

 Special admission cards required to enter whiner sanctuary?

 It's interesting to watch and see what new bends and curves they'll request next. And to think all them people are the same guys who post in the BBS whenever someone else whines about how some people are ruining their fun.
 


 E25280 nailed it on the head - a bunch of people asked for special treatment, and they got it. Whining seems to work now. If something's against your own interest, gather a bunch of people and start crying about it. In the end, they might install a very special sanctuary for you too.

 Me?

 I'm thinking about asking for a "jets and rockets" sanctuary. All those damned high perks and base capturing ruins my chances of having pure aerial jet-lag fun in the game. I mean, three or four fields where people only up 262s and rockets aren't gonna ruin anyone else's fun, right? Why should my own request be turned down when the other set of whiners got their own?

 While we're at it, let's also request for an "Early Bird" sanctuary. Only early war planes allowed, no Lgay Spit16 tards allowed. I'm sure that'll be popular. It wouldn't bother anyone - all us early war plane lovers will stay there.

 

 ..


 Buncha bullshi* hypocrites.

Offline Simaril

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« Reply #74 on: September 08, 2006, 06:44:28 AM »
Kweassa, I think youmay be misreading things a bit.

HT doesnt give in to whining...just browse the boards and you'll see plenty of whines with no intervention. He DOES think very carefully before making any changes in game mechanics, sinec as he's said before there are often unanticipated effects to even minor changes. Every decision I've seen him make was based on its effects on gameplay, never once based on whines. After all, the FT whines at their worst hardly registered compared to the anti-ENY!!!



Anyway, arguments about FT have been going on since, Oh, 6 hours after its debut. A couple things ought to be obvious.

1. Everything about them SCREAMS that they were designed to be outside the main strategic flow. When HT approved THIS map, he approved the implications of the design as well. That means that HT expected the Donut itself to be a dogfighting center from the beginning.

2. Any talk of "the capture battle flowing over fightertown" as a natural event is bogus, plain and simple. FT captures are deliberate griefing attempts, except for the ONE time (IIRC) that a FT base was the final capture of a reset.  

3. "Cant bother to defend their bases" is also bogus. FT captures essentially always occur during low number times, when a dozen guys can completely cap and vulch nearly unopposed. When there are only 40 on a side, and no nearby bases, you cannot defend against an implemented cap.


So it seems to me that what happened was NOT HiTech giving in to whiners. It seems to me that after months of watching the community wrangle, watching the effect of a few griefers repeatedly subverting the obvious intent of the map -- and seeing that subversion likely to continue each and every rotation -- he acted to defend the majority from the few who were trying to screw things up.

Think about those few who glitched the system by using the film recorder in game to find enemy GVs. When that minority subverted the game's obvious intent, HT fixed it FOR THAT REASON, and not because the majority shines about it.

And it doesnt mean that the community is splitting. Its one map, for crying out loud!

And while we're at it, take a look at the plane distribution on this map. When all 3 bases are up, a good 25% of all players are in the donut having a blast. Do you really believe that 8 guys at 2AM should have a right to take that away from such a large gang of players?

Why does it bother you to see all those people have fun? Why should anyone feel so strongly about the rights of the few griefers, and feel so little for the rights of the many who love the donut?


Nothing bullsh@, nothing hypocritical at all.  This one isnt hard, bro....its self evident.
« Last Edit: September 08, 2006, 06:53:04 AM by Simaril »
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