F4U-4 vs. other low ENY

[Saxman]

The -4 would dominate the are if not perked, IMHO.

Let me butcher a statement from the best -4 driver I've seen several years back.

  "The -4 is the BEST prop driven plane in the game"
                                                   BluKitty


That's good enough for me!



JUGgler

TBH, I'd still even rate it above the 262. The 262 only really has speed and climb going for it. Poor acceleration, doesn't turn well at ANY speed, and the 30mm have too poor of a rate of fire, muzzle velocity, and ballistics properties to be particularly useful against fighters unless you REALLY know how to aim them. I rarely ever found them to be more than a nuisance since so long as you're aware of them, as it takes very little effort to evade an attack.

[Zacherof]

I've lost a few dogfights to a few 262 jocks.
262's are actually quite manueverable at 400mph

[RotBaron]

Can I side track from the "perk point" thingy and ask everyone about the F4U-4 acceleration compared to other allied planes in here. It always seems to me that it is slower in acceleration then it should be:

"In level flight acceleration the F4U-4 gained speed at about 2.4 mph/sec, the P-51D accelerated at about 2.2 mph/sec. The F4U-1 could not keep up with either, accelerating at only 1.5 mph/sec. The real drag racer of American WWII fighters was the P-38L. It gained speed at 2.8 mph/sec. All acceleration data was compiled at 10-15,000 ft at Mil. power settings."

See the chart:

http://www.gonzoville.com/charts/index.php

It appears in the 150-200mph range the 38-L is a close second in acceleration. Through the rest of the envelope it distances itself from the other US iron you mentioned. I'm sure there are other factors, but one aspect of drag is weight, thus while its better than the other corsairs, it's still a 12klb aircraft. However, part of the problem with this chart is the 500' baseline for comparison.

One of things that got my attention once was being hunted in the -4 down by a F4U-1 (I knew who was after me and knew the result if I tried to fight.) The overall topspeed was not enough to distance myself from him to get to land; he vulched me. I tried my best to get away but I was out of fuel. The increased horsepower drains the fuel tanks quicker. Also, I think I read somewhere that the main tank is smaller to begin with, but can't say that for sure.

[Tank-Ace]

In my opinion, - 4 Hogs are the most dangerous opponents in the game. I get fairly into the game, and it's the only icon that elicits a fight or flight response from me.

There is nothing it doesn't do well, which means if it has the initiative, you have to beat the pilot, instead of beating the plane.

[Zacherof]

It's always the pilot you to defeat.
I once killed a 4hog wih a dash 1a with little E. I used overshoots and baited him to loose his alt and e advantage. Eventually turned into a turn fight and my flaps popped out first


Very rarely does one run into such pilots in this plane tho.

[whiteman]

You dont follow, it just adds up - faster machines catches all slower marks of same brand,
109k, spit14 190dora yak3, to be chewed up by others when forced to turn back into the furball.

Karnak:
You have no idea what planes i like and not.
I flew Spits alnost exclusive until I became a trainer and later euro-headtrainer in a game
created by hitech and pyro, long time ago.
I have flown spits in here,
but only one Spit16 mission, landing 4 kills with half ammo.

I seek challenge in flying some machines, but
lately , flying birds in a furball that previous you had small chance in, is now close to suicide.
the G6 is a good example, because the new good planes adds up.

I've yet to have a Spit XIV or Yak3 change what i do in the MA. In fact I love the sight of a Spit XIV over any other spit, and pretty much the same for the Yak3

[Tank-Ace]

It's always the pilot you to defeat.
I once killed a 4hog wih a dash 1a with little E. I used overshoots and baited him to loose his alt and e advantage. Eventually turned into a turn fight and my flaps popped out first


Very rarely does one run into such

Drop the best pilot in a -4, and the situation is entirely different. While the K4 can out-climb the -4, it needs a fair bit of a head start. Unl pilots in this plane tho.

Don't be obtuse; you're confusing the point.

[Zacherof]

Point is dash 4 is a dominating aircraft, with that I totally agree.

[save]

Point is the plane that can force you to stay and fight is not the plane that normally  kills you, its the  ki84 and spit16 that just wait for you in the tonga-line behind, will.
The only thing that can bail you out, is your wingman diving in to clear you.
To be called a #%&€% picker helping your wingman, i can live with.
Without wingman in slower bird, you are a just another kill.

I've yet to have a Spit XIV or Yak3 change what i do in the MA. In fact I love the sight of a Spit XIV over any other spit, and pretty much the same for the Yak3

[RotBaron]

Really meant drag + weight, I'm sure someone here could put the equation with the Corsair's variables.

How do you guys manage the throttle with the balance of kinetic retention, but slower (than some) acceleration?
When ENY is high I've been trying to fly the other Corsairs while paying attention to the aforementioned (so as to help improve my -4 flying,) but I find myself looking at a higher con thinking oh crap. Whether I won or had to disengage I'm watching them descend on me with little understanding how to combat. I know I need more time in the TA, but how do you handle this? The barrel roll defense is something I've tried with limited success (I'm sure it's my execution.)

[Karnak]

save,

Were you not the guy objecting to how the Spit XIV made life hard for your Fw190A-8?  If not, my apologies.

To me, being a Mossie VI fan, I just don't see the Spit XIV any different than the Bf109K-4, both of which require me to outfly the enemy because his fighter is simply superior to mine.  Bf109K-4s are actually worse because you rarely encounter only one as Luft fans seem to be a lot more into the themed squadron thing.

[Saxman]

Whether I won or had to disengage I'm watching them descend on me with little understanding how to combat. I know I need more time in the TA, but how do you handle this? The barrel roll defense is something I've tried with limited success (I'm sure it's my execution.)

Ultimately you want to neutralize his altitude advantage, and even with aircraft that can outclimb you that's not impossible. If I'm alone and dealing with a high con I want to maintain a bit of horizontal separation. It's a LOT easier to neutralize his advantage if he's not able to stay right on top of you, so what I'll do is:

1)  Once I ID him, I'll turn away and show him my tail and start a shallow climb, maintaining as much E as I can. This buys me a little time to neutralize some of his alt advantage since he has to close the gap horizontally. I keep an eye on him and watch. If he continues on his way I may go into Auto Climb (Alt-X) to grab as much altitude as I can before resuming course. If he turns in and starts to follow I watch his range...

2) ...and once I see him close to within about 2000 yards I'll go shallow nose down to pick up a bit of maneuvering speed. My eyes are still on the bandit.

3) At around 1500 yards I'll enter a slight nose-low turn into him. This will start to eat up the distance between us as he goes to cut the corner, but he'll also have to commit more to keep guns on me. This sets up...

4) ...my move at about 600-800 yards, extreme gun range. I break hard into and back underneath him in a Low Yo-Yo. If my positioning and timing at the break are right he won't be able to follow.

5) I pull through the bottom and go into a zoom to grab back as much altitude as I can while I IMMEDIATELY pick up where the bandit went. If I see he recovered and is grabbing altitude again I'll keep repeating this until either we've neutralized E states, he loses interest, help comes, I can get away, etc.

What happens a LOT however, (especially against P-51s) is that the bandit over-committed and is now well below me, blowing a ton of E trying to pull out. In which case I cackle gleefully, kick the rudder over and drop on him.

The real key to this is horizontal separation, since that gives you the room you need to recover your own E between each pass and sucker him into over-committing on his attacks.

[save]

I do not like spit14s less than yak3 la7 109k, they all adds up to the speedrace. Very good firepower does not make it any worse.
would it be better If all veterans started to use their perkpoints ?
My squad flew a full squad online about 10 guys in 262s once, the country we flew against did not up again on our side of the front,because if you cant beat them, join them, or log.

Im worried a G2-G6 190a yak7, earlier spits, mossie do not have a place in MA in the future.
I admit i started to fly Doras instead of 190a även odds are against us, next i probably switch the G6 for a G14.

save,

Were you not the guy objecting to how the Spit XIV made life hard for your Fw190A-8?  If not, my apologies.

To me, being a Mossie VI fan, I just don't see the Spit XIV any different than the Bf109K-4, both of which require me to outfly the enemy because his fighter is simply superior to mine.  Bf109K-4s are actually worse because you rarely encounter only one as Luft fans seem to be a lot more into the themed squadron thing.

[Zacherof]

Really wish our g6 had the mk-108

[BaldEagl]

I do not like spit14s less than yak3 la7 109k, they all adds up to the speedrace. Very good firepower does not make it any worse.
would it be better If all veterans started to use their perkpoints ?
My squad flew a full squad online about 10 guys in 262s once, the country we flew against did not up again on our side of the front,because if you cant beat them, join them, or log.

Im worried a G2-G6 190a yak7, earlier spits, mossie do not have a place in MA in the future.
I admit i started to fly Doras instead of 190a även odds are against us, next i probably switch the G6 for a G14.

Nonsense.  The Spit XIV is only comparatively fast above 23K.  At typical MA alts it's no faster than the VIII or XVI and handles worse.  The K-4 is superior in almost every way and it's been in the MA for years, as has the La-7.

My primary rides are the Spit IX, 190A-8, F6F-5 and 109K-4 none of which are particularily fast outside of the K-4.

If you haven't been forced to change planes yet based on a single performance charachteristic it's not likely you'll have to worry about it in the future.  On the other hand if you're one dimensional (i.e. fly fast, pick and run) then maybe it's time to learn to fly.  Not saying that's how you fly but your post suggests it is.