Author Topic: Death Penalty... yes or no? (Read 3441 times)

Eagler · « **Reply #135 on:** November 19, 2002, 03:20:44 PM »

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Originally posted by Thrawn
It becomes immoral when the child can live outside the uterus.

WOW

thats nine months - 8 to 12 lbs

your kidding right?

Thrawn · « **Reply #136 on:** November 19, 2002, 03:22:27 PM »

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Originally posted by Eagler
WOW

thats nine months - 8 to 12 lbs

your kidding right?

No it's not. A child has a chance of serviving outside the womb at 5 months.

H. Godwineson · « **Reply #137 on:** November 19, 2002, 03:23:29 PM »

One of my wife's tumors is now 18, 6'2" tall, and weighs 280 pounds. It has learned to speak and will, hopefully, complete college.

Shuckins

hardcase · « **Reply #138 on:** November 19, 2002, 03:26:53 PM »

No, its called imposing your will on others because your character was more solid than theirs. Easy to pontificate from on high.

Did you take in any unwanted children that someone didnt abort?

You want to impose your values, but you dont want to pick up the consequences of that imposition. You wont vote to fund more money for prenatal care,child care,education, jobs creation, all the innumerable social programs needed for a single mother, to take to full term and raise a child.

How about the wife whose husband beats, abuses her, makes her life a living hell ,finds herself pregnant by him again. I guess you would, in your wisdom gained from trying to run others lives, would have her not abort?

That comes under personel choice doesnt it.

I assume you have no problem with rape, incest, health. One other group..those whose life is such a horror, that having a child is no longer a blessing but a threat.

You would have her reproduce someone who she hates with good reason. If I were her, I would refuse to reproduce with that piece of crap too. Maybe rthe women find the men totally worthless, themselves totally worthless. Children require faith in the future. Many women don't have that faith and with good reason.

Pro-Choice is HER choice.

HC

Kieran · « **Reply #139 on:** November 19, 2002, 03:27:40 PM »

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I glad you know why pro-choices have made their moral decisions better then they do themselves.

That one gets you the "Minus Award". I have no idea what this means, but it sounds good. No offense, but I am spinning this one trying to sort it out.

Quote

Pro-lifers don't seem to have any philosophy, morals or thoughts behind why a zygote is a human at all.

Interesting. Please elaborate.

hardcase · « **Reply #140 on:** November 19, 2002, 03:28:05 PM »

Thats great. Lets talk about that unwanted child, you want to execute.

HC

Kieran · « **Reply #141 on:** November 19, 2002, 03:30:01 PM »

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How about the wife whose husband beats, abuses her, makes her life a living hell ,finds herself pregnant by him again. I guess you would, in your wisdom gained from trying to run others lives, would have her not abort?

Wanna guess why I had a step-father? You forgot to add "rape" to the end of that sentence. BTW, my mother had the girl, she was adopted, and is living a wonderful and productive life.

Did I mention my step-father was abusive? Does this mean I have to be aborted now, to save me from the years of torment I would suffer?

Kieran · « **Reply #142 on:** November 19, 2002, 03:33:59 PM »

Yes, let's.

The unwanted child had a chance to make it. The unwanted child faced a world like the rest of us, made some bad choices and will now have to face the consequences.

Sure, we will get an "equal opportunity" argument now, but... really, what do you mean by "equal"?

mrfish · « **Reply #143 on:** November 19, 2002, 03:34:25 PM »

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Originally posted by Eagler
the difference is a Soul

what soul? where is this 'soul' and what is it exactly? you don't know - it's just another of your wacky metaphysical opinions. the results of which pair unwated kids with unwilling parents or parent- yeah that's great guys. what's real is the problem unwanted kids will face.

what's broken in your common sense organ that prohibits you from distinguishing an unborn fetus from a person?

where are you when the problems start with this kid? your only advice would be 'trust in zambooby' or whatever your little imaginary friend's name is. man, you mystic wackos are getting tiresome -

why can't you people just go pray quietly somewhere and let the rest of us get on with it.

hardcase · « **Reply #144 on:** November 19, 2002, 03:35:41 PM »

Your personel choice is yours. You get to make decisions for yourself. If I were a female you would not get to make decisions for me.

BTW someone asked about birth control or pregnancy out of wedlock in the bible. ..They called it stoning the squeak.

Still trying to practice it today..only more subtle.

HC

Kanth · « **Reply #145 on:** November 19, 2002, 03:38:39 PM »

Here's may take on this.

Children basically have the rights of animals until they reach a certain age and then receive their full rights. If that is okay, then I can follow the logic to see that a potential that isn't formed yet doesn't have any rights at all.

by this logic old people should have more rights given to them when they reach retirement age too, but they get screwed because like children, they can't fight back much. Like the fetus who cannot speak.

This is the allocation of rights in our society, if it can fight back, if it can be understood, then it gets more rights.

People in their prime get the most rights of all, people who have mental problems or are aged get less rights as do children, fetus who aren't even recognizable yet as human don't get rights..

women didn't have the rights of men up until recently, was it because they aren't as strong? you tell me.

does the fact that women now have rights signify any movement in our civilization towards consideration the weaker? I dunno possibly, and if so then the rights of the fetus will stand up in court some day.

There are alot of perceptions in our society that would have to be changed in order to stop abortions..other than just saying YOU CAN'T HAVE ONE CAUSE I SAID SO. Because it will still happen when a mother doesn't want whats growing inside her for whatever reason.

simply assigning the fetus rights, jumps a huge gap in our thinking that has to be dealt with for these things to stop and we aren't there yet obviously.

As far as the death penalty goes, yes as long as they are absolutely sure. This prevents repeat offenders but does not discourage the criminal mind because many think they are too smart to get caught in the first place.

that's all the seriousness I got for now.

Quote

Originally posted by Kieran
Yes it is, Kanth. It's precisely the argument the Pro-Choice have to make because it is too unsavory to say they are sacrificing the life of a human because it is inconvenient/painful/insert-whatever-reason to bring it to term. To say "yes, we know it is a person, but we are going to kill him/her anyway because _______" is too unpalatable. Better to argue "well, it isn't really a person yet, so killing it is ok."

BTW, no offense on the sig.

Kieran · « **Reply #146 on:** November 19, 2002, 03:38:58 PM »

That someone was me.

BTW, in spite of you saying I want to run your life, I don't. Tell your wife I don't want in her life either.

This is only my opinion on the issue, nothing more.

hardcase · « **Reply #147 on:** November 19, 2002, 03:43:26 PM »

You can always find a good outcome, you find the bad outcomes in jail or the obits, living and abusing someone.

Bottom line...abortion is NOT your decision. Don't worry what someone else has to decide in their lives. You dont care about the fetus when it is born, it really is still the male dominate thing over females, the female didnt stone herself. Ever wonder why a women would think that being pregnant is such a horro that they would stick coat hangars into their wombs, go to back alley kitchen buthcers and die on the table. to risk death to abort a prenancy? Perhaps we should be female before we even begin to argue about a females rights.

HC

Thrawn · « **Reply #148 on:** November 19, 2002, 03:44:03 PM »

I glad you know why pro-choices have made their moral decisions better then they do themselves.

minus --> English

"It's precisely the argument the Pro-Choice have to make because it is too unsavory to say they are sacrificing the life of a human because it is inconvenient/painful/insert-whatever-reason to bring it to term. To say "yes, we know it is a person, but we are going to kill him/her anyway because _______" is too unpalatable. Better to argue "well, it isn't really a person yet, so killing it is ok." "

Don't tell me why I believe something.

"Interesting. Please elaborate."

Pro-choicer on this board have bent over backwords explaining why they hold their beliefs.

Pro-lifers have responded with, "Well that's just wrong.", "I believe it's a sin.", "Life starts a conception."

Why.

Why does a zygotes rights supercede that of the woman?

Apache · « **Reply #149 on:** November 19, 2002, 03:52:08 PM »

Is a woman who was pregnant and aborted, considered a mother?