wtf is wrong with the French?

[straffo]

Originally posted by Hortlund
hehe, the reason I wanted to focus on those three topics is because there I remember the answers farily well.

Germany recognized Croatia and Croatia broke free. Then France recognized Bosnia=Serbia panicked=hello Bosnian civil war.

Your explanation is a bit short

Dien Bien Phu. Yes, there were lots of other nationalities in the legion at the time. But right after ww2 *alot* of germans (and notably, mostly ex-Waffen SS sought their way into the legion. In the early 50ies this became a problem when the French started to realize they had alot of warcrime suspects in the legion. At the same time, they could not kick them out. AND they were afraid of mutiny since something like 70% of the Legion was German at the time. SO off to Dien Bien Phu they went and died. After that, the German percentage was back to "normal" again.

it was never more than 25% as far as I know.

Looking forwards to your answers tomorrow. Will be interesting to discuss the Napoleonic wars

(Unless some norwegian guy drives over here tonight and kicks my bellybutton and destroys my computer because he feels I showed disrespect to some Norwegian sailors)

going for a 1 week mission now I reply more


concerning the french in the Waffen SS how do you coun the "malgres-nous" ? as french or german ?.

[hazed-]

wtf is right with em??

[-tronski-]

I wonder how this rather vitriolic criticism of the french comes about?

Imagine being critised for having no backbone because the French won't be bow beaten into a decision?  

Do what we want or you are nothing but a bunch of cowards!

No its right there between "surrender" and "mutiny and troops refusing to attack, win anyway due to massive help from allies that are forced to fight for france while the french troops are refusing to attack"

Even worse, being slandered by a swede...who are well known for sharing the same ground as the french on the western front in 1917.

Of course the French army mutiny was brought on primarily after the Nivelle Offensive (16 April- 9th May 1917) where the French suffered 189,000 causalties, over 40,000 on the first day (I forget the swedish causalties - But I would imagine it was something in the region of...oh...say....none). The army mutinied after the ingrates demanded not to be bleed white anymore...imagine the cowardice not wanting to be slaughtered!!! The meer cheek of the buggers.
After all the commonwealth, who bleed the same ground as the French (and the swedes obviously) forced in keeping the treaty which the British freely signed with those buggers the French!
Lucky the swedes were there to keep the whole thing together during 1914-1918 or we'd all be serving in the SS!

and I don't even want to mention WW2!!!!

 Tronsky

Allied WW1 causalties

                               killed    wounded
France             1,357,800   4,266,000
British Empire     908,371   2,090,212
(incl ANZACS, Canada)
Russia              1,700,000   4,950,000
Italy                    462,391      953,886
USA                       50,585      205,690
Belgium                 13,715        44,686
Rumania              335,706      120,000
Portugal                  7,222        13,751
Serbia                    45,000      133,148
Japan                          300             907
Sweden                           ?                 ?

[SLO]

tst tst people.....hortland is aloud to his opinion.

I am french(but from Canada)....you win some ya lose some....every country has its history....and France has been there for a long long time.....but to blame a countries policies cause they don't compare to yours is pointless.

France will work thru the UN....not thru the US....Canada will do the same.....so will russia....call my countries policies toejamless one's is pointless....


WW2 first big german offensive was against the french..they lost...ok....if it was sweden..it woulda been the same.

Every country thought Hitler WOULD NOT ATTACK...but he did(every country made the same mistake...only it was France that was stuck right beside germany and they where the first to get a bleedin nose)...no matter which country was besides them...germany woulda gave em a bleedin nose...including the US...they struck HARD an FAST

now that you dug up some French surrenders...try digging up some French victories....you will see that they have some impressive one's....

your argument is pointless.....

oh btw....France gave the US its most potent symbol(the lady statue...liberty)...France helped the US BECOME the USA....France spread its language around the world...to Become the SECOND most spoken language(and no its not spanish...but French)

now what has Sweden History done that compares to France's History....

[Masherbrum]

What about the "Libya Incident".

Karaya2

[Sandman]

Originally posted by Masherbrum
What about the "Libya Incident".

Karaya2

They flexed their sovereignty. We may not agree and it may not have helped our cause, but what the hell... it's their country and their air space.

[Hangtime]

The descriptive "apologist" was invented for the French.

[StSanta]

Hey Hortlund, should we begin to discuss the Danish-Swedish wars (of which they were many)?

It is true that the late wars were won by Sweden. But many battles and wars were lost as well - surrender, surender, defeat, defeat, white flag, surrender.

Every nation has its history of won and lost wars. If you choose to only see what France lost, you're blind to what they've won.

Why do you have a Bernadotte as your kind? Mayhap the failings and successes of France has had resyults that can be seen and felt in Sweden today?

In WWII, France got beat pretty quickly. Still, the Vichy troops fought quite bravely against the allies - until all resistance was futile. The Free French troops fought *very well* once they were competently lead. And the French resistance wasn't bad at all.

Not to mention WWI. The French dug in with the rest.

It is also worth noting that they've done quite well in modern time with regards to putting in troops to protect their citizens - Africa is a good example. They fared poorly in Vietnam - much like the Americans.

And their approach to handling terrorists is quick and brutal. Unlike Sweden which is riddled with PCness, the French aren't afraid to come across as racist brutes. They have a superiority complex, but as a people they're more resilient than the Swedes, who've stayed out of every conflict since the early 1800's.

And quite a few countries sent troops to Afghanistan. Even Denmark sent F-16's and AWACS to assist the yanks. Hell, we even lost people there. So don't be so quick to condemn the French who, when all is said and done, have been involved in more wars and conflict in modern time than has Sweden.

The perpertuated myth that French people are cowards is erroneous. Many great adventurers are French. They pioneered scuba diving and have a culture that produces great rock climbers. I've climbed with some and I can tell you this; they have more balls than I do. If you made soldiers outta these individuals, they wouldn't be cowards hiding behind 'neutrality'.

[StSanta]

On a sidenote, I think Frances reasons are economic and perhaps they've done some business deals they don't want the world to know about.

But the US behaves the same way, just as all other nations - protect the interest of the country.

Also the Norwegians blew up the German heavy water plant in Norway.

The Swedes sold quality steel and other goods to Nazi Germany.

If you attack the people of another country and the country itself, you better have swept you own back yard first. Swedens past isn't all roses - just as Denmark has a past full of blemishes.

It should also be noted that the SS Wiking division consisted largely of personell from Norway, Denmark and Sweden. More Swedes died fighting for the Nazis than against - again, numbers can be used both ways.

Don't trust a government that uses force to sterilize parts of its population. Don't trust one that believes in eugenics.

Now, if you will, attack Denmark. I'll make little attempt at trying to cover up the notorious 'achievements' of this country.

I find it amusing that you tell people to cool down after you yourself has just called their country gutless, spineless bunch of losers. Mayhap you would be well advised to tone down your own emotional attacks before telling others - you prompted their comments.

Feel free to hate me now .

[Hortlund]

Originally posted by StSanta
Why do you have a Bernadotte as your kind? Mayhap the failings and successes of France has had resyults that can be seen and felt in Sweden today?

hehe, so do you want to know what is Really funny?

After the 1809 war against Russia (when Sweden lost Finland), the (completely incapable) King was de-throned, and the parliament was debating over who should be elected new king. The eyes fell upon Bernadotte because he was a brilliant general in the French army. So the Parliament asked him if he wanted to be king of Sweden, and restore the nations borders. In other words, he was chosen because he was a great military leader, and he was chosen because it was believed that he would be the one to restore Swedens borders.

So what happened? He quickly surrendered to the Russians...

Damn french idiots.

[Hortlund]

Originally posted by fd ski
well Steve, at least they FOUGHT and lost instead of bending over for the enemy.
 

What part of "I think Sweden was a passive German ally" did you not understand?

[Hortlund]

Originally posted by StSanta

The Swedes sold quality steel and other goods to Nazi Germany.

If you attack the people of another country and the country itself, you better have swept you own back yard first. Swedens past isn't all roses - just as Denmark has a past full of blemishes.

It should also be noted that the SS Wiking division consisted largely of personell from Norway, Denmark and Sweden. More Swedes died fighting for the Nazis than against - again, numbers can be used both ways.

Don't trust a government that uses force to sterilize parts of its population. Don't trust one that believes in eugenics.

Now, if you will, attack Denmark. I'll make little attempt at trying to cover up the notorious 'achievements' of this country.

I find it amusing that you tell people to cool down after you yourself has just called their country gutless, spineless bunch of losers. Mayhap you would be well advised to tone down your own emotional attacks before telling others - you prompted their comments.

Feel free to hate me now .

Feel free to read my posts in the future. If my argument is that Sweden was a passive German ally, you have to understand that arguments like "Sweden sold iron ore to Germany" or "Swedish volounteers fought and died in the Waffen SS wont impress me that much.

[Hortlund]

Originally posted by StSanta
Hey Hortlund, should we begin to discuss the Danish-Swedish wars (of which they were many)?
 

Sure, if you want. I think just looking at a map over present day Denmark and Sweden compared to a map over 14th century Denmark/Sweden, 16th century Denmark/Sweden and 18th century Denmark/Sweden will speak volumes about our past wars...

[Boroda]

Surrender -1815 End of the Napoleon war

surrender -1872 End of the German-French war


Hortlund, you can insert the Crimean 1854-55 war in between, when French were the majority in expedtion corps that sieged Sevastopol. You can hardly call that "covardice".

JFYI: in that war soldiers wounded by Russian bayonets were carried to the cemetary without visiting hospital.

At the same time British attack on Petropavlovsk was repelled by a handfull of handicapped grey-haired warriors.

Conserning 1809 war. Bernadotte probably faced many things that were considered "impossible" but implemented by Russians, like the cavalry raid across the frozen Botnic gulf.

I admit that I know much less about that war then you do, because this minor conflict (from Russian POV) was a great episode of your history.

[lord dolf vader]

Im just sorry frenchy had to read that crap
(the first post and other nonsensical slander)


and the other frenchys also. I appologise for my countryman sincerly.