comparing Warbirds III to current AH

[wetrat]

no comparison

[Revvin]

B. To eliminate "stick stirring". Some players figured out that if you whack the stick back and fourth fast enough, the FE gets a little confused as to just exactly where your orientation is and receives intermittent 100% inputs in opposite directions. The FE doesn't know any better, it sends this info to the host, and your opponent on your six gets an interesting "dancing plane" to try and shoot at.

At last some truth, for years HS would not admit to it being a factor in the slow response.

[Siaf__csf]

Wrong. AH has gyroscopic effects and gun recoil. Try taking off in AH without using rudder. Then fly a Hurricane IID and fire the cannons.

Sure AH has those.. But the effect of them is tenfold smaller than in IL2. I don't know which one is more accurate, but IL2 is the first game where I had to practise 5 times before I could take off without the gyro effect flipping my plane over at full throttle.

In AH you can apply full throttle and pull stick back at stall limit with _no_ danger whatsoever of losing control as long as you don't pull enough to stall the plane. AH planes go like on rails once you get them to the air where IL-2 planes react strongly to throttle, speed and AOA.

There's a huge difference in modeling. AH used to be more like IL earlier, I remember the effect on c-hog taking off. It's gone now.

[Kweassa]

I don't know which product you're talking about, but in the case of 1C's latest release "Forgotten Battles", a lot of the funky wobbling that infested the previous title "IL-2", is gone.

 It is actually kind of interesting to see IL-2 FM change into something that resembles AH FM very closely. After Forgotten Battles was released, there was this incredible whining about how they 'neutered' the FM - pretty funny to see people who so enthusiastically worshipped 1C developers, suddenly turn against them just because the FM became 'easier'.

 Forgotten Battles, is a lot like AH now. I think that means something.

[Siaf__csf]

Kweassa I only own the Forgotten Battles, played IL2 original only in demos.

I'm talking about FB flight model now when I'm comparing.

/edit

So they changed the FM? I was kinda wondering about that, the demo I tried seemed to be even harder to fly. I remember dogfights being like balancing on a glass ball and shooting arrows.

Still as it is, I find the FM much more challenging than the one in AH. Especially when it comes to gunnery.

[Vulcan]

Originally posted by Target
LOL, can't believe I take a break from AGW to get away from the griping only to find this.

Seriously though, in answer to some comments. There is a certain amount of control "delay" built into Warbirds III. It's appearance, sometime during the first few months of WBIII development was for two reasons. A. To simulate a certain amount of real world control delay. While the action of moving the stick will indeed move a rudder at the same speed as the stick is moved, no real world control in a WWII aircraft could be pushed around as fast as the stick on your desktop can. In order to get the "feel" of pushing the stick with real force the delay "acts" like it takes X pounds of force to perform Y amount of roll.

Sorry, but Palef posted an interview with a Spit pilot several months ago. The question was specifically asked about 'snap' ability of controls. His response was it was a 'snap' response, just like we see in AH. So, from the horses mouth, you are quite incorrect.

The stickstirring reason is fair enough. However I think the HTC solution to this is better, as mushing the stick detracts from the enjoyment and FM of the game.

[lazs2]

no offense target but... I trust WB to screw it all up and I don't trust em to tell the truth.   Maybe you are new but..  
lazs

[Kekule]

Lazs is jealous because WBIII has early war planes that are actually flown in a competitive manner.

Really, you should trust Target till he burns you (which I doubt will happen).

Kekule
18th Sentai

[Stridr417]

I like AH overall, but the reason I stay in Warbirds is that it feels more realistic.  The axis vs allied arena, the RPS, the more complete early war planeset, the S3's.  I can go on, but thats it for me.  My trial with AH was about a year ago, and it felt too much like warbirds did around v 2.0.

[vorticon]

the funny thing is i think that in ww2 the plane wouldent flip on the runwayunless you did something stupid like nose forward to much


and just because the fm is harder that doesnt make it realistic

[Esme]

Target, good to see you around m'dear.  Glad you feel that the team can now progress some stuff that has long needed seeing to in WBIII, and I look forard to seeing the results!

Regarding the stick-stirring problem, maybe you want to get someone to look at how the program code can detect probable stick-stirring  and only "mush" THAT, rather than mushing all inputs. :-}



Esme (an ex "Dead Sticks" member and proud of it!)

[Siaf__csf]

Vorticon you just pointed out one major thing.. AH planes need _no_ nose down while accelerating on runway. Just keep stick centered, apply a little rudder and up you go steady as on rails.

Just face it, AH has a simplified engine management and flight model to attract a larger base of players. HT would be stupid to do anything else.

The planes have to be easy enough to fly for a player first time on the sticks. This is a reality, not realism.

[Target]

HEY ESME!!! Long time no see!

Yeah, we've got a really good team now with a hands off management style. Can't ask for more than that. Here's hoping we don't drop the ball.

I remember lots of our conversations about level bombing and gameplay. I hope to do the bombers proud in future updates.

Hey guys, you may or may not know it, but this community has a fantastic resource in Esme. No finer leader of virtual squad.

Chow bella!

[Revvin]

Originally posted by Target
I hope to do the bombers proud in future updates.

Chow bella!

Now that sounds interesting tell us more!

[Drex]

Good to see you, Target.  

Drex