Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Wishlist => Topic started by: guncrasher on October 18, 2019, 03:29:59 AM
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today there's 22 players and we have eny, not sure how many in tower, but it's kind of ridiculous to have eny with such low numbers.
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kept checking we had 8 or 9 players flying
semp
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Did you switch sides?
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Did you switch sides?
Idiot! I changed sides but nothing to see so I tried my second account well I guessed wrong so I created a 3rd account...yep finally a fight. How about you actually try the game instead of jerk off on the forum
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His computer is on the fritz
I thought the "eny" didn't engage until a certain amount of players were logged in? Or do they all have to be flying ?
Or was it discussed but never implemented?
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today there's 22 players and we have eny, not sure how many in tower, but it's kind of ridiculous to have eny with such low numbers.
+1
I've been asking for this going on years.
When that happens to me I don't even bother to stay. I know others feel the same way.
My playing time is limited. Getting nailed by that monster when I login is a major frustration.
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Idiot! I changed sides but nothing to see so I tried my second account well I guessed wrong so I created a 3rd account...yep finally a fight. How about you actually try the game instead of jerk off on the forum
I like Shuffler but have to agree with your assessment of how the side changing thing goes. I've experienced the same.
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Idiot! I changed sides but nothing to see so I tried my second account well I guessed wrong so I created a 3rd account...yep finally a fight. How about you actually try the game instead of jerk off on the forum
You new guys are a hoot.
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His computer is on the fritz
I thought the "eny" didn't engage until a certain amount of players were logged in? Or do they all have to be flying ?
Or was it discussed but never implemented?
I thought so too.
It is extremely rare that eny affects my choice of birds.
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Really wish there were different color dars to tell which team was winning the fight on the other side. Sometimes you switch teams to try to find the fight, but end up on the side that is winning. Then cannot do anything about it. Generally with under 50 players, the #s on each side dont correlate to who is winning the map, battle.
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I thought so too.
It is extremely rare that eny affects my choice of birds.
These kind of statements are about the dumbest ones Ive seen on these boards. If you follow that logic to the end it means there will be 5 players on flying their ride of choice because ENY doesnt effect them, while everyone else has left the game.
Just because it doesnt effect you dosent make the point moot. These people have valid complaints and unfortunately with more and more complaints about one thing or another you can see the effect in the numbers as they continually drop away.
2 more squads have given notice for FSO that this is their last month as they can no longer get enough players to show to make it worth the time and energy. Poor Brook has worn his fingers down to nibs trying to build some interest in the scenario coming up. If there is "nothing wrong with the game" why are so many people leaving?
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If there is "nothing wrong with the game" why are so many people leaving?
Certainly it couldn't be because people get abusive on the BBS. Or in the game, for that matter.
- oldman
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Certainly it couldn't be because people get abusive on the BBS. Or in the game, for that matter.
- oldman
EDIT.... I wrote this whole big thing about how I love the game and such, but it just isnt worth it. Those of you with your heads in the sand won't be talked back into the real world with out your rose colored glasses anyway.
I hope this game holds on a long time because I hope to play this game a long time. Only time will tell.
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EDIT.... I wrote this whole big thing about how I love the game and such, but it just isnt worth it. Those of you with your heads in the sand won't be talked back into the real world with out your rose colored glasses anyway.
I hope this game holds on a long time because I hope to play this game a long time. Only time will tell.
I wasn't kidding. Calling one's fellow players "dumb," or "idiot," or telling them to stop jerking off on the forum (something of a new low), really is not the sort of thing that puts a good face on this game for new people who just may be interested in joining a friendly group with like interests. It's a poor answer to say that other games are worse.
- oldman
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If ENY is off and one guy joins and it turns on do you ask them to leave? :D
Seems like it could be a disincentive to join and play if it would restart ENY and you play on the high side.
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I remember something... :old:
Once upon a time, ENY did often not kick in in the Early War arena because of overall low numbers. Players were less willing to stick around for a 2 vs 10 when those 10 all still could field the top plane of choice (Hurri II). In the end, the minimum population requirement for ENY to kick in was lowered.
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I wasn't kidding. Calling one's fellow players "dumb," or "idiot," or telling them to stop jerking off on the forum (something of a new low), really is not the sort of thing that puts a good face on this game for new people who just may be interested in joining a friendly group with like interests. It's a poor answer to say that other games are worse.
- oldman
Yeah, but did he have a point? I kinda think so.
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If ENY is off and one guy joins and it turns on do you ask them to leave? :D
Seems like it could be a disincentive to join and play if it would restart ENY and you play on the high side.
You don't have to ask anyone to leave. They do it quite voluntarily.
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You don't have to ask anyone to leave. They do it quite voluntarily.
Based on the arena numbers over the years, I would say they do it permanently. This sim is following Warbirds slow decline in active flying members. The lower the numbers, the less chance of having fun. The less fun, the lower the numbers get.
I know HTC is trying everything they can to attract and keep new players, but clearly nothing they have tried has worked to date. It isn't going to matter whether eny is limited when there are low players, because if things keep going the way they have been, there won't be any players... certainly not enough to call this a massive multiplayer game. Arena numbers over 500 are what makes this game shine compared to the competition.
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I wasn't kidding. Calling one's fellow players "dumb," or "idiot," or telling them to stop jerking off on the forum (something of a new low), really is not the sort of thing that puts a good face on this game for new people who just may be interested in joining a friendly group with like interests. It's a poor answer to say that other games are worse.
- oldman
In my case, I didnt call anyone dumb, I called his statement dumb. I like Shuff he always tries to put a good spin on things in the game. The point I was trying to make was that just because eveything it "hunky dory" for a few players doent mean that it must be for everyone. FESS is ticked because the game he loves is slowly dieing away and it doesnt look like anyone is working to fix it, hell many people arent even admitting there are issues that need work.
You may not like how players seem to be bad mouthing the game, and they really arent, they are pointing out what they believe are issue that need looking at, but the point is many new players never hit the BBS, and last less than a half an hour in the game never to be seem again. It cant be due to bad mouthing IN the game as most dont stay long enough to learn to TUNE to 200 and see the worst of it.
The game needs new blood that will stay long enough to get deep into the learning curve. Changes need to be made to make that happen PERIOD
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These kind of statements are about the dumbest ones Ive seen on these boards. If you follow that logic to the end it means there will be 5 players on flying their ride of choice because ENY doesnt effect them, while everyone else has left the game.
Just because it doesnt effect you dosent make the point moot. These people have valid complaints and unfortunately with more and more complaints about one thing or another you can see the effect in the numbers as they continually drop away.
2 more squads have given notice for FSO that this is their last month as they can no longer get enough players to show to make it worth the time and energy. Poor Brook has worn his fingers down to nibs trying to build some interest in the scenario coming up. If there is "nothing wrong with the game" why are so many people leaving?
I told you a fact. If you do not like facts.... that is your problem. If you do not understand it.... that does not make it dumb.
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It cant be due to bad mouthing IN the game as most dont stay long enough to learn to TUNE to 200 and see the worst of it.
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When you criticize the game in game who is that helpful information directed at? And how is it helping?
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Was I rude? Yep!
But you know what I find the glib comments like 'did you change sides' or ' ENY never affects me' equally rude and that is why I reacted as I did.
We have been telling you for a long time that as numbers decrease ENY and side switch times combined with large maps and 3 side system that almost always sees one side left out of the fight is a real issue.
If the game mechanics are frustrating your long term players and causing them to log out then maybe there is actually a problem!
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I told you a fact. If you do not like facts.... that is your problem. If you do not understand it.... that does not make it dumb.
It may be a "fact" for you but the other 100 players seem to have an issue with ENY and so log off or unsubscribe. This game cant survive on individuals players being happy, it needs large groups of players happy, logging in, and playing the game. That is what makes your statement dumb. Always looking out for yourself isnt the best plan.
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If the game mechanics are frustrating your long term players and causing them to log out then maybe there is actually a problem!
Who is this mythical person who says there isn't a problem?
The issue is what to do. Any idiot can complain.
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Who is this mythical person who says there isn't a problem?
The issue is what to do. Any idiot can complain.
People have been posting suggestions for years and nothing is done. Im wondering is HTC just going to let it run out, or are they going to fight to get back in the game?
They held the top for "Simulated games" for years, but now they dont even show up on Google. Whats the plan? I heard DCS has a sale going this weekend, should I start learning how to fly there?
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Was I rude? Yep!
But you know what I find the glib comments like 'did you change sides' or ' ENY never affects me' equally rude and that is why I reacted as I did.
We have been telling you for a long time that as numbers decrease ENY and side switch times combined with large maps and 3 side system that almost always sees one side left out of the fight is a real issue.
If the game mechanics are frustrating your long term players and causing them to log out then maybe there is actually a problem!
+1000000000000
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Who is this mythical person who says there isn't a problem?
The issue is what to do. Any idiot can complain.
The OP already suggested one thing that needs to be done. Dozens of us have offered other ideas to make things better.
Nothing changes. Past becomes prologue.
Look, I love this game as much as anyone (and have backed that up with countless hours spent creating and updating skins for the Mustang), but whistling past the graveyard is not a strategy.
(https://media.giphy.com/media/joV1k1sNOT5xC/giphy.gif)
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I remember something... :old:
Once upon a time, ENY did often not kick in in the Early War arena because of overall low numbers. Players were less willing to stick around for a 2 vs 10 when those 10 all still could field the top plane of choice (Hurri II). In the end, the minimum population requirement for ENY to kick in was lowered.
I was under the impression that the ENY setting applied to all MA arenas: Early War, Mid War and Late War Melee Arenas... back then when it was setup during that period.... was that last couple of years of AH or during early years of AHII?
and I didn't know that it had been done away with or whatever
thanks for remembering Snailman, I thought that I remembered as well, LOL
TC
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I told you a fact. If you do not like facts.... that is your problem. If you do not understand it.... that does not make it dumb.
shuffler when you have 18 players in an arena, we shouldnt have eny. you can say switch and it will fix it, but switch to what. I was flying with friends and if I was to switch or ask others to switch then we still would have eny. me I play this game because I like the p51, not because of low eny but because I grew up hearing stories about the p51. that's my favorite ride. I have flown others zero's spits, nikis and used to be pretty good in them. but when I up in my p51 with the red tails skins, I get this feeling that this is the ride I was mean to be in.
I understand when we have 70 or 80 players, even 50 but at 18? come on.
semp
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Who is this mythical person who says there isn't a problem?
The issue is what to do. Any idiot can complain.
Yep, as already mentioned in this thread, there have been many suggestions made over the years. Here are a few for you to pour your usual scorn over:
- No ENY Ever
- No ENY when population drops below a threshold
- Base ENY only on those in flight to eliminate the effect of tower sitters. Apply a 10 minute moving average to ensure only those who are truly AFK are excluded from the equation
- Separate plane ENY from GV ENY. Don't penalise the 2 guys trying to fight in the air because 15 others are in tanks
- Allow ENY restricted planes to be flown by paying a perk price. Hell may as well find some way to use perks
- Drop side switch time to 1 hour to counter the effect of changing sides to then find the fight dries up and you are back to square 1
- Allow switching to the low number side at any time
See FLS us idiots have been suggesting ideas for a long long time however we appear to come up against an immovable force and eventually we just start to give up and 1 by 1 we fade away.
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Well that's my point. You guys have been suggesting stuff for years and complaining you didn't get your way. That's fine.
Then you say nothing changes and nothing is ever done. That's a blatant lie.
The game has been updating and changing since it started.
I'm not impressed with the ideas or the behavior.
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shuffler when you have 18 players in an arena, we shouldnt have eny. you can say switch and it will fix it, but switch to what. I was flying with friends and if I was to switch or ask others to switch then we still would have eny. me I play this game because I like the p51, not because of low eny but because I grew up hearing stories about the p51. that's my favorite ride. I have flown others zero's spits, nikis and used to be pretty good in them. but when I up in my p51 with the red tails skins, I get this feeling that this is the ride I was mean to be in.
I understand when we have 70 or 80 players, even 50 but at 18? come on.
semp
Too bad for the Germans they didn't have ENY.
(https://bbs.hitechcreations.com/skins/stream.php?floc=1&sfile=fullsizeimg.jpg&stype=1&pindex=p51d_3)
https://bbs.hitechcreations.com/skins/index.php?skobj=p51d&display=P51D1092105&skinname=332FG/100FS%20by%20Vraciu
Look out, here he comes!
I agree with your sentiments. I also like the Mustang. Flying in Spitfires feels like cheating. If I could ever get to the level of someone like BigR in a P-51 then maybe I wouldn't feel as compelled to fly it. When it's not available my interest wanes. I like the challenge.
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Too bad for the Germans they didn't have ENY.
:rofl
(https://www.mediafire.com/convkey/8694/cb1d5qam3enmnj26g.jpg) (http://www.mediafire.com/view/?cb1d5qam3enmnj2)
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shuffler when you have 18 players in an arena, we shouldnt have eny. you can say switch and it will fix it, but switch to what. I was flying with friends and if I was to switch or ask others to switch then we still would have eny. me I play this game because I like the p51, not because of low eny but because I grew up hearing stories about the p51. that's my favorite ride. I have flown others zero's spits, nikis and used to be pretty good in them. but when I up in my p51 with the red tails skins, I get this feeling that this is the ride I was mean to be in.
I understand when we have 70 or 80 players, even 50 but at 18? come on.
semp
Even with low numbers it seems it is needed. The problem is with such low numbers it is kind of like driving push pins with a hammer.
Not sure if some sort of flow with the plane eny could be adjusted when numbers drop to a certain point. How hard that would be to code and how exactly to implement.
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Even with low numbers it seems it is needed. The problem is with such low numbers it is kind of like driving push pins with a hammer.
Not sure if some sort of flow with the plane eny could be adjusted when numbers drop to a certain point. How hard that would be to code and how exactly to implement.
With low numbers it only drives them lower. I would not even enable it until you reach 75+.
I've said it a million times. I love hordes. Gives me lots of people to shoot down. A horde without ENY than an empty arena with it.
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Well that's my point. You guys have been suggesting stuff for years and complaining you didn't get your way. That's fine.
Then you say nothing changes and nothing is ever done. That's a blatant lie.
The game has been updating and changing since it started.
There is no blatant lie here at all. The discussion is about ENY. The fact that updates and changes to other aspects of the game have occurred is irrelevant to this discussion.
I'm not impressed with the ideas or the behavior.
As expected. Your forum posts are littered with such comments. No content, no substance just the usual dismissive few words.
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If you mean ENY hasn't changed lately that's true. That's because it's working like it's supposed to.
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If you mean ENY hasn't changed lately that's true. That's because it's working like it's supposed to.
Yep. It’s making people log off. That’s one of its stated purposes. (And in that regard it is working like a charm.) :aok
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I believe the reason is that it's worse without it.
The MA allows people to not be fun to play with, within broad limits.
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I believe the reason is that it's worse without it.
The MA allows people to not be fun to play with, within broad limits.
When you have only 30 people it is not fun to play by default. The ENY Monster is a driver of that dynamic.
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Hey we're disagreeing again. :D
Thirty people can have fun but it's up to them.
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Hey we're disagreeing again. :D
Thirty people can have fun but it's up to them.
Boring holes in an empty sky with ENY limiting your rides may be someone’s idea of fun, but it sure ain’t mine.
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Well if it's about your score you're out of luck.
If you want to have fun there are other arenas, just ask another unhappy can't find a fighter to join you.
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Well if it's about your score you're out of luck.
If you want to have fun there are other arenas, just ask another unhappy can't find a fighter to join you.
Why do you think all we care about is score? Projecting? You're a majority of one either way.
The other arenas are emptier than the MA. So let's try again.
Keep burying your head in the sand. If you don't look at the bear he can't eat you.
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Yep. It’s making people log off. That’s one of its stated purposes. (And in that regard it is working like a charm.) :aok
Please show were one of ENY's stated purposes is to cause players to log off. I've never recalled HiTech saying such a thing.
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Please show were one of ENY's stated purposes is to cause players to log off. I've never recalled HiTech saying such a thing.
He did. I've quoted/linked to the comment multiple times. I don't really feel like searching for it again. Maybe someone else will dig it up.
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Please show were one of ENY's stated purposes is to cause players to log off. I've never recalled HiTech saying such a thing.
Parse away.
https://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,383603.msg5115414.html#msg5115414
Eny was designed to balance game play do to an imbalance a different number of players on each side.
It does this
1. By creating an incentive for players to change sides
2. By giving an advantage to the country with less players.
Has I consequence some players may also log off which also helps the issue of side balance, as compared to pre ENY when players would log off do to side imbalance it made the problem worse.
HiTech
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That is not a stated purpose. That is a consequence in some cases.
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Why do you think all we care about is score? Projecting? You're a majority of one either way.
The other arenas are emptier than the MA. So let's try again.
Keep burying your head in the sand. If you don't look at the bear he can't eat you.
I never said anyone cared about score. I made a conditional statement.
Do you suppose I suggested inviting someone to go with you because the other arenas are often empty? :D
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That is not a stated purpose. That is a consequence in some cases.
Like I said, parse away. :rofl
I don't care how you categorize it, it's bad. And perfectly acceptable apparently.
You call it a side effect, he calls it a mechanism for balancing. “[It does this, this, and] ‘also’ [this].”
con·se·quence
/ˈkänsikwəns/
noun
1.
a result or effect of an action or condition.
Action = Result
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I never said anyone cared about score. I made a conditional statement.
To drill into your comment further, if you’re looking for a fight you’re also out of luck. Your conditional statement was accusatory—and incomplete.
Do you suppose I suggested inviting someone to go with you because the other arenas are often empty? :D
Do you suppose nobody has tried that yet? A hundred times?
If I found inviting someone to an empty arena fun (it's not) then we wouldn't be having this discussion. It's superfluous, to boot.
I say this without malice: You are seen here for what you are and it's not helping. So, you can keep that up if you wish. Just be sure to turn off the lights before you leave.
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Like I said, parse away. :rofl
I don't care how you categorize it, it's bad. And perfectly acceptable apparently.
You call it a side effect, he calls it a mechanism for balancing. “[It does this, this, and] ‘also’ [this].”
con·se·quence
/ˈkänsikwəns/
noun
1.
a result or effect of an action or condition.
Action = Result
I read Hi-Tech's whole post past just the bold. Seems he said it was the lesser of two evils. He said before eny people logged off because of side imbalance, making it worse.
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I read Hi-Tech's whole post past just the bold. Seems he said it was the lesser of two evils. He said before eny people logged off because of side imbalance, making it worse.
Back when you had 150 players that may have been so, but we are well within the “region of reversed command” on it now...
Hell, based on this thread alone you’ve eleven people who have posted. Of the seven discussing ENY directly four of us are saying we log off because of ENY not due to being outnumbered.
It’s time to tweak this a bit. Lusche made an interesting comment.
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Like I said, parse away. :rofl
I don't care how you categorize it, it's bad. And perfectly acceptable apparently.
You call it a side effect, he calls it a mechanism for balancing. “[It does this, this, and] ‘also’ [this].”
con·se·quence
/ˈkänsikwəns/
noun
1.
a result or effect of an action or condition.
Action = Result
You need to brush up on your reading comprehension. In that quote, HiTech never said the stated purpose of ENY was to get people to log off. He did admit that it was a consequence of ENY that some will log off but clearly the stated purposes were to 1) get players to switch sides and 2) give an advantage to the out numbered side(s).
There is no need to misrepresent what HiTech said to try and make a point.
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As this discussion develops a few things become obvious.
FLS, you are not debating the topic, you are just throwing comments and avoiding actually coming up with either an argument or a rebuttal. Your input is IMO not really valid.
On to the substance of the discussion.
I understand the history behind ENY. I am not sure how the data presented itself to determine that enough players were leaving to make ENY the better of 2 evils but for the sake of argument let’s accept it as fact.
Do the conditions that existed then exist now? Given the reduction in active players is there a case to revisit the question and consider some alternatives?
From an holistic view, I think it would be better to explore how to INCLUDE players rather than EXCLUDE them.
Making a decision to make less people leave is surely not the way to go. How about we try to find a way to make people stay!
No other game I play takes stuff away. It makes me earn stuff but never says “yeah mate, I know 10 minutes ago you had that but yeah nah you cannot have that now. Why not come back later just in case you can have it then?”
For me the obvious #1 easy fix is to have no side switch timer when moving to the low population side. The stated aim was “to create an incentive for players to change sides”. Then locking them in to that side is working against the first directive because they often the dynamic changes and they are stuck without a fight.
Of course, that can happen at any time but what is the harm in allowing a free change to the low side?
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The side switch timer could use some looking at. Where I used to switch sides quite a bit, I rarely even look at numbers now. The timer slowed my switching and then stopped it almost entirely.
I do however understand where there were those few that were abusing it at times.
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To drill into your comment further, if you’re looking for a fight you’re also out of luck. Your conditional statement was accusatory—and incomplete.
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Now who's projecting? I simply said people who don't care about score can fight in another arena.
It's a real stretch to make that an accusation, maybe that was the incomplete part that required your imagination for assistance.
As this discussion develops a few things become obvious.
FLS, you are not debating the topic, you are just throwing comments and avoiding actually coming up with either an argument or a rebuttal. Your input is IMO not really valid.
And here is Fess deciding that someone who disagrees with him does not have any valid input. What a curious argument.
So you keep posting the same complaint hoping for a different result. How's that working for you?
I'm confident of my arguments and rebuttals despite your inability to perceive them.
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You need to brush up on your reading comprehension. In that quote, HiTech never said the stated purpose of ENY was to get people to log off. He did admit that it was a consequence of ENY that some will log off but clearly the stated purposes were to 1) get players to switch sides and 2) give an advantage to the out numbered side(s).
There is no need to misrepresent what HiTech said to try and make a point.
I can read quite well, thanks.
ALSO means in addition to.
Consequences are results.
Thus one of the three listed and acceptable RESULTS/CONSEQUENCES of ENY is to cause people to log off.
The PURPOSE is side balancing. One of the ways this is done, supposedly, is by people logging off.
Expressly and clearly stated.
Eny was designed to balance game play...
It does this
1. By creating an incentive for players to change sides
2. By giving an advantage to the country with less players.
[ 3. ] [ S ]ome players may also log off which also helps the issue of side balance...
...
HiTech
1 - Encourage side change.
2 - Give advantage.
3 - Cause log off.
The third option seems to be winning out over option one. It looks like it is time to rebalance rebalancing.
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Now who's projecting? I simply said people who don't care about score can fight in another arena.
NO. They CAN'T. Unless tangling with B-17s that pull 12 Gs is considered fighting.
It's a real stretch to make that an accusation, maybe that was the incomplete part that required your imagination for assistance.
I'll let Fess' assessment of your commentary speak for me here.
And here is Fess deciding that someone who disagrees with him does not have any valid input. What a curious argument.
So you keep posting the same complaint hoping for a different result. How's that working for you?
It's not working one bit, as the numbers continue to show, but he's trying to get the message across any way. That's better than pretending everything is grand.
I'm confident of my arguments and rebuttals despite your inability to perceive them.
To steal from Reagan, the problem with some people is they know so much that isn't so. Your arguments are being proven wrong day after day after day. Numbers don't lie.
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NO. They CAN'T. Unless tangling with B-17s that pull 12 Gs is considered fighting...
Is that the alternative I suggested? You are sloppy and dishonest. Match play against AI is one of the other arenas but it's not your only choice is it?
As I keep pointing out, nobody is pretending everything is fine. That's just dishonest BS.
I'm sure Fess's opinion gets the regard it deserves, same as yours. :cheers:
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Is that the alternative I suggested? You are sloppy and dishonest. Match play against AI is one of the other arenas but it's not your only choice is it?
As I keep pointing out, nobody is pretending everything is fine. That's just dishonest BS.
I'm sure Fess's opinion gets the regard it deserves, same as yours. :cheers:
Thanks for reminding me why I had you on ignore.
Going from one lowly populated arena to an empty one with a tag along is REDUNDANT. Hello? Hello?
It's also not something that requires a subscription. Like it or not people pay to play in the Melee Arena and the incentive for doing so diminishes with every frustrated subscriber who leaves for good. Your parroting of YOU CAN HAVE FUN IN OTHER ARENAS is quite true, just not in the way YOU think. Those arenas appear to be in other games in the opinions of many.
Moving from no fun to no fun is an exercise in futility. It is not a solution. Open your eyes.
Fess is right. I am right. You are not.
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I can read quite well, thanks.
ALSO means in addition to.
Consequences are results.
Thus one of the three listed and acceptable RESULTS/CONSEQUENCES of ENY is to cause people to log off.
The PURPOSE is side balancing. One of the ways this is done, supposedly, is by people logging off.
Expressly and clearly stated.
1 - Encourage side change.
2 - Give advantage.
3 - Cause log off.
The third option seems to be winning out over option one. It looks like it is time to rebalance rebalancing.
Keep twisting and misrepresenting what HiTech had stated to fit your agenda. He never said that the stated purpose of ENY was to get players to log off.
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Keep twisting and misrepresenting what HiTech had stated to fit your agenda. He never said that the stated purpose of ENY was to get players to log off.
Correct. The PURPOSE is side balance. The mechanism is ENY. He listed logging off as the THIRD RESULT, not THE ONLY result, which I made plain from the get go when I said ONE OF THE.
In a way it's more like the second result that the player can initiate. Advantage is not directly in control of the player.
Thus the player can switch sides or log off.
Parse away boys. He said what he said. If he didn't mean that he would have corrected me when I quoted it to him the three times I did it before quoting it here. He can always clarify.
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Going from one lowly populated arena to an empty one with a tag along is REDUNDANT. Hello? Hello?
It's also not something that requires a subscription. Like it or not people pay to play in the Melee Arena and the incentive for doing so diminishes with every frustrated subscriber who leaves for good. Your parroting of YOU CAN HAVE FUN IN OTHER ARENAS is quite true, just not in the way YOU think. Those arenas appear to be in other games in the opinions of many.
Moving from no fun to no fun is an exercise in futility. It is not a solution. Open your eyes.
Fess is right. I am right. You are not.
OK, you can't have fun dueling another person 1v1. Noted.
So I'm wrong about some people being able to have fun together.
And the CAPITOLS don't indicate anything in particular. :rofl
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OK, you can't have fun dueling another person 1v1. Noted.
So I'm wrong about some people being able to have fun together.
And the CAPITOLS don't indicate anything in particular. :rofl
Been there. Done that. Bored with it. And it's not like everyone is chomping at the bit to go to Dueling which has a host of issues that make it less than ideal. Nevermind that you're siphoning off players from Melee which only makes it emptier.
Some people enjoy staring at the sun, but I doubt you can get enough of them to pay you for the privilege to make it a viable business.
You mean CAPITALS but any way. They indicate PLENTY to those with proper reading skills. :aok I'll let you determine if that includes you. I make no judgments. :devil
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Correct. The PURPOSE is side balance. The mechanism is ENY. He listed logging off as the THIRD RESULT, not THE ONLY result, which I made plain from the get go when I said ONE OF THE.
In a way it's more like the second result that the player can initiate. Advantage is not directly in control of the player.
Thus the player can switch sides or log off.
Parse away boys. He said what he said. If he didn't mean that he would have corrected me when I quoted it to him the three times I did it before quoting it here. He can always clarify.
Looks like you left out a few words that change the meaning of Hitech's quote. He said the consequence of people logging off because of ENY is not worse than the people logging off because of unequal sides.
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Looks like you left out a few words that change the meaning of Hitech's quote. He said the consequence of people logging off because of ENY is not worse than the people logging off because of unequal sides.
I've already addressed that and argued it to be false in the current climate. Indeed, it hasn't been like that for years.
It is also undisputed that one DESIRED RESULT of ENY is for players to log off. It's working like a charm in that regard, as I also stated previously.
You get balance two ways: people switch or people log off. People sure aren't logging over hordes--because we don't have any with 27 players online. But they are logging out because of ENY under those same circumstances.
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... Nevermind that you're siphoning off players from Melee which only makes it emptier.
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Siphoning from the high number side and decreasing ENY like it's designed to. Good point. :aok
Yes you argue that it only works with higher numbers. HiTech disagrees.
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Siphoning from the high number side and decreasing ENY like it's designed to. Good point. :aok
Who says the only people leaving are from the high side. That's a leap. :aok :aok :aok
But regardless, now you admit logging off is an intended result, exactly as I stated. :aok :aok :aok
Yes you argue that it only works with higher numbers. HiTech disagrees.
Hitech can think what he wants. If that's his position I respectfully suggest he's wrong. His customers are making that pretty clear.
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Who says the only people leaving are from the high side. That's a leap. :aok :aok :aok
But regardless, now you admit logging off is an intended result, exactly as I stated. :aok :aok :aok
Hitech can think what he wants. If that's his position I respectfully suggest he's wrong. His customers are making that pretty clear.
Are people complaining about ENY because the other side has it? Seriously?
I would never say that consequences equals intended results. It's clear that consequences equals results and "intended' is just you editorializing and pretending that unintended consequences for a best case scenario is not a real thing.
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Are people complaining about ENY because the other side has it? Seriously?
I would never say that consequences equals intended results. It's clear that consequences equals results and "intended' is just you editorializing and pretending that unintended consequences for a best case scenario is not a real thing.
I complain about it because it means my targets log off. That's no fun.
The intended results are side balance through switching or log offs. When we had 270 players a log off wasn't fatal. With 27 players it pretty much is, as the OP tried to explain.
Doesn't matter. You win by default because it won't be changed. Enjoy your Pyrrhic Victory, bruh.
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I don't duel on the forum. I just explain things to people. That's one of our differences.
If you're bored with the game you should do something else that's fun. :aok
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I don't duel on the forum. I just explain things to people. That's one of our differences.
If you're bored with the game you should do something else that's fun. :aok
You explain a view that doesn't correlate with reality. I deal in reality. I explain things as they ARE not as I PREFER them to be. That's one of our differences.
I already do multiple other things that are fun. Brilliant advice. I am certain it is most helpful in attracting players to Aces High. Hitech should thank you.
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I would like for everyone posting in this thread, to go back and look at what Lusche and I have posted!
And if it has been done away with, then everyone should be requesting/wishing HTC to reinstate it
Hope this helps
TC
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TC I think HiTech is aware of what goes on in the MA and what is best for it. :aok
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TC I think HiTech is aware of what goes on in the MA and what is best for it. :aok
I know this for a fact, been receiving warnings for200 chat at weird hours of the night.
Semp
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TC I think HiTech is aware of what goes on in the MA and what is best for it. :aok
No doubt, FLS....
Is why I replied with my last post "request/wish for HTC to reinstate the "eny is off if numbers drop below a certain #" like we used to have....
This is the wish list forum, I thought....
All I've seen posted lately is a bunch of back and forth of people arguing over how they are viewing the matter
I was trying to get the topic back on track.....
YMMV
Cheers
TC
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The wish was made in the first post. I doubt anything that follows makes a difference.
The discussion of HiTech's actual comment is not off topic.
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The wish was made in the first post. I doubt anything that follows makes a difference.
The discussion of HiTech's actual comment is not off topic.
Well... I do know this as fact, that Dale usually likes to see more than just a single post requesting/wishing for something to be adjusted....usually he wants to see a concerted effort of the playerbase asking for a wish/request
I'm not discussing HiTech's 2017 comment that has been quoted in this thread, because it is not really relevant to this thread 2+ years later and he was simply explaining why it was created to start with....
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I don't think this is the same as which new aircraft should be next for example. I'm inclined to think this is more like people asking for things that suit them but hurt the game. HiTech may decide to make changes but like I said, I believe HiTech knows better than Vraciu and Fess.
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I don't think this is the same as which new aircraft should be next for example. I'm inclined to think this is more like people asking for things that suit them but hurt the game. HiTech may decide to make changes but like I said, I believe HiTech knows better than Vraciu and Fess.
You can believe in Santa if you like. Rational people will know the truth.
Hurting the game? So you think the current state of affairs is HELPING? :rofl :aok
You can disagree with us all you like about our suggestions but one thing is certain, the status quo is untenable.
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I know this for a fact, been receiving warnings for200 chat at weird hours of the night.
Semp
:rofl That's funny right there.
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You can believe in Santa if you like. Rational people will know the truth.
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Quite a few rational people have seen Santa in Aces High. They have pictures.
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Quite a few rational people have seen Santa in Aces High. They have pictures.
That's a good point. I shot the heck out of him one year. Lit him up from that red nose to the sleigh tail. He crashed into the runway and I blew up. :rofl
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Now you know why ENY isn't changing.... :bolt:
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Now you know why ENY isn't changing.... :bolt:
:rofl
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That's a good point. I shot the heck out of him one year. Lit him up from that red nose to the sleigh tail. He crashed into the runway and I blew up. :rofl
My, but you're amazing.
Coogan
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My, but you're amazing.
Coogan
That's what she said.
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I complain about it because it means my targets log off. That's no fun.
Bull, You complain because you do not like how it effects the way you wish to fly.
You also fail to take into account that more targets would log off if ENY did not exist. How do I know this, because I saw the consequence of not having ENY. You guys are whispering compared to the grumbling that was happening before side balancing was implemented.
P.S.
Knock off trying to put words in my moth.
HiTech
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HiTech - i wish for the opposite...increase ENY effects (scale them up or however the algorithm works) and encourage side balancing by always allowing people to go to the low sided country.
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HiTech - i wish for the opposite...increase ENY effects (scale them up or however the algorithm works) and encourage side balancing by always allowing people to go to the low sided country.
Can people ever switch to the high side?
If they can what is to prevent someone from switch to the high side to find some one, then instantly going back to the low side?
HiTech
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Most players learn to accept the collision model as the best imperfect solution to the issue. ENY is also a best imperfect solution except it deals with human nature instead of travel time on the internet.
A better solution to both would be great, but what we usually see is people not fully understanding the issue and just wanting it turned off or somehow adjusted to affect them less or affect someone else more.
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Bull, You complain because you do not like how it effects the way you wish to fly.
I complain BOTH ways. When it hits me I can't fly my ride.
When it hits them they leave.
Neither is ideal.
You also fail to take into account that more targets would log off if ENY did not exist. How do I know this, because I saw the consequence of not having ENY. You guys are whispering compared to the grumbling that was happening before side balancing was implemented.
You seriously believe you'll have even more log off than in the scenario the OP posted? I find that hard to fathom.
P.S.
Knock off trying to put words in my moth.
HiTech
I didn't. I quoted you directly. If that's not your intent then that's fine, but it's what you wrote--and is precisely what is happening in the OP's scenario. When you have 20 players and people login, see ENY, and leave, that helps no one.
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You seriously believe you'll have even more log off than in the scenario the OP posted? I find that hard to fathom.
You really need to fathom harder.
HiTech
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... I didn't. I quoted you directly. ...
You stated that a consequence was an intentional feature. You edited the quote where it was clearly an unintended consequence that still had some benefit for the issue of imbalance.
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You stated that a consequence was an intentional feature. You edited the quote where it was clearly an unintended consequence that still had some benefit for the issue of imbalance.
No. I showed the two ways that ENY balances numbers based on his very words.
1) Switching Sides
2) Logging Off
This is simply not disputable.
If it's not intentional then change it.
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You really need to fathom harder.
HiTech
Perhaps you do, too, and here's why. What you have in the arena during the scenario posted are the most loyal players left. There are four in this thread alone.
The old Morning Crew used to be highly active. I've seen ENY run them almost entirely off one by one by one, myself included. Things have changed.
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If it's not intentional then change it.
You still miss the point. I'll assume that's on purpose since the concept is simple enough.
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You still miss the point. I'll assume that's on purpose since the concept is simple enough.
The point is clear. Balance. It is allegedly achieved one of two ways. Side switch. Log off. As has been pointed out by multiple people in this thread, with low numbers you're getting only the latter. That's the way it is currently.
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The point is clear. Balance. It is allegedly achieved one of two ways. Side switch. Log off. As has been pointed out by multiple people in this thread, with low numbers you're getting only the latter. That's the way it is currently.
The point I was referring to is that the best solutions can still have negative consequences. Balance is unlikely, reducing imbalance is the intent. Logging off is a negative consequence that helps balance but it's not ideal, it's just better than greater imbalance or increased log offs.
You may have a different opinion. :aok
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With today's average prime time window in the MA being about 2 hours. Side switching once every 60 minutes might alleviate some of this as long as 120+- is the average large number of players on a good night. Off peak with lower than 70 players, since Hitech wants ENY in place 24x7, a 1 hour switch is about equal to the current 6 hour switch where finding activity is concerned. Shorter switching times were showcased in the AvA to end up with one side hoarding the other side due to computer gamer human nature. And would be the norm in the MA if it were reduced to two sides.
Three sides is pretty healthy for conflict. Planetside has upwards of 3000 players on during prime time and waiting queues to get into one of it's three factions for the 24x7 slaughter fest. There you are forced to create a new character for each country and start it out from scratch with nothing and grind it back up to uberdom or drop a credit card. The capture the flag\territory aspect of AH works better with three countries. Two countries and Hitech would have to force side balancing breaking up squads and friendships which is the core of why AH kept subscriptions all this time and it's doors open. Most people playing this game are not here to be fighter jocks. They are here for the overall game while playing it with their friends. Fighter jocks are a tiny and very loud minority of Hitech's "customers".
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The point I was referring to is that the best solutions can still have negative consequences. Balance is unlikely, reducing imbalance is the intent. Logging off is a negative consequence that helps balance but it's not ideal, it's just better than greater imbalance or increased log offs.
You may have a different opinion. :aok
I don't ENTIRELY disagree. Only partially within a narrow window.
I also advocate a reduced side switch window as Bustr mentions above. That seems unlikely to change, either, however, so all this is moot. It's Dale's business. He calls the shots for good and bad.
And Bustr, we are ALL a tiny minority by default lately. You people ran off nearly all the fighter guys you deride in every post. How's that working out for you? You having fun with more bases than players spread three ways on giant maps? I contend YOU are the minority here--or a majority of one or two.
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The point is clear. Balance. It is allegedly achieved one of two ways. Side switch. Log off. As has been pointed out by multiple people in this thread, with low numbers you're getting only the latter. That's the way it is currently.
First your leaving out balance of game play via lesser / better planes.
And exactly how is balance going to be achieved with out ENY, you seem to think it will just magically happen. But if that were true then ENY would never be an issue.
Or possibly you believe that forcing people to have lesser planes is worse then being out numbered. Because that is all the ENY does. It is simply a trade off between having numbers or better planes or choose a different side.
But you complete ignore the fact that being overwhelmed and out number is not fun. People will log then also, but that only makes the imbalance worse and hence the problem worse . Or the player changes sides and again the problem becomes worse.
You stated that It’s making people log off. That’s one of its stated purposes
That is absolutely not it's purpose, in fact it's purpose is just the opposite,to keep more people playing.
And to state that it is it's purpose is putting words in my mouth.
Purpose implies intent per Webster "something set up as an object or end to be attained". Side effects are different then purposes. Or do you think dry mouth is the purpose of decongestants.
HiTech
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Bustr ran off the fighter guys? How powerful he has become. :D
The urge to dominate the arena with a crack squad of top fighters appeals to a lot of people.
Unless you have similar squads on all three sides the crack squad kills the fights by easily killing all the other fighters.
That's great when you want to end the war and go home. In a game where people are not compelled to play with you the enemy has to have fun too.
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Bull, You complain because you do not like how it effects the way you wish to fly.
I accept that. I would prefer finding ways to include everyone rather than a mechanism which seeks to exclude.
You also fail to take into account that more targets would log off if ENY did not exist. How do I know this, because I saw the consequence of not having ENY.
My contention is that the conditions which existed then do not exist to the same extent now and therefore asking for an amendment to the mechanism of ENY is perfectly normal.
You guys are whispering compared to the grumbling that was happening before side balancing was implemented.
Perhaps it sounds like a whisper to you but to us it is just as loud as it was for those complaining back then. If you are making a correlation between the volume of complaints then and now you really need to look at the number of active participants both in game and on the BBS.
Fewer complaining now is simply a reflection of numbers.
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I accept that. I would prefer finding ways to include everyone rather than a mechanism which seeks to exclude.
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It's a mechanism that seeks to balance, as was clearly stated many times, it's the least damaging solution so far.
Everybody would prefer a better solution. No need to proclaim what is obvious.
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Thanks for a real reply.
I accept that. I would prefer finding ways to include everyone rather than a mechanism which seeks to exclude.
Mine also. If you come up with a different proposal that I believe would work i'm all ears.
My contention is that the conditions which existed then do not exist to the same extent now and therefore asking for an amendment to the mechanism of ENY is perfectly normal.
What exactly do you believe is different now verses when it was implemented? ENY was implemented long before HTC had a growth spurt. If my memory is correct we had about the same numbers as now when it was written.
Perhaps it sounds like a whisper to you but to us it is just as loud as it was for those complaining back then. If you are making a correlation between the volume of complaints then and now you really need to look at the number of active participants both in game and on the BBS.
Fewer complaining now is simply a reflection of numbers.
Again see above.
Do some searches back in the summer of 2004. BTW ENY was suggested by players as a way to deal with the imbalance. My first attempt was forced queuing to enter flight. And we also had tried perk rewards only which had no measurable effect.
HiTech
HiTech
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Many people hate ENY (I know that I do) but it is something that needs to be there. Unless we can come up with something that works better, or that people hate less, we are stuck with ENY.
And the argument that "things are different now" doesn't work because the conditions that triggered the need have not changed.
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First your leaving out balance of game play via lesser / better planes.
And exactly how is balance going to be achieved with out ENY, you seem to think it will just magically happen. But if that were true then ENY would never be an issue.
Or possibly you believe that forcing people to have lesser planes is worse then being out numbered. Because that is all the ENY does. It is simply a trade off between having numbers or better planes or choose a different side.
But you complete ignore the fact that being overwhelmed and out number is not fun. People will log then also, but that only makes the imbalance worse and hence the problem worse . Or the player changes sides and again the problem becomes worse.
You stated that That is absolutely not it's purpose, in fact it's purpose is just the opposite,to keep more people playing.
And to state that it is it's purpose is putting words in my mouth.
Purpose implies intent per Webster "something set up as an object or end to be attained". Side effects are different then purposes. Or do you think dry mouth is the purpose of decongestants.
HiTech
Please explain to me how anyone is overwhelmed with only twenty total players online split three ways?
I'll gladly be the one against 19 with ZERO ENY. Even in that case I'll be lucky to find three people flying.
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See rule #4
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See rule #4
HiTech
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Could we just for the sake of experimentation try turning it off awhile to see what happens? If all else fails you can turn it right back on right?
Thanks
Dougie
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Problem with that is the fallout if it's a disaster.
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so, just spit balling here.
Has eny been adjusted to be irrelevant until all three sides have X amount of people in the air?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Can people ever switch to the high side?
If they can what is to prevent someone from switch to the high side to find some one, then instantly going back to the low side?
HiTech
Yeah I guess it could be abused. Maybe a reduced time requirement when going to the low side? 30 min instead of the current one? And 3 hrs to switch back to the high side. Or the option to change to the 3rd country with no time limit requirement?
Just brainstorming. I've definitely switched to an outnumbered country for a better fight only for a map to get reset which then changed to being "stuck" on the numerically superior team.
Atlau
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How about peeking the planes instead of limiting them?
It is statistically proven that perked planes have less usage.
In the late night, it's always the team that has no fights with the lowest #s. People don't switch there because there are no fights. The question is, how to create fights on all sides so the #s remain balanced?
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Idiot! I changed sides but nothing to see so I tried my second account well I guessed wrong so I created a 3rd account...yep finally a fight. How about you actually try the game instead of jerk off on the forum
We have a winner folks! MULTIPLE ACCOUNTS!! This is a genius solution to many things not just concerning 'ENY'. Well, Minus the inappropriate comment about the forum part.
As stated, Obviously this not only solves 'finding a fight' … just imagine if those second or third accounts were logged on to the 'side' with fewer numbers, balance could be achieved, and thus no 'ENY'! Also no need to switch sides since you could be on all three at same time!
And if a player is having trouble finding someone as good as they are to fight, they can go 1V1 (better yet) 2v1 against their other account game id.... Plus imagine the time saved since no need to hunt around or call out said player on CH.200 to meet up somewhere for that.
A further caveat would be that the number of players online in the arena increases exponentially (low numbers argument eliminated). It would entice those that normally do not log on if number is low.
The complaint of a "tower sitting or AFK for hours" player would be moot along with accusations of "spying".
Multiple accounts increases the profits of HTC therefore many of the things that are wished for or wanted by very stalwart players could be afforded and implemented in game while reversing a decline in sub
I'm sure many others can think of instances of grievance that can be eliminated or created by having multiple accounts, so I digress.
Now I know that some may have looked upon those having multiple accounts as being used for nefarious reasons...but as it was stated by the poster, they are merely used to 'find a fight'.. yet Upon reading that I realized there was a gem hiding within.
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Thanks wardog19, what did you think about the ideas of how to modify ENY?
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This comment may get a ton of flak, more than likely from the ones who fall into one of the categories I highlight below.
However, The ENY issue has a very simple solution, just institute an inactivity kick! No movement for 15 minutes (example) and you are booted. Quite common in MMO games. That clears the tower of the players who use a second account (some have admitted to having a second account in this thread) to spy or to raise the eny and also the ones who wait for the win in absentia.
As to changing sides, many are loyal their country and won’t do that, I think that is called, a team player!
While we are at it, off map death would be nice to keep peope from “gaming the game”
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This comment may get a ton of flak, more than likely from the ones who fall into one of the categories I highlight below.
However, The ENY issue has a very simple solution, just institute an inactivity kick! No movement for 15 minutes (example) and you are booted. Quite common in MMO games. That clears the tower of the players who use a second account (some have admitted to having a second account in this thread) to spy or to raise the eny and also the ones who wait for the win in absentia.
As to changing sides, many are loyal their country and won’t do that, I think that is called, a team player!
While we are at it, off map death would be nice to keep peope from “gaming the game”
1. You HIGHLIGHTED nothing.
2. You're a TROLL.
Coogan
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As to changing sides, many are loyal their country and won’t do that, I think that is called, a team player!
While we are at it, off map death would be nice to keep peope from “gaming the game”
I'm a team player... just the team changes from time to time...
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I don't see any problems with FESS having multiple accounts, he don't use them to do nefarious things!
HTC keeps a close watch on the IP address and such, that there is nothing to conjure up about it or any player....
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I don't see any problems with FESS having multiple accounts, he don't use them to do nefarious things!
HTC keeps a close watch on the IP address and such, that there is nothing to conjure up about it or any player....
Thanks TC. Wardog was just trolling. I never have my accounts logged on at the same time, I simply use them to circumvent both ENY and when the side I am on is being ignored so I need to change to a side with a fight.
I pay extra for this but I accept that charge as a part of the game.
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ENY worked when there were tons of players and serves no purpose with the dwindling AH population. Perhaps another system perhaps higher perk costs or perking lower eny rides and removing ENY? But something needs to be done. When the ENY gets upwards of 16 to 18 the Pigs go play other games. That can't be good... :(
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ENY has become such a problem, in Planetside 2, I've pissed off a group of infiltrators who hide with cloaks to snipe you with the equivalent of 50 BMG with 12x scope. I'm using the equivalent of an M14 with a 6x scope, no cloak what so ever, just using real world "hide" methodology to bag them. Last night they placed a global bounty on me anyone from the 2 other countries can collect. That cost them real game cash to have it tagged onto my Icon becasue I've POed them so bad. AH like no other game teaches you incredible lead calc on the fly. A running person is nothing compared to a Yak3 with the spastic runs.
I only started playing Planetside 2 less than a month ago but, after 17 years, that is how much ENY is killing the fun of the current AH game for all of POTW since we established a POTW Outfit in PS2. I don't like FPS games but, it sucks in the MA always logging in with POTW to play the game in "garbage ride" versus "good ride" mode.
On weekends POTW ends up fighting against 2 countries each with 1000 players dedicated to killing us. Like I said, I don't like FPS games becasue they are the worst case scenario of hardware wars. He who has the biggest baddest PC and equipment usually does better than 90% of the community in the game. It forced me to get a 165hz, 1ms latency PC monitor so I could see in fights with hundreds of players. My old 60hz, 5ms monitor dropped to 4-20FPS during those gigantic fights. Now my new monitor drops 60-75 and I kill things.
Here in AH3 my FPS is 165 and I'm flying mostly garbage rides all the time becasue of ENY watching the tail end of late war rides run off into the distance for their next HO and pick run. My compliments to all the skinners, I can see their incredible skill with each Ole HO pass now.
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ENY has become such a problem, in Planetside 2, I've pissed off a group of infiltrators who hide with cloaks to snipe you with the equivalent of 50 BMG with 12x scope. I'm using the equivalent of an M14 with a 6x scope, no cloak what so ever, just using real world "hide" methodology to bag them. Last night they placed a global bounty on me anyone from the 2 other countries can collect. That cost them real game cash to have it tagged onto my Icon becasue I've POed them so bad.
...so...you're being successful with a garbage outfit against people with good outfits....? Outstanding!
- oldman
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...so...you're being successful with a garbage outfit against people with good outfits....? Outstanding!
- oldman
Me on the other hand stopped playing planet side because I couldn't compete with my garbage ride. Just no fun.
Some of the pigs have stopped playing because of eny. It's sad to see more pigs playing planet side than ah. Even pigs that haven't played ah are coming into discord.
semp
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...so...you're being successful with a garbage outfit against people with good outfits....? Outstanding!
- oldman
The important part to take away here is that he is doing it in a DIFFERENT game because of the issues here.
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There are no garbage rides, just garbage pilots.
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The important part to take away here is that he is doing it in a DIFFERENT game because of the issues here.
Yup pissing those people off so they leave that game or add something like eny.
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The important part to take away here is that he is doing it in a DIFFERENT game because of the issues here.
Even I have learned to read between Bustr's lines. This is what is important to glean from his post. The Pigs are one of the largest squads left in Aces High 3 and we are beginning to game elsewhere. This should be concerning. :uhoh
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I've always assumed I'm dealing with grown up intellegent men in this forum. So I try to respect them with intelligent and nuanced writing. Now if I'm wrong, we can get Lawndart to review my writing and post the short bus window lickers cribbed version. And the man has worn out bus windows on all 22 1\2 continents on our unkown planet.
(https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fimg0111.popscreencdn.com%2F162439306_window-licking-smiley-in-the-short-bus-round-stickers.jpg&f=1&nofb=1)
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Lawndart knows how to read????? Who knew! :devil
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Even I have learned to read between Bustr's lines. This is what is important to glean from his post. The Pigs are one of the largest squads left in Aces High 3 and we are beginning to game elsewhere. This should be concerning. :uhoh
Have you guys tried the new COD that just came out?
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The important part to take away here is that he is doing it in a DIFFERENT game because of the issues here.
Could be. What I saw in his post was his pride in winning with a handicap. That didn’t seem to fit with the ENY complaint, except that it was a different game. I’m wondering if the real problem isn’t ENY and the consequent difficulty of winning with inferior rides (even with superior numbers), or if it’s just excitement over a new game.
Many of us have been around here for a very long time, Bustr included. HTC has acknowledged the notion that people will simply get tired of a game they’ve mastered. I doubt that ENY can really be a fundamental problem for long-time players, simply because, by now, they should be good virtual pilots in nearly any plane - especially if they fly with a squad like the Pigs. So I see the ENY complaints as an excuse for boredom, not as a genuine reason to quit.
No one ever responded to Luche’s point that, even with small numbers, it’s no fun being one of two players, no matter what ride they’re in, against 10 players, who can fly whatever rides they want to fly.
- oldman
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coming from a time that has low numbers... ENY with those numbers is a little bit nuts.... there needs to be a change somewhere... to have already low numbers get lower because of ENY is counter-intuitive....just as People say they can change if they want...they can also choose to stick to a side if they want... for me it is an option to change sides.... sometimes I choose the wrong side and since I'm stuck I log anyway... but for some it is not an option they choose...so they just log....doesn't help anything when that happens and you only have a handful of players per side...
Now sure there will be those who cry about ten 51's coming to attack them ....oh they have too many on their side blah blah blah.... but those same few will cry when there is nothing to shoot at also....
the balance is most certainly a fine line...but when the difference between flying and ENY 5 and an ENY 15 comes down to a few players it gets a little restrictive... really does need a minimum numbers limit raised before kicking in.... that's just my thoughts though.... and I fly a high ENY plane which never gets restricted... other than by my lack of targets.....
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Could be. What I saw in his post was his pride in winning with a handicap. That didn’t seem to fit with the ENY complaint, except that it was a different game. I’m wondering if the real problem isn’t ENY and the consequent difficulty of winning with inferior rides (even with superior numbers), or if it’s just excitement over a new game.
Many of us have been around here for a very long time, Bustr included. HTC has acknowledged the notion that people will simply get tired of a game they’ve mastered. I doubt that ENY can really be a fundamental problem for long-time players, simply because, by now, they should be good virtual pilots in nearly any plane - especially if they fly with a squad like the Pigs. So I see the ENY complaints as an excuse for boredom, not as a genuine reason to quit.
No one ever responded to Luche’s point that, even with small numbers, it’s no fun being one of two players, no matter what ride they’re in, against 10 players, who can fly whatever rides they want to fly.
- oldman
The boredom comes from the lack of players, and players willing to fight.
I have been flying as a PIG for only a short time, but from what I have seem from flying against them and with them they just want to have fun playing the game. PERIOD. Unfortunately that fun is quickly disappearing. More guys that think running away is a good game move.... resupplying a base instead of fighting to save it is a good game move... so on and so forth. The game is suppose to be about three teams fighting it out to the end game.....win the war. With in that is suppose to be GV fights, bombing runs, fighter sweeps, furballs and so on. All of this is slowly disappearing.
The Pigs are looking for it and for many, "Planetside 2" is where they have found it. Bustr as well as a number of other Pigs, are spending more time in Planetside 2 than he does in Aces High and Bustr and maybe others in the pigs dont like FPS games. What does that say about the state of Aces High?
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oldman, we switch to bishops because we constantly had eny, we are a large squad that would bring 15 to 20 players on squad night. but it seem there was eny every night. and lots of nights it was over 20. I got tired of it, some other got tired of crappy rides when we flew together. we switched to bishops, same thing, we have high eny, it went on for weeks on end. so they started looking at other games. only reason I put up with planetside, it's because it was a new game to play.
now pigs arent the muppets, we dont demand or else. we ask that eny be lowered a bit when we have 100 players and get rid of it when there's less than 20. yesterday after the war was won we had 10 players online total. we had eny. what is the reasoning with such low numbers. there's no point in switching countries with 10 players, a couple more log in and then the low country now has eny. that's the frustration that I feel.
waystin has said many times that he will be that last guy in ah3, that's how I feel. but it's sad that we have more players on other games than in ah because they got tired of flying crappy planes.
semp
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Have you guys tried the new COD that just came out?
On the short list! :x
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With or without ENY low numbers are a problem. People will log off.
The complication is that balance is local and ENY is arena wide.
What can be done other than communicate and cooperate?
With low numbers you have to be fun to play with, which conflicts with popular playing styles.
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they just want to have fun playing the game. PERIOD.
:aok
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With or without ENY low numbers are a problem. People will log off.
The complication is that balance is local and ENY is arena wide.
What can be done other than communicate and cooperate?
With low numbers you have to be fun to play with, which conflicts with popular playing styles.
Exactly. 20 pigs hording a base and having "fun" is unpleasant for the low sided team and just makes them log.. making the problem worse. ENY is the only way to slow down that imbalance. You can always switch half your squad and do a 10v10 fight...
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On the short list! :x
Wouldn't hurt to wait for the first big patch or two. There are some rough spots.
And I think they still need some refinement on their large MP map design.
But I'd always choose that over lazer rifles. ;)
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Exactly. 20 pigs hording a base and having "fun" is unpleasant for the low sided team and just makes them log.. making the problem worse. ENY is the only way to slow down that imbalance. You can always switch half your squad and do a 10v10 fight...
We have no interest in a duel in the Melee. The Pigs would like to apologize for hurting anyones feelings and making them log by fighting with or attacking them in an unwanted manner. :rofl
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Wouldn't hurt to wait for the first big patch or two. There are some rough spots.
And I think they still need some refinement on their large MP map design.
But I'd always choose that over lazer rifles. ;)
Noted. Some but not all factions have lasers. I like my LMG personally....
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but it seem there was eny every night. and lots of nights it was over 20. I got tired of it, some other got tired of crappy rides when we flew together.
So I looked up the ENY 20 planes, and I saw Ki84, 190A8, 38J, 47D40, 51B and, of all things, Spit 9. You guys really think that these are garbage rides? Really?
- oldman
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So I looked up the ENY 20 planes, and I saw Ki84, 190A8, 38J, 47D40, 51B and, of all things, Spit 9. You guys really think that these are garbage rides? Really?
- oldman res
Yeah. I like the Yak9T. You miss the point Oldman. We fly those planes and more in events. The fun is there still. The melee not so much. I dont have to buy the try something else or fly a real plane or stop whining arguments. They just are not as fun when dealing with the opposing high speed planes. So when I can no longer keep up I log off. I hope that makes sense to you.
:salute
Way
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So I looked up the ENY 20 planes, and I saw Ki84, 190A8, 38J, 47D40, 51B and, of all things, Spit 9. You guys really think that these are garbage rides? Really?
- oldman
Actually it was more like 28. At 20 is not so bad.
semp
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If you are tired of the game... there is nothing that can be done.
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If you are tired of the game... there is nothing that can be done.
Nobody said that Shuffler. In fact I love the game. The Melee arena conditions suck at times though for having some fun. Pure and simple. Only place left to find some worthwhile action is FSO. Unfortunately we have lost 3 squads over there in the last two months, with several others struggling to meet numbers. It saddens me to no end.
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We have no interest in a duel in the Melee. The Pigs would like to apologize for hurting anyones feelings and making them log by fighting with or attacking them in an unwanted manner. :rofl
Then why is a pig complaining about eny
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Yeah. I like the Yak9T. You miss the point Oldman. We fly those planes and more in events. The fun is there still. The melee not so much. I dont have to buy the try something else or fly a real plane or stop whining arguments. They just are not as fun when dealing with the opposing high speed planes. So when I can no longer keep up I log off. I hope that makes sense to you
By this age I recognize that it’s just not possible to understand how any other particular person looks at things!
Many people, not just Pigs, have said that ENY detracts from their fun, and I accept that. And I think it’s important to have lots of players in the game. Seems to me, though, that you’re asking for a one-way street. High-number side should be able to fly 10 high speed planes (or 15-20, as Semp indicates) against significantly inferior numbers, and the folks on the other side just have to live with that.
Even I, an unusually patient person, have had the urge to log when I’m getting swarmed by Spit 16s, Yak3s and P47Ms. So I would hope that everyone recognizes that it’s not just the I-hate-ENY people who are affected by lopsided player numbers.
- oldman
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Then why is a pig complaining about eny
You are trolling. I'll not bite on your worthless bait. Players like you are part of the problem not the solution. Good Day Sir.
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You are trolling. I'll not bite on your worthless bait. Players like you are part of the problem not the solution. Good Day Sir.
And hording bases in LW planes is a solution? That's why we have ENY.
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And hording bases in LW planes is a solution? That's why we have ENY.
Tuesday night Pigs were fighting to recapture A2. Numbers were pretty much even in the fight for the longest time (and I think we only had 8 pigs together), however BISH ENY kept rising. We did capture A2 eventually, but anything after that was pretty much useless. Even trying to split the force by moving to the other front had us under ENY fighting even to bigger numbers.
We need a local ENY setup. There is far to little players can do to try and even things up.
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Tuesday night Pigs were fighting to recapture A2. Numbers were pretty much even in the fight for the longest time (and I think we only had 8 pigs together), however BISH ENY kept rising. We did capture A2 eventually, but anything after that was pretty much useless. Even trying to split the force by moving to the other front had us under ENY fighting even to bigger numbers.
We need a local ENY setup. There is far to little players can do to try and even things up.
So bishops had overall numerical advantage and ENY slowed down the base take. What's the problem? Country ganging is gonna happen regardless to the high or low sided number. As much as it sucks for the high sided country it sucks even worse when it's the low sided country.
Local ENY sounds appealing but in reality on benefits the country with the most players as it makes it more difficult.for the low number countries to mount effective offense or defense. It's all about "strategery"
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Tuesday night Pigs were fighting to recapture A2. Numbers were pretty much even in the fight for the longest time (and I think we only had 8 pigs together), however BISH ENY kept rising. We did capture A2 eventually, but anything after that was pretty much useless. Even trying to split the force by moving to the other front had us under ENY fighting even to bigger numbers.
We need a local ENY setup. There is far to little players can do to try and even things up.
What's sad Fugi is we have one ack running pro telling us to up our game as a solution. No one of import appears to be listening. I am done with this thread. When there are 18-20 less Pigs in the arena on Tuesday nights (about 15% of current Tuesday prime time population) and 15 less Pigs in the arena on Fridays (about 12% of the current Friday prime time population) then things will really suck. The players that are left will be wondering how did we get to sub 100 numbers on such a regular basis. Well...maybe it was strategery. :rolleyes:
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Yall could always create a custom arena to go 20v0 in late war planes with no ENY and fight unopposed and then go brag about wrecking the enemy fields on your boards...
Or you can simply switch sides to the country with no ENY if you have to fly a 51D...
Or you can fly a 51B and not switch sides...
Not that big of a deal...
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You haven't been reading, we switch eny goes up, and flying wouldn't be so bad in a ponyb, but when eny is at 28 then it sucks. Tuesdays is the day we got as a squad, we used to fly for 3 or 4 hours. Now when eny hits they start loggin off and go play another game.
semp
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So you had overwhelming numbers as a country. Fly ENY 30 planes like the 100G6 or 38G. Or have half your squad switch countries.
Sounds like ENY is keeping the fight as close to evenly matched as possible as intended and not letting one country/team/squad rampage over the map unopposed.
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I'm not sure what the mechanism would be for local eny, but it seems that with current numbers in the MA, it would still affect a 15-20 member squad.
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I got it.... those on the high number team can get points towards the use of a low eny plane by doing a public service..... each supply drop on the low number side base or town (that requires help) will earn that person points to use on a plane when eny affects it.
That is way out of the box....
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I'm not sure what the mechanism would be for local eny, but it seems that with current numbers in the MA, it would still affect a 15-20 member squad.
I don't think anyone is. I've never seen anything remotely specific about it other than "Local ENY is what's needed." I think there's a reason for that.
Wiley.
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So bishops had overall numerical advantage and ENY slowed down the base take. What's the problem? Country ganging is gonna happen regardless to the high or low sided number. As much as it sucks for the high sided country it sucks even worse when it's the low sided country.
Local ENY sounds appealing but in reality on benefits the country with the most players as it makes it more difficult.for the low number countries to mount effective offense or defense. It's all about "strategery"
Yes the bish number grew over all, but the fight for A2 was still equal in numbers yet we were getting hit with a bigger ENY penalty. Then your stuck flying the lower tier planes and still trying to grab a base while dodging certain players who only BnZ in uber rides. Ya I guess you can call that "strategy" :rolleyes:
ENY needs work. With the numbers as low as they are it is forcing players away. It is even worst during the day time east coast. As Semp said a couple guys swapping side bounces it all over the place. Its getting to the point at night prime time that if the pigs were to switch sides we would just bring the ENY with us. Granted we are most likely the last big squad, but even so we shouldnt be able to have that kind of effect on ENY by ourselves.
I'm not sure what the mechanism would be for local eny, but it seems that with current numbers in the MA, it would still affect a 15-20 member squad.
It wouldnt have at the fight I mentioned. The sides were even. It was the pigs and a few other against a like number of enemy. A fun fight that turned into "work".
ENY is suppose to be about trying to make things even, but it doesnt go far enough. Team A has 20, Team B has 20, and Team C has 40 players. Team C has ENY as it has twice the numbers of the lowest other team, yet both Teams A + B are fighting Team C, even numbers and yet Team C is flying a lower tier plane dodging P51s and Spit16s. Its just coad and its on the server side. Create a system that checks the number of players team wise VS the other teams. It could check a few times a minute. Run the math and if the two lower teams are hitting the bigger team ENY lowers for the bigger team. If not, ENY climbs.
Local ENY could be counted by sectors of if that isnt covered in the coad, use enlarged Radar circles. where groups over lap, do your ENY calculations for those.
Its just coad. Hitech is a pretty smart guys. Right now there are just too many loop holes in the system and they show up easier with the lower numbers.
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Yup it was a great fight, then eny hit, pigs logged off, fight ended.
semp
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So if the local fight numbers were even, as a country there was probably a fight not too far away where your countrymen had extreme numbers advantages and were rolling bases unaffected. The ENY allowed the low side to concentrate on the fight they felt was important at the detriment of the other bases. But overall they were still losing the war.
Sure when the 2 low sided countries both fight the high side it might seem unfair to have ENY but those "alliances" are fleeting and it wont be long before one of the low sided countries gets ganged. Then a lack of ENY would be even more unfair.
In a 3 way fight, it's up to each country to find a way to try and win. If you have a numerical advantage you have to deal with ENY. It's the most fair solution to an unfair situation if you are unwilling to switch sides.
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Atlau, this thread was not about getting rid of eny, but lowering to maybe 20 max. And only getting rid of it when a handful of players are on.
semp
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You're right regarding the original subject (though it devolved to ENY as a whole.
That being said I still think ENY should function the same with low numbers. 2v6 is just as bad as 20v60
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Atlau, this thread was not about getting rid of eny, but lowering to maybe 20 max. And only getting rid of it when a handful of players are on.
semp
Kinda makes you want to start a whole new topic doesn't it?
Oh wait, you did. Then it got locked!
Go preach to someone little dude.
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Kinda makes you want to start a whole new topic doesn't it?
Oh wait, you did. Then it got locked!
Go preach to someone little dude.
dude I am 5'1 and 300 lbs dont call me little.
semp
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dude I am 5'1 and 300 lbs dont call me little.
semp
Well rounded? :p
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Well rounded? :p
perhaps, but in the marines they always said I was a little tough guy.
semp
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Kinda makes you want to start a whole new topic doesn't it?
Oh wait, you did. Then it got locked!
Go preach to someone little dude.
my new topic is this is my last month. had a great time. so long big dude.
semp
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Many of us have been around here for a very long time, Bustr included. HTC has acknowledged the notion that people will simply get tired of a game they’ve mastered. I doubt that ENY can really be a fundamental problem for long-time players, simply because, by now, they should be good virtual pilots in nearly any plane - especially if they fly with a squad like the Pigs. So I see the ENY complaints as an excuse for boredom, not as a genuine reason to quit.
- oldman
Well, you would be wrong. For many it is indeed a reason and a valid one. Dismissing it doesn't make them keep their subscriptions.
my new topic is this is my last month. had a great time. so long big dude.
semp
+1
:salute
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So you'd rather quit than switch sides because you cant fly your plane of choice 100% of the time while having a numerical advantage.
I'd imagine people would also quit if they are constantly outnumbered by uber planes...
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my new topic is this is my last month. had a great time. so long big dude.
semp
ENY is a not a perfect solution.
Find something fun to do with no compromises or limitations. :aok
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So you'd rather quit than switch sides because you cant fly your plane of choice 100% of the time while having a numerical advantage.
I'd imagine people would also quit if they are constantly outnumbered by uber planes...
It already takes me forever to find a fight with only ten or twenty people spread all over the map. Having my ride of choice constantly ENY'd only adds to the aggravation. We've already explained why switching sides isn't an effective solution the way things are set up right now At some point it simply isn't worth it any more--or is at least time to take a break, depending on the person.
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I guess yall play at odd times US. I understand folks across the pond play too. I never see less than about 80 or 90 so I'll sit back and wait for someone to have a better idea.
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I guess yall play at odd times US. I understand folks across the pond play too. I never see less than about 80 or 90 so I'll sit back and wait for someone to have a better idea.
You have to be careful when comparing your experience with others as I have found out. Since this is a 24/7 game, it needs a 24/7 solution that accounts for low traffic times without alienating those players that game during the low number hours.
ENY should be scrapped and the perk point system revamped to accommodate a 24/7 high/mid/low number game cycle.
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Of course.
Still waiting on the better idea.
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Explain why it's not a bad idea.
There is a double safeguard placed on rides with both the ENY and perk system.
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Most aircraft are not limited by perks. If you have perks none of them are. The only people without perks are the new players who are already struggling. Perks are unable to do what ENY does. There are two different controls for two different things.
Now you may say that will all be changed somehow, but you haven't said how the magic happens.
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ENY helps keep the sides balanced. If you scrap it what incentive is there for people to switch and balance?
And if you cant find a fight in p40 you're even less likely to find a fight in a spit16.
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ENY helps keep the sides balanced. If you scrap it what incentive is there for people to switch and balance?
ENY doesnt promote players to switch sides, not with the 6 hour time limit for returning. Many players are also loyal to a team, there is nothing wqrong with that either, why would you want to alienate more players forcing them to fight against their teamates or squadmates?
And if you cant find a fight in p40 you're even less likely to find a fight in a spit16.
You dont fight against spit16s and ponies in a P40, all you do is dodge untill they lose their E and run away. Poor game play at its best. Add in the time involved if you up one field out. By the time you get there they have either run away, or captured the field and moved on to something else.
ENY doesnt work with the low numbers.
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I guess yall play at odd times US. I understand folks across the pond play too. I never see less than about 80 or 90 so I'll sit back and wait for someone to have a better idea.
I logged in the other night. 3 players. Yep just 3. Map had been up a couple of hours. I logged off and went iRacing.
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... ENY doesnt work with the low numbers.
If it didn't work you wouldn't be complaining. It just doesn't work the way you want it to. It works the way HiTech wants it to. I'm sure he'd like a better solution too. We all want big squads to enjoy playing together when there are low numbers.
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If it didn't work you wouldn't be complaining. It just doesn't work the way you want it to. It works the way HiTech wants it to. I'm sure he'd like a better solution too. We all want big squads to enjoy playing together when there are low numbers.
So you know Hitechs mind? :rofl Im sure he doesnt want to chase customers away, and that is what is happening. I think we NEED ENY, I just dont think it is effective the way it is set up. Sure it would take some coad work to make it better for the low numbers we have in prime time now as well as the VERY low numbers we have during EURO prime time.
Things have to change or the game will continue down the road it is on now. Slowly losing more numbers than we gain is not a way for this game to continue into 2020 and beyond. When a large squad that has been together for years and years is looking for other games because they fear this one is going to die soon it says something about the game. These are dedicated players that love playing all aspects of this game we are talking about, not some guys that are just tired of the game.
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So you know Hitechs mind? :rofl Im sure he doesnt want to chase customers away, and that is what is happening. I think we NEED ENY, I just dont think it is effective the way it is set up. Sure it would take some coad work to make it better for the low numbers we have in prime time now as well as the VERY low numbers we have during EURO prime time.
Things have to change or the game will continue down the road it is on now. Slowly losing more numbers than we gain is not a way for this game to continue into 2020 and beyond. When a large squad that has been together for years and years is looking for other games because they fear this one is going to die soon it says something about the game. These are dedicated players that love playing all aspects of this game we are talking about, not some guys that are just tired of the game.
You're wasting your breath, bro.
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So you know Hitechs mind? :rofl ...
Is that funnier than thinking he was waiting for you to tell him what to do? :D
I'm usually correct. Not always. In this case HiTech explained his position again in this very same thread.
Remember reading that?
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If it didn't work you wouldn't be complaining. It just doesn't work the way you want it to. It works the way HiTech wants it to. I'm sure he'd like a better solution too. We all want big squads to enjoy playing together when there are low numbers.
when there are low numbers we arent talking squds, it's individuals, I posted on the other thread about 10 players logged in and there was eny. I have logged in when a country has no players so what's the point of eny with less than 20 players?
semp
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... I have logged in when a country has no players so what's the point of eny with less than 20 players?
semp
Same as the point with 20 players.
What is the correct number of players for ENY?
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when there are low numbers we arent talking squds, it's individuals, I posted on the other thread about 10 players logged in and there was eny. I have logged in when a country has no players so what's the point of eny with less than 20 players?
semp
There is no point unless it is to tick people off, particularly with the counterproductive side switch timer.
It's time to think beyond ENY during low numbers time periods. Something like giving the low side all-seeing radar or decreased rebuild times for example. Or higher point values and perks for destroying things. SOMETHING. ANYTHING.
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What's the correct number of players to designate the low player time periods?
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What's the correct number of players to designate the low player time periods?
I don't have that answer, but I would start my opening bid at forty.
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What's the correct number of players to designate the low player time periods?
In the old days we use to talk about "general mass". Its a point when there were enough people on AND playing where the arena seemed to wake up. Fighting started, base taking started to roll and so on. Until that "number" was hit it was hard to get/do much of anything. Back in those days that number was in the 150-200 players :x
Today we almost NEVER get to that number, but you can still see it work. On those nights were there is 120 players there seems to be more fights, more base captures. Once the numbers drop under 100 things start drying up. More often than not this is when you'll get two teams fighting it out with the third team being ignored by the other two.
I dont know if HTC has data on when the arena is rolling and when it gets too lop-sided. Luche maybe has a chart for it.
As a starting point,
under 50 players = no ENY
50-100 players = a modified ENY (slower climbing, half of what it is now)
100 and more the ENY we have now (with added coad to balance it better due to side ganging)
Is this THE answer? Maybe, maybe not. The point is to try something else, tweak it to see how it works. Does it help make the game play in the MA better? Thats what we need. Things that help knock off some of the frustration in the game. Learning to fly and fight is frustrating enough, lets not add more. Its the frustration that chases players away, both old and new.
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I don't have that answer, but I would start my opening bid at forty.
...and we have 45 from the gentlemen in the back in the funny Dr. Seus hat.
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Forty-five and one half!
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My original number was fifty. Should have stuck with that. :bhead
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Are you saying ENY is acceptable with 51 players?
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If it is ramped slowly enough then yeah.
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You mean if you get to fly the D model? :D
I feel the same way about ENY at 50 and at 51 players. I don't see a difference.
But we agree that at some point it's useful.
The guy that sets the number at 0 has the most experience and the most skin in the game.
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I mean, "I get to fly the D model more often than now." Which is often not much.
The D is overrated. It's fast. That's about it. The average pilot is borderline inept in it, myself included.
It's the only reason I play the game. Flying Spits is too much like cheating. No challenge.
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I mean, "I get to fly the D model more often than now." Which is often not much.
The D is overrated. It's fast. That's about it. The average pilot is borderline inept in it, myself included.
It's the only reason I play the game. Flying Spits is too much like cheating. No challenge.
The P51 is typically harder to be successful in because it's not a defensive plane, and it's acceleration is much slower than a 190D to escape the fight when low n slow. 190D also has better climbing speed. Id much rather fight P51Ds than 190Ds any day. Most of the top performance planes in AH are defensive planes that provide quick acceleration, quick climbing speed, are good turners, and have great cannons. While I believe that ENY should only tick up with more than 50 players. I believe that it should make these planes perked, rather than completely prevent people from using them. Also, some of these late war planes with great K/D's and 3000 kills per tour (including the 190D) should be lightly perked. It would greatly enhance the fights in AH. I can't stress it enough how tired I am of fighting running 190ds. The solution isn't "fly them to beat them". It creats very slow and timid gameplay for everyone = boring.