Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: DCCBOSS on March 16, 2008, 01:07:34 PM
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I would like to show how many Aces high players are against the ENY, please respond by posting a reply to this post yes or no (YES-get rid of ENY), (NO-keep ENY)
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noyes :huh
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Yes!
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yes! :furious
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completely against,,, actually disgusted with it....
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no :furious
I thought you wanted to get rid of ENY, no=in favor
:aok
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AFFIRMATIVE!!!!!!!! :rock or for the youngins ...YAZZZZZZ
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lol i do. question confused me for a sec
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completely against Get ride of it :rock :rock
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I'd say Yes, but since I generally switch to whatever side has the least players once I log on, eny doesn't affect me all that much anymore.
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I like it, it gives me something to read about on my lunch break.
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Dontcha just love it when noobs discover the bbs??? :lol
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Stop whining. If you want to limit yourself by not changing side or arena, its only your own problem.
ENY need some tweaking, btw, it must start from 5 not from 0.
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Considering I rarely fly planes below 20 eny, and often fly planes in the 30 area, I love eny. Especially when it gets high and all the noobs complain about not being able to fly their P51/La7/Spit16 :rofl
Cant fly an La7? Fly an La5
Cant fly a P51D? Fly a P51B
Cant fly a Spit16 or Spit8? Fly a Spit9
They're all just as good as their low-eny counter parts. If all else fails, just run back to your horde :rofl
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Yeah...this will make Hitech think twice about how he designed his game :lol
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NO MORE THREADS ABOUT ENY!!! :furious :furious :furious
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Yeah...this will make Hitech think twice about how he designed his game :lol
Well he should have put the IQ entrance exam in after all :D
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Definitely NO. Keep it.
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No- keep it. If anything, make ENY even more restrictive. I do think some planes should have their ENY values adjusted, but if it's making hordemonkeys whine, it's obviously doing something right.
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most of the guys who worship the all mighty eny i have never seen during the times i fly. shall i be limited in my choices because of when i can fly?
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NO MORE THREADS ABOUT ENY!!! :furious :furious :furious
I'm sorry, that was only about 2x2, can you repeat? :lol
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ENY Rocks!!!! :rock
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See Rule #4
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most of the guys who worship the all mighty eny i have never seen during the times i fly. shall i be limited in my choices because of when i can fly?
Now that you mention it,,, most of the remarks made are from players I never heard of.....
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Ahhh the more eny whine I read, the more I know it works.
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whine, whine, whine.
Keep ENY.
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how many of these stupid post do you think is going to change HiTech's mind. if you where not here before ENY then dont even post. if you can not compare it to what it was like before ENY the shut your mouth. :devil
even better poll closed
polls now open for Perma Squelch :rock
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No- keep it. If anything, make ENY even more restrictive. I do think some planes should have their ENY values adjusted, but if it's making hordemonkeys whine, it's obviously doing something right.
Quoted for truth.most of the guys who worship the all mighty eny i have never seen during the times i fly. shall i be limited in my choices because of when i can fly?
The only thing limiting your choice of what to fly is your choice of where to fly. There are plenty of non-eny restricted cartoon airplanes on the other two countries and/or in the other three arenas. If it is your favorite ride that is all-important to you, switch and ride it. Problem solved.
My favorite ride gets restricted, I up something else. No point in whining about it.
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See Rule #2
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Perk the LA......................oh this is an eny thread :uhoh
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Eny is your friend...KEEP IT
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yes
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no- keep it, it forces people to fly other a/c not as uber
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no- keep it, it forces people to fly other a/c not as uber
I live in Alaska, I don't need air conditioning. :rofl
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No.
Eny restriction needs to stay.
Oh lets just let the country that has twice the number as the other fly their 262s, temps, la7s, spit 16s, and let them have no restrictions so they can just hoard even better than they can having to fly lower ENY aircraft such as the early 109s, 38s, and 47s. Boohoo you cant fly your easy mode la7s and spit 16s, just change countries and you can.
I never have to worry about ENY very often as I fly my 38.
If you dont want to change countries as it so easy, deal with it.
You could always learn to fly a harder aircraft.
I personally enjoy switching to fly for the low number country and fight the hoard with my 80 perk 262s.
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I never really have much to do with ENY because I prefer the lesser rides anyway. More of a challenge to fly a Yak9U instead of an easy La7, for example.
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I never really have much to do with ENY because I prefer the lesser rides anyway. More of a challenge to fly a Yak9U instead of an easy La7, for example.
I fly a Chog when There is no Eny, or F4u-1a when some Eny, or 109 when high Eny, or Switch Arenas when higher then that.
I think the squeakers can stop flying an La7 and read a book for once.
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I understand ENY, and its purpose..
what I dont get, is its inconsistency..
perfect example today..
in blue.. Bish had most players..
but actually had FEWER player in flight than the Knights, and not many more than the rooks..
couldent fly anything below 18 ENY for almost an hour..
YET
at the same time, in orange.. bish had more people, and more people in flight.. than anyone... ENY was 3.. :huh
it woudent be so bad, if it made sense... which sometimes.. it really doesent seem too..
i
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As soon as eny starts going up, so should the amount of troops needed for base grab.
How do you like that idea. :P
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If you dont like it change sides...
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How about insted of ENY making aircraft/vehicles outright unavailable.. just add a cost to them...
for example
P51D
its rated at 8 ENY
as long as ENY is 7 or lower.. its free..
if it reaches 8.. it costs 1 perkie..
after that for every point above, costs 1 perkie.. so at 8 it costs 1, at 9 it costs 2.. and so on..
so if ENY is at 20 and you wanna fly an LA7.. gonna cost ya 13 perkies if ya lose it..
the perking wouldent be high enough to really punish any of the new players.. the vast majority of the time they will be able to fly anything they can fly now.. and by the time they DO hit a situation where they have to pay.. they will have earned the small handful of perkies it costs them to fly what was previously free.
I really think its as close to a "best of both worlds" solution as you can get..
there is still a limiting factor, and people can fly anything they want..
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ENY works off total country populations, not just in-flight numbers.
Perking doesn't work, at all. It is only a "make ENY effect the noobs, but let me fly what I want" suggestion. It is obvious that it would limit only the new players, allowing anyone else to fly whatever they want, regardless of how imbalanced the numbers are, and that is why it is repeatedly mentioned as a "solution" to ENY restriction.
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ENY works off total country populations, not just in-flight numbers.
Perking doesn't work, at all. It is only a "make ENY effect the noobs, but let me fly what I want" suggestion. It is obvious that it would limit only the new players, allowing anyone else to fly whatever they want, regardless of how imbalanced the numbers are, and that is why it is repeatedly mentioned as a "solution" to ENY restriction.
well I think the orignal idea behind ENY and the limiting was the notion that when someone logs in, and cant fly what they want.. they will switch sides.. and thus.. balance the numbers..
that, obviousley is not happening..
and for good reason, people get used to flying for 1 country, get familiar with names, and people..
its especially for squads and nearly impossible for large ones.. the logistics alone are a preventing matter, let alone the fact that if we have 30 members on.. and switch countries.. we will unbalance the area and be back to square 1
not to say there are not people who country jump all the time.. but if your highly involved in a squad, especially one that frequently has alot of members on.. its very very difficult to just country jump on a whim..
so ENY was imposed to balance the teams in the arena, it does not do that.. but it does seem fairly effective at pissing people off..
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Yeah...this will make Hitech think twice about how he designed his game :lol
well
wouldn't be the first time would it?
HTC has chaned the game numerous times due DIRECTLY to the input from players..
there used to be no such thing as ENY, Perk points etc etc..
TA152 used to be perked
C-hog used to be free..
both changed due to player input..
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42
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42
^^^ WHAT???
but on wingnutts topic,
i would love to do away with restricting planes and just jack up the price(inflation if you will)
even though some newwer guys might be like *WAH* i cant fly anything cuz i got no perks
just up a zero and get a kill....3 free perks to fly their spit and/or la
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Yes, remove ENY in its current form from my perspective
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yes
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yes
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I hate it. And I couldn't even fly an LA 5 or a 51B today. It was almost too high to get a C47!
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Dontcha just love it when noobs discover the bbs??? :lol
hey you noob > ; - P**************
as far as the eny goes, no keep it. it serves its purpose.
as for Wingnutt's idea of perking the rides tied to eny, it would defeat the main purpose of the eny restrictions.
it is more about gameplay balancing, than teams/sides balancing.
ever been on a team with 20 people and gotten steam rolled by a team with 150 people in late war rides? 20 people, more or less, automatically lose. with gameplay balancing the 20 will have a chance to defend, futile yeah but still a chance.
if it does cause some to switch sides, better to balance the gameplay. :aok
as for the squad thing, you never switched sides to hunt down yer squadmates?
it is fun going up against yer squadmates once in a while.
nothing like getting HOed by 3 or 4 squadmates at the same time. wall-of-lead-in-the-sky lol
ah the memories.
oh did I say "NB U R a Noob" ; - P****************
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The "ENY" thing is about as effective as trying to get along with your X-WIFE...............IT JUST DOESN'T WORK!
<S>999000
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NO.
My only beef is that some of the values' for different aircraft seem skewed, but other than that, ENY is your friend. :devil
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I don't operate by polls...
HiTech
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Yes, get rid of ENY like the tired old lame dog it is.
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well I think the orignal idea behind ENY and the limiting was the notion that when someone logs in, and cant fly what they want.. they will switch sides.. and thus.. balance the numbers..
that, obviousley is not happening..
Obviously, its happening. Numbers imbalance now not even close to that it was before.
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No, keep ENY. There are other planes to fly other than the La-7 and P-51D and Spit 16 that are fun, such as the P-40, P-38J, Yak, Mossi, 190, 109, A20 ( :O). I could go on all day!
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My only real gripe with ENY is it eats into my pay out for kills in whatever plane im flying, and since i love my perks ride and I die alot in them, i need every perk i get and ENY cuts into it.
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and for good reason, people get used to flying for 1 country, get familiar with names, and people..
You did it once, do it again.. You need not do it more than twice more.
I hate it. And I couldn't even type .country [1/2/3] today. It was too hard to stop hording!
T,FTFY
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oh did I say "NB U R a Noob" ; - P****************
YES I R!!!!! :D
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No.
Forces No skill pilots in the HORDE to fly something else apart from their crutches.
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Yes and No. Yes get rid of it as it currently stands it needs some serious tweaking. No don't get rid of it entirely as it does serve a small incentive to jump countries. Some things eny does is force you to either learn to fly a lesser ride, switch country to always stay in the uber planes, switch arena's, or log off.
AKsleepy
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Yes and Yes to arena cap, at least give it a try for a few months. War is never based on fairness. If on the lossing or winning side so be it.
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I love eny
reasons
1. I love hearing noobs squeek
2. It doesnt affect me
3. I love hearing noobs squeek
4. See reasons 1,3
I think HTC needs to perk anything under 10 eny gameplay may get better if noobs actually learn how to fly something that doesnt go mac 1.
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No changes needed to ENY system. This poll is proof that it works.
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:furious YES :furious
Get rid of it. High eny means you can't get the "better" birds. Thats retarded. A game is only as good as its players. If ya can't fly a Zeke and win against a Pony or a 109 even, then learn to fight better. And vice-versa, if you can't beat up a P-40 with a ME262, then learn to fight better.
Its stupid, in my opinion, to punish 1 or 2 countries with high eny values just because 1 or 2 countries are getting the snot beat out of them by another. If the "Bish" for example, have a lower amount of players and are getting slaughtered by the "Knights" or "Rooks", why give those countries the weaker/ less effective plane sets. Is this fair? No. An A/C is only as good as its pilot. You can put a NOOB in a 262. An experienced pilot with good ACM can kill the NOOB with a LA7. That what this game is about. The abilities of the pilot. Keep things fair by keeping the whole plane set available to everyone. If adjusments must be made to a countries plane set, jack up the perks for the perked rides and leave it at that. In WW2, the germans weren't told they couldn't fly the 190D-9 because the enemy wasn't all that good and they were stuck with the A5 model instead, right? The WW2 air -war was fought and won by superior pilots and their A/C, not because their A/C were more superior. :aok
That my 2 cents worth. <SALUTE> everyone, happy hunting.
A8Chewie
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Its stupid, in my opinion, to punish 1 or 2 countries with high eny values just because 1 or 2 countries are getting the snot beat out of them by another. If the "Bish" for example, have a lower amount of players and are getting slaughtered by the "Knights" or "Rooks", why give those countries the weaker/ less effective plane sets.
You realise that its the country with MORE pilots that gets the limited set, right?
:huh
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Apparently not.
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No - but I do like oTRALFZo 's idea.
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No - but I do like oTRALFZo 's idea.
Sorry but that is a bad idea because it only penalizes the newer players. Do you realize how many of us have tens of thousands of perks? Having to spend perks to bypass ENY is chump change, and many could do it indefinately without ever running low on perks.
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Quick answer: Keep ENY
Long answer: I think a better solution would be better rewards for being on the losing side. It would require modifying the perk costs significantly so we have a wider range of 'reward' planes. The lower end of said 'reward' planes would become free after the player imbalance exceeds a certain range. Basically the idea would be such that if a side is heavily outnumbered, planes such as the F4U-4, Tempest etc would then become free. But at this point the range of perked planes is very limited so it would be more useful if we had minor perk costs on many planes (with an according adjustments to the perk economy to remain balanced).
Not going to get into potential formula's but here are some examples...
Upper tier
163
262
Mid tier
Tempest
F4U-4
Low tier
Spit XIV
F4U-1C
LA7
Spit XVI
KI84
109K4
N1K2
The lowest tier planes would all have a minor perk cost (at today's value's maybe 1/2 to 3 perks). But perk costs can disappear entirely at certain levels of player imbalance. Not factoring in perked vehicles or the perk ord system yet but I think that would add even more value to a rewards based system.
The other thing I think we'd need is higher visibility to player imbalances and potential rewards. Players would need to see somewhere that they could be getting cheap rides in jets if they switched sides.
(Flame away guys!)
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The side with lower numbers cannot lessen the imbalance; as such, any motivating factors/limits/punishments shoul be directed toward the side(s) with higher numbers.
Free tempests versus 20 Spit 8s still sucks.
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The side with lower numbers cannot lessen the imbalance; as such, any motivating factors/limits/punishments shoul be directed toward the side(s) with higher numbers.
Free tempests versus 20 Spit 8s still sucks.
I see that as a function of not having an easy way for loaded sides to see potential rewards by switching sides. From HTC's perspective it's better to reward players to switch sides then to disillusion players to log off entirely. (Admittedly that would happen anyways but the idea is to mitigate frustrations.)
And it may still suck, but it sucks less IMO then - half cost tempests vs 20 spit 8's.
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:aok to eny.....great idea.
For those who detest anyone changing sides... you might rethink that a bit as those that change sides to even-up teams actually enhance your game play by killing eny.
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No- change sides or change your ride!
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LMAO..So heres what we have with ENY....Were loosing so lets penialize the wining side.... What a bunch of Tree Huggin I cant take care of myself whining liberals....
ENY IS LAME....but thats the way this game has been going, Its becoming another Playstation, Nintendo....
:salute
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LMAO..So heres what we have with ENY....Were loosing so lets penialize the wining side.... What a bunch of Tree Huggin I cant take care of myself whining liberals....
:salute :salute kamori :aok
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I see that as a function of not having an easy way for loaded sides to see potential rewards by switching sides. From HTC's perspective it's better to reward players to switch sides then to disillusion players to log off entirely. (Admittedly that would happen anyways but the idea is to mitigate frustrations.)
And it may still suck, but it sucks less IMO then - half cost tempests vs 20 spit 8's.
There is already a perk cost modifier in the game based on country roster. That was tried first, before ENY. It wasn't effective.
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I see that as a function of not having an easy way for loaded sides to see potential rewards by switching sides. From HTC's perspective it's better to reward players to switch sides then to disillusion players to log off entirely. (Admittedly that would happen anyways but the idea is to mitigate frustrations.)
And it may still suck, but it sucks less IMO then - half cost tempests vs 20 spit 8's.
As it is now, there's a perk multiplier for all sides. When ENY is in effect, the perk multiplier is already increasing the costs, and decreasing the perks earned, of the side with numbers, while doing the reverse for the outnumbered sides. Many players refuse to change sides now, even though what you describe already happens to a limited extent. And as has already been mentioned, anything with a perk cost only effects the newer inexperienced players, who have less of an impact on gameplay than longer term players to begin with. The noobs are gunfodder no matter what they're in- limiting them to lesser rides, or giving them free perk planes to fly with the outnumbered side isn't going to change anything.
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There is already a perk cost modifier in the game based on country roster. That was tried first, before ENY. It wasn't effective.
My question to that would be why do players generally look at the roster? 90% of the time I'm doing it I'm either looking for squaddies, specific players or viewing stats. The effectiveness of a display like that is strongly tied to where you place it, much like advertisements. A better place (and this is just plucking ideas out of the air cause I'd rather pretend I'm still on lunch) would probably be on the hanger screen showing how much a plane costs to you now, versus the cheapest available. I can't say whether or not the difference would be large enough to make it useful though.
limiting them to lesser rides, or giving them free perk planes to fly with the outnumbered side isn't going to change anything.
It does change something, it changes the cost of the planes. Whether or not that is going to have a more significant impact on providing incentives for players to switch sides than exists now is up to interpretation.
The details of the idea really aren't relevant, I think the whole reason I posted it in the first place is from a design standpoint it is far more valuable to a decision maker to be provided options. Having a group that says 'NO' and having a group that says 'YES' but provides absolutely no additional value in the way of ideas for potential improvements is fairly pointless. And that comment is directed more at those who want ENY to disappear.
If you want to be rid of ENY there's going to have to be something better to take its place because it doesn't seem like HTC is inclined to return to pre-ENY days due to the lack of a balancing mechanism (regardless of how effective/ineffective it is).
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2. We have resisted changing any thing for a long time, And out first attempt and providing a country moving force was done only when it became and issue (perk multiplier this was a few years back). This was done to effect other issues as minimly as posible.
HiTech
AND Btw on your other sugestion of perks being lowered for underdog, they are already, Underdog gets decrease, Big country gets increased.
HiTech
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ENY is not going to go away. Just because you refuse to switch sides out of some misguided loyalty to an artificial chess-piece made up country / team mates, to balance the sides, it just means you can't fly your uber wonder plane any more.
So ether live with it, and fly another higher ENY plane, or give Hitech something better to balance the sides with. I prefer you stop whining about ENY and just suck it up. $.02
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HTC quotes...
AND Btw on your other sugestion of perks being lowered for underdog, they are already, Underdog gets decrease, Big country gets increased.
HiTech
At a minimum I think the delta could be bigger such that the underdog gets a larger decrease and the big country gets a larger increase. But we could also cast a wider net if it actually affected more then a small handful of planes. I guess personally I'd rather see more discussion on what could actually be done rather then arguments for the status quo or reverting back to pre-ENY days.
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ENY rocks.
F4U-1 + most outrageously outnumbered country on the board + three or four zip codes in Nikis = really juicy perk points.
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yes, get rid of it. people are paying to fly what they want when they want. the uber piolts who want to keep eny are good enough to kick the butts of lessor pilots such as myself regardless what we fly. i constantly hear the good pilots in this game tell us lessor pilots that it's the pilot that matters...there is no best plane.
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Milquetoast answer:
Modify it so that an ENY of more than 24 never happens, or the ENY is calculated on the total number of players on the side, so that "hangers on" (i.e. perk chasers) in the tower and not in vehicles/aircraft do not skew the ENY for a side!
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Milquetoast answer:
Modify it so that an ENY of more than 24 never happens, or the ENY is calculated on the total number of players on the side, so that "hangers on" (i.e. perk chasers) in the tower and not in vehicles/aircraft do not skew the ENY for a side!
No problem, provided the modify the game so that one side can never out number another by more than 1 person. BTW, as has been stated else where..."perk chasing" is an urban myth. You have to be incountry for 12 hours before you receive perks from a reset. :aok
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ENY rocks.
F4U-1 + most outrageously outnumbered country on the board + three or four zip codes in Nikis = really juicy perk points.
You "Tree Huggin I cant take care of myself whining liberal" :mad:
:lol
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No.
At least untill some other viable option comes out to balance the sides.
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yes, get rid of it. people are paying to fly what they want when they want. the uber piolts who want to keep eny are good enough to kick the butts of lessor pilots such as myself regardless what we fly. i constantly hear the good pilots in this game tell us lessor pilots that it's the pilot that matters...there is no best plane.
nope, you are paying to fly in the game and within it's rules. You are not paying to fly any plane you like, though if the conditions are right you may.
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It will all end in tears.
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yes please get rid of eny :pray :pray :pray :pray :pray :pray :pray :pray :pray :pray :pray :pray :pray :pray
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I would like to show how many Aces high players are against the ENY, please respond by posting a reply to this post yes or no (YES-get rid of ENY), (NO-keep ENY)
I think it needs some tuning and maybe a good explanation of how it works 'cause I'm totally confused as to how it gets figured.
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nope, you are paying to fly in the game and within it's rules. You are not paying to fly any plane you like, though if the conditions are right you may.
Yes we are flying the game within the rules, but when the ENY calculations appear to be off, it is our duty to bring attention to it. So is ENY perfect no, does work to some degree yes, can it be improved upon no doubt about it, do "some" players use the negitive result of ENY for the other side to gain a advantage on them yes. This was a poll to get a read of opinions of the games general population just as it was before ENY, Hitech recieved it's feedback from the players on at that time, why should now be any different. I like to see if anyone could list the different balancing options that where also purposed a that time so maybe we could offer alternative solutions or new ones that won't repeat you may have already tried or purposed.
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Keep it
:aok
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I think ENY and its effects as implemented stemed from the idea that people would log on, see the high ENY prohibiting them from flying what they want, and then switch sides, and thus balence the arena.
obviousley that is not happening, many many people and most squads are Country loyal, and for good reason, familiar faces, both friend and foe.. and the logistics of getting an entire squad to change sides in an instant.
instead of people logging in saying "woah!" and switching sides.. they log in say "#&$^ #$@*# *#$(&@#" and log off, cancel account, etc etc.. there have been enough threads about ENY to back the notion that a good portion of people do not like it.. perhaps total eradication of ENY is not the answer, but apparently.. neither is what we currently have.
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I personally like ENY restrictions. I would absolutely hate to see it removed totally. I really don't think it should apply to bombers though, personally. It might need tweaked or something, maybe with perk point costs to stop the complaining about it, but there should be some sort of limiting factor when numbers are way off.
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I think ENY and its effects as implemented stemed from the idea that people would log on, see the high ENY prohibiting them from flying what they want, and then switch sides, and thus balence the arena.
No.
No one ever thought that ENY limiter could completely balance numbers. While being a strong incentive to switch sides, it's main function is to give the biggest team a small handicap when numbers are getting out of control. It's basically just there to prevent having overhwelming numbers AND top rides at the same time.
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No.
No one ever thought that ENY limiter could completely balance numbers. While being a strong incentive to switch sides, it's main function is to give the biggest team a small handicap when numbers are getting out of control. It's basically just there to prevent having overhwelming numbers AND top rides at the same time.
well, its not doing that either..
yesterday the bish had the most people on.. but have FEWER in flight than the rooks, and only 6 more than the nits..
ENY was 17, for over an hour. thats not a small handycap.. thats a BIG handycap for a country that didnt even have the most people in the air.. and only a handful more than the country with the fewest.
what Your saying would make PERFECT SENSE of it actually occurred as stated.. but it doesn't really seem to.. ENY seems to fluctuate randomly with little rhyme or reason as to why..
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well, its not doing that either..
yesterday the bish had the most people on.. but have FEWER in flight than the rooks, and only 6 more than the nits..
ENY was 17, for over an hour. thats not a small handycap.. thats a BIG handycap for a country that didnt even have the most people in the air.. and only a handful more than the country with the fewest.
Screenshot please.
People claim a lot of silly things with regards to ENY, just like in all those collision threads. Most perceptions are plain wrong. If you explain how things work, they don't listen. Constantly confusing facts and opinions...
ENY doesn't work randomly. It's the same formula for every country. And it's not based on people inflight only, because that would be easy to circumvent for that huge squads.
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Keep ENY. Every Vet should know what it used to be like... upping against 10 SPIT 16's low, supported by 15 mid level Niki's covered by 20 hi La-7's. The game was beyond ludacris then.
I am WHOLLY in favor of keeping it. I'm also in favor of those who don't, to go to the TA and learn the very good high eny planes, and to shut up already about eny.
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definately eny is good. I think a case could be made for adjusting some planes eny value though.. still dont understand why p47n is a 5 :)
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No, I am not against it, but it could be implemented more objectively.
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No, I am not against it, but it could be implemented more objectively.
ENY is objective. Some ppl just see only they want to see.
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YES
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it's main function is to give the biggest team a small handicap when numbers are getting out of control. It's basically just there to prevent having overhwelming numbers AND top rides at the same time.
exactly :aok, and it works just fine. so thats a big no from me
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well, its not doing that either..
yesterday the bish had the most people on.. but have FEWER in flight than the rooks, and only 6 more than the nits..
Looks as if the problem lies with your team not the ENY. Your team can help by logging if they are not going to fly. This would drop the ENY. Since your loyal to that team and only that team, maybe you can sort it out at your next meeting.
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For the people that think ENY restrictions, is being random in its calculations of the limit.
The limit is based on the percentage of overage, between largest and smallest side, not the number of people over. I keep seeing the same whine in this thread about how arena A, has the same difference in people between high and low country, as arena B, yet don't state the total number of people on in those arenas, and whine that arena A has an ENY of 27, and arena B has an ENY of 7. What the "GET RID OF ENY" propaganda machine wants you to think is that ENY restrictions are arbitrarily generated, when in fact, if I use the example above, is that arena A has 140 players on, while arena B has maybe 320 players. The same amount of people over in each of those arenas is not an indicator of how much ENY should be calculated, as the percentage of overage is DIFFERENT.
ENY, is fair, impartial, and above all works better than anything else Hitech, and Co. have tried in the past. It is working because you are whining about it. If you want to hoard, you will not be able to do it in your uber ride.
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ENY system works great, no changes needed! :aok
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ENY is objective. Some ppl just see only they want to see.
Oleg, is it possible for you to interpret me less charitably? :rolleyes:
The ENY values of aircraft in AH are not determined by any measurable standard, but by HTC's opinion alone. This has been repeated to me time and time again when I complain about it, and most members of the community even defend it. The most telling evidence of the arbitrariness of ENY values is that they are almost always in multiples of 5 or 10, which is to say painted with a very broad brush. I am not in favor of doing away with ENY, it does more good than harm, but it's because of our willingness to defend an improvable system blindly that it is so easy to critique it.
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Looks as if the problem lies with your team not the ENY. Your team can help by logging if they are not going to fly. This would drop the ENY. Since your loyal to that team and only that team, maybe you can sort it out at your next meeting.
if eny was 10 in bish, and our squad went rooks, it would be 10 in rooks, we have 70 ACTIVE members and on prime time between 20 and 30 on at a given time.
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For the people that think ENY restrictions, is being random in its calculations of the limit.
The limit is based on the percentage of overage, between largest and smallest side, not the number of people over. I keep seeing the same whine in this thread about how arena A, has the same difference in people between high and low country, as arena B, yet don't state the total number of people on in those arenas, and whine that arena A has an ENY of 27, and arena B has an ENY of 7. What the "GET RID OF ENY" propaganda machine wants you to think is that ENY restrictions are arbitrarily generated, when in fact, if I use the example above, is that arena A has 140 players on, while arena B has maybe 320 players. The same amount of people over in each of those arenas is not an indicator of how much ENY should be calculated, as the percentage of overage is DIFFERENT.
ENY, is fair, impartial, and above all works better than anything else Hitech, and Co. have tried in the past. It is working because you are whining about it. If you want to hoard, you will not be able to do it in your uber ride.
First off no one is whining about it, it is our right to bring this to the forum and to Hitech's attention if we feel something is wrong with way is functioning. That being said. you stated while arena A has 140 players while arena B has 320 players and so on, this not what we are talking about. We seen that in both late war arenas the proportion of player offset about the same, orange had 35 more rooks than bish and 15 more than knits (rooks ENY was about "6"), in the blue arena the bish had 20 more player than the knights and 13 more the the rooks (bishs ENY was "21"), this value had stayed high for more than 30 minutes or more. This type of irregularity is what we are talking about, not all this bull about uber rides and so on, also I understand that other methods have been tried in the past, that doesn't mean all alternatives have been explored, does it now. While I will admit that ENY does work to some degree, maybe some tweaking of the calculation or a different approach is needed.
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Oleg, is it possible for you to interpret me less charitably? :rolleyes:
The ENY values of aircraft in AH are not determined by any measurable standard, but by HTC's opinion alone. This has been repeated to me time and time again when I complain about it, and most members of the community even defend it. The most telling evidence of the arbitrariness of ENY values is that they are almost always in multiples of 5 or 10, which is to say painted with a very broad brush. I am not in favor of doing away with ENY, it does more good than harm, but it's because of our willingness to defend an improvable system blindly that it is so easy to critique it.
The reason that ENY is in multiples of 5 is simple. So that you understand, that when ENY restrictions are climbing, people have some time to take action to correct the situation before the next plane restrictions hit.
ENY is not arbitrary. The numbers are based on the effectiveness of the vehicle, based on years of game data provided by the players themselves. Every time someone ups a vehicle Hitech and Co. adds that data, as to how that vehicle performed, and averages that with all the other data about how that vehicle performed and comes up with an ENY number. For new vehicles, Hitech has a rough guide based on how similar performance vehicles, perform. Speed, maneuverability, and firepower, are the chief drivers of those ENY numbers calculation AFAIK.
If you don't think ENY numbers change then I have to show you the C-Hog. It was eventually perked. In-game data was showing that it was a much more effective plane, than the performance data was indicating.
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I say keep ENY. I'm never effetced because i fly 38s and a few German planes....all of which have an ENY of 20 or above (except for Dora).
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First off no one is whining about it, it is our right to bring this to the forum and to Hitech's attention if we feel something is wrong with way is functioning. That being said. you stated while arena A has 140 players while arena B has 320 players and so on, this not what we are talking about. We seen that in both late war arenas the proportion of player offset about the same, orange had 35 more rooks than bish and 15 more than knits (rooks ENY was about "6"), in the blue arena the bish had 20 more player than the knights and 13 more the the rooks (bishs ENY was "21"), this value had stayed high for more than 30 minutes or more. This type of irregularity is what we are talking about
You should have read the post you had quoting from.
It is no irregularity.
ENY is always computed the same way. For each country.
It's about relative differences. 20 players more may be miniscule when the arena has 400 players, or a substantial advantage when arena has 120 players.
I switch teams every once in a while. And the thing I constantly read on every countrychannel is: "ENY unfair to us, they do never have such an high eny"
People happily ignore ENY limiter restrictions when the enemy has them, but only notice it when the ENY note pops up in hangar and they are affected.
There is a reason we never see any proofs for constantly whacked ENY such as screenshots. Just as we never see those "I didn't collide but I took damage from it" or "Spit 16 can get to 500mph while climbing" films...
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Oleg, is it possible for you to interpret me less charitably? :rolleyes:
The ENY values of aircraft in AH are not determined by any measurable standard, but by HTC's opinion alone.
Maybe i misunderstood you, but i mean system at all (ENY-based restriction), not plane's ENY values, keeping in mind all these whines about ENY works differently for different counters or so.
ENY values may be not objective but they same for all countries, so i dont see problems here. Its just about personal preferences.
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The reason that ENY is in multiples of 5 is simple. So that you understand, that when ENY restrictions are climbing, people have some time to take action to correct the situation before the next plane restrictions hit.
ENY is not arbitrary. The numbers are based on the effectiveness of the vehicle, based on years of game data provided by the players themselves. Every time someone ups a vehicle Hitech and Co. adds that data, as to how that vehicle performed, and averages that with all the other data about how that vehicle performed and comes up with an ENY number. For new vehicles, Hitech has a rough guide based on how similar performance vehicles, perform. Speed, maneuverability, and firepower, are the chief drivers of those ENY numbers calculation AFAIK.
If you don't think ENY numbers change then I have to show you the C-Hog. It was eventually perked. In-game data was showing that it was a much more effective plane, than the performance data was indicating.
If you're saying that ENY values are consistent and have adapted to data, then to my mind there are just too many counterexamples to believe it. At best, consistent ENY values have been assigned poorly. Case in point: The 190D vs the Ta152. Which is the better arena aircraft, and which has the lower ENY? I can come up with more examples if you'd like.
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First off no one is whining about it, it is our right to bring this to the forum and to Hitech's attention if we feel something is wrong with way is functioning. That being said. you stated while arena A has 140 players while arena B has 320 players and so on, this not what we are talking about. We seen that in both late war arenas the proportion of player offset about the same, orange had 35 more rooks than bish and 15 more than knits (rooks ENY was about "6"), in the blue arena the bish had 20 more player than the knights and 13 more the the rooks (bishs ENY was "21"), this value had stayed high for more than 30 minutes or more. This type of irregularity is what we are talking about, not all this bull about uber rides and so on, also I understand that other methods have been tried in the past, that doesn't mean all alternatives have been explored, does it now. While I will admit that ENY does work to some degree, maybe some tweaking of the calculation or a different approach is needed.
You are not getting it. You are still looking at the numbers of players one country has over another and thinking that is how ENY restrictions are calculated. To give you an example using your numbers.
LWO, Bish have say, 110 players on, and the Rooks have 35 more than Bish. Thats 145 Rooks a difference of 31.8%, and a ENY of 6.
LWB Knights have say, 20 players on and Bish have 20 more than knights that is 40, thats a 100% difference and ENY restriction is 21.
I'm not including the middle numbers because that is not how ENY restrictions are calculated.
See I can make a small difference seem like a huge one as far as ENY goes, if I don't state how many people are in the arena. You are still not stating how many total people are in those arenas, just the difference between high and low number sides. That is not how ENY is CALCULATED
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wonder if you had two ma's. one with eny, one without. which one would be more popular? i'd be in the ma with no eny. :aok
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If you're saying that ENY values are consistent and have adapted to data, then to my mind there are just too many counterexamples to believe it. At best, consistent ENY values have been assigned poorly. Case in point: The 190D vs the Ta152. Which is the better arena aircraft, and which has the lower ENY? I can come up with more examples if you'd like.
But at least were now getting on a different track. Instead of discussing ENY limiter as such we are discussing individual plane values. And as those can not be assigned 100% objectively (What's considered a better plane? The faster or the better turning one?) there is always something to argue about. But take note that ENY values are not cast in stone. They have been changed various times to better reflect the MA realities. Take the C.205 for example. Once it was my supreme perk farmer when it's ENY was at 40(!), but now these days are gone since 2006 ;)
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i know this is just a game but it's a game that's supposed to be as close to ww2 as posible. it would have sounded silly if a neutral power were to tell the united states that they couldn't fly their P-51D's, P-47N's & F4U-4's simply because they were winning the war. can you imagine hitler complaing to roosevelt, stalin & churchill, whining about them using their best planes? i don't think so. let people fly what they want no matter what the so called balance is!
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i know this is just a game but it's a game that's supposed to be as close to ww2 as posible. it would have sounded silly if a neutral power were to tell the united states that they couldn't fly their P-51D's, P-47N's & F4U-4's simply because they were winning the war. can you imagine hitler complaing to roosevelt, stalin & churchill, whining about them using their best planes? i don't think so. let people fly what they want no matter what the so called balance is!
Note that Germany, the outnumbered country, got better aircraft (Me 262, Me 163, Ta 152, etc...) Britain had the Meteor, but they didnt use it- the war was won and they didnt want to lose any. It was only used to shoot down V1 buzz bombs and vulch German airfeilds.
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i know this is just a game but it's a game that's supposed to be as close to ww2 as posible.
No it isn't. It is a game using WW2 planes. Did you notice there aren't even Germany, United Kingdom, USA? The countries are called Rooks, Bishops and Knights, it's a three-front war and for some strange reasons all countries start with the same number of bases and all planes available.
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"F4U-4's simply because they were winning the war."
It is these type of statements that always make the get rid of ENY crowd loose credibility with me.
Note, nothing about winning or loosing is in the value calculating system. Only how many people you have on your team.
And if anyone things they should be able to have an advantage in number of players on there team with out any other handicap. Then they are blind to basic game play principles of any type.
2nd if anyone else tells me they have a 70 member squad, I think I will just eject them. There is no such thing as a 70 person squad in AH.
Hmm maybe it is time to bring the squad limit down to 16.
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how about making eny in effect for just sectors? zones? bases? could that work?
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wonder if you had two ma's. one with eny, one without. which one would be more popular? i'd be in the ma with no eny. :aok
And you would then be constantly complaining about the Hoard that was picking on little old you all the time in their Lalas, Spits, Nikis, and P-51Ds. Seriously, before ENY restrictions, you were either fighting 20 other team mates to get that one kill, or you had 20 cons on your /-\55 trying to kill you. You think the Hoard is bad now, brother you don't know how bad it was before ENY restrictions were introduced.
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large maps, sometimes (alot of times) theres 5-6 attacking a base with 5-6 defenders but the defenders can up low eny planes due to overall numbers.
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u dont know me iron. i've never complaind about "hoards" get another catch phrase. its getting old.
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DadRabit, but now you are talking about things people can do something about. Where the high player team wants to use there forces is a choice up to them.
But how does a low number team choose to have more people?
People who ask for zone ENY are not trying to address the same game play issue. ENY Was not put in to address large groups of players. It is only there to address country imbalance.
The only thing I have considered adding to the system is once a country has 1/3 of the Arena cap, no more people can enter the arena in that country. But this would not have a huge effect because a lot of the times the arenas are not full.
Also any other change I would add to effect country balance would be more limiting than the current system not less.
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i see your point ht. maby its me but i've never had a problem with being on the recieving end of a large goup trying to take a base or me being in a large group trying to do the same. with these large maps, theres plenty of room to roam an do what you want.
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u dont know me iron. i've never complaind about "hoards" get another catch phrase. its getting old.
No, but you will, when your side is outnumbered 10 to 1 and they choose your side to pick on. I've seen it. Large maps, reset in an hours time. People logging off in disgust as they are outnumbered 10 to 1, both low countries combined. Who thinks that is fun, I ask you that. That is what is going to happen with no ENY. It has happened before, and will happen again with no ENY restrictions.
How one country uses their numerical superiority is up to them, but to be fair (and Hitech has stated this on many occasions ) the side that has numerical superiority does not get the "uber" rides, so that the other sides have at least a fair chance to defend themselves, and not get steam-rolled and reset in an hour.
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Yeah definately againsy eny. Played last night where had to fly planes with greater than 15 eny. Took away my fav. ride P51D. Got stuck flying planes I'm not used to like Spit5,109 series. :rolleyes:
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Yeah definately againsy eny. Played last night where had to fly planes with greater than 15 eny. Took away my fav. ride P51D. Got stuck flying planes I'm not used to like Spit5,109 series. :rolleyes:
P-51B has ENY 20...
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Yeah definately againsy eny. Played last night where had to fly planes with greater than 15 eny. Took away my fav. ride P51D. Got stuck flying planes I'm not used to like Spit5,109 series. :rolleyes:
What was the eny at? Most likely you could have flown the 190A5 which is very similar to the pony.
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:rofl
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there you go again iron. you dont know what i think, what i will think or how i feel in the future. already told ya once. i dont care if its 50-1 against me or 1 side roling bases. i guess the "hoard" is playing the game because they are not having fun. :huh
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I think ENY is a good thing.
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funny, i thought this game was about having fun, not winning or losing, i guess i was wrong.
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"F4U-4's simply because they were winning the war."
It is these type of statements that always make the get rid of ENY crowd loose credibility with me.
Note, nothing about winning or loosing is in the value calculating system. Only how many people you have on your team.
And if anyone things they should be able to have an advantage in number of players on there team with out any other handicap. Then they are blind to basic game play principles of any type.
2nd if anyone else tells me they have a 70 member squad, I think I will just eject them. There is no such thing as a 70 person squad in AH.
Hmm maybe it is time to bring the squad limit down to 16.
I like it. That's where we stopped. 16 :)
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funny, i thought this game was about having fun, not winning or losing, i guess i was wrong.
The next time I have fun getting gangbanged by a horde of La7's and Spixteens, I'll make a thread about it. I highly doubt I will have that excuse.
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funny, i thought this game was about having fun, not winning or losing, i guess i was wrong.
Yup it is, and how much fun would someone have if they were outnumbered 50-1 and the enemy is flying "uber" rides? Why don't you post how ya got Gang LUV'ed by a bunch of LAs and Spit teens, tell me how much fun ya had then HMMM! How bout it DadRabit.
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so the 1 person is going to hamper the fun of 50? :huh
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so the 1 person is going to hamper the fun of 50? :huh
I'm quite sure the 50 are having a great time. What about the one, how much fun are they having?
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so the 1 person is going to hamper the fun of 50? :huh
The only difference between an La5FN and an La7, in that situation, is that the La7 can get you back to the horde faster. And if that ruins your fun, you should probably find something else to do.
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i don't think either way is right or wrong. i simply think more people would enjoy being able to fly what they want to fly & when they want to fly it.
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i simply think more people would enjoy being able to fly what they want to fly & when they want to fly it.
Sure, but sadly people don't behave in the necessary way to allow that all the time. ENY limiter was introduced because of that. Would have been much better if it hadn't been necessary.
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First off no one is whining about it, it is our right to bring this to the forum and to Hitech's attention if we feel something is wrong with way is functioning. That being said. you stated while arena A has 140 players while arena B has 320 players and so on, this not what we are talking about. We seen that in both late war arenas the proportion of player offset about the same, orange had 35 more rooks than bish and 15 more than knits (rooks ENY was about "6"), in the blue arena the bish had 20 more player than the knights and 13 more the the rooks (bishs ENY was "21"), this value had stayed high for more than 30 minutes or more. This type of irregularity is what we are talking about, not all this bull about uber rides and so on, also I understand that other methods have been tried in the past, that doesn't mean all alternatives have been explored, does it now. While I will admit that ENY does work to some degree, maybe some tweaking of the calculation or a different approach is needed.
But beating a dead horse :rofl
If you really wanted to take it to hitech... you might try email... it's a wonderful tool.
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agreed. lets talk about squirrels and how deadly they are now............. :devil
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Those dang pesky squirrels :lol
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squirrels have hands like carneys........
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i wasn't here before the eny thing. how did people behave before that & how has the eny stopped it?
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And their cheeks. Just something unnatural about those cheeks. How they fit all those nuts in those cheeks unnerves me. :noid
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I cringe when I see them bury their nuts........ which makes me wonder... how busy would a squirrel be if he were turned loose on the boards.
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u dont know me iron. i've never complaind about "hoards" get another catch phrase. its getting old.
Well, the fact that you are here complaining about ENY explains why. If you fly with the "Horde", you never have to complain about being out numbered. :)
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Well, the fact that you are here complaining about ENY explains why. If you fly with the "Horde", you never have to complain about being out numbered. :)
OOOH! Zing! :devil Now back to those squirrels...<shudder>
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But at least were now getting on a different track. Instead of discussing ENY limiter as such we are discussing individual plane values. And as those can not be assigned 100% objectively (What's considered a better plane? The faster or the better turning one?) there is always something to argue about. But take note that ENY values are not cast in stone. They have been changed various times to better reflect the MA realities. Take the C.205 for example. Once it was my supreme perk farmer when it's ENY was at 40(!), but now these days are gone since 2006 ;)
Right. I have no problem with limiting the best aircraft when numbers are out of balance. My problem is only with the ratings the aircraft have received, and I know that I could do better if I were given that kind of god-like power. Trust me. :devil
Parallel to the 190D-9/Ta-152 crazyness is the P-51D vs the P-47N, with the former having an ENY of 8, and the latter 5. Do I need to explain why this doesn't make sense?
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NO, keep it.
This poll will have no effect on whether or not HiTech keeps/discards/tweaks ENY. :)
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ENY is an improvement over how things use to be.
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:cry ENY :cry
Stop flying dweeb rides and running with the horde
Switch sides
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yes
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i wasn't here before the eny thing. how did people behave before that & how has the eny stopped it?
Picture logging on nearly every night with one country outnumbering the other two combined...by as much as 100 or more people on the weekends.
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"I cringe when I see them bury their nuts........ which makes me wonder... how busy would a squirrel be if he were turned loose on the boards."
:rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
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Picture logging on nearly every night with one country outnumbering the other two combined...by as much as 100 or more people on the weekends.
Indeed.
Imagine flying for the country that had the huge numbers (Rooks iirc) and trying to score a kill while 20 of your team mates try to beat you to it. Imagine what it was like to fly for either the Bishops or Knights and getting steam rolled by the Rook juggernaught every night.
That is why we now have ENY. ENY hasn't forced sides to be equal every night but it has prevented one team from becoming so populas that it outnumbers both of the other 2 combined.
HiTech has said (paraphrasing here) that they didn't want to force us to do things, but instead, to give us options and incentives. ENY accomplishes that most excellently.
Your options are: 1) Change countries to help balance things out. 2) Don't change countries and pay a penalty in a restricted plane set.
In regards to number 1, many are not inclined to switch sides for various reasons. The incentives to do so however are, reduced costs for perk planes, more perks earned per kill, an unrestricted plane set and the opportunity to meet folks on other teams.
In regards to number 2, you pay the penalty based on YOUR choice to not switch sides. The penalty also includes fewer perks earned per kill in addition to the restricted plane set. You also don't get to build relationships with folks from the other teams. There are many people worth knowing on all 3 teams.
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Indeed.
Imagine flying for the country that had the huge numbers (Rooks iirc) and trying to score a kill while 20 of your team mates try to beat you to it. Imagine what it was like to fly for either the Bishops or Knights and getting steam rolled by the Rook juggernaught every night.
That is why we now have ENY. ENY hasn't forced sides to be equal every night but it has prevented one team from becoming so populas that it outnumbers both of the other 2 combined.
HiTech has said (paraphrasing here) that they didn't want to force us to do things, but instead, to give us options and incentives. ENY accomplishes that most excellently.
Your options are: 1) Change countries to help balance things out. 2) Don't change countries and pay a penalty in a restricted plane set.
I also agree to a point that ENY does work in a lot of ways, I wonder that could there be a slight chance that adjusting from for actual people in flight may be a option?
In regards to number 1, many are not inclined to switch sides for various reasons. The incentives to do so however are, reduced costs for perk planes, more perks earned per kill, an unrestricted plane set and the opportunity to meet folks on other teams.
In regards to number 2, you pay the penalty based on YOUR choice to not switch sides. The penalty also includes fewer perks earned per kill in addition to the restricted plane set. You also don't get to build relationships with folks from the other teams. There are many people worth knowing on all 3 teams.
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yes
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no
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I love ENY and in fact if I remeber right this is actually a softer virsion then the original setting HT had when he first put it in game. Really I wouldn't mind one bit if it was set to the tougher setting but I can hear the ranting if that ever happened and on country chan and 200 it would go something like this, well it does anyway....
"OMG ENY is SOOOO HIGH!!!! I can't fly the best and biggest planes :furious I actually have to get out of my comfort zone and fly, (dare I say it) something different and not so uber. :uhoh Lord help me for I will not be able to pick and run away as good in these non uber rides. :pray
Something like that anyway and I must say I really don't understand this thinking and kinda chuckle when I start seeing the complaints.. I guess I am just more flexible than most. Either that or I just like more of a challenge than the average player.. Besides it looks so much cooler when you finally do land those few kills in your P-40 or other such ride. :cool:
Whats that in the distance? Looks like a mob with torches and they are heading this way!!! Well logging off I must go barracade the doors befor they get in. :D
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Right. I have no problem with limiting the best aircraft when numbers are out of balance. My problem is only with the ratings the aircraft have received, and I know that I could do better if I were given that kind of god-like power.
So when is your game going to be released..... since your so much better....
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But beating a dead horse :rofl
If you really wanted to take it to hitech... you might try email... it's a wonderful tool.
I guess we are if the nay sayers are close minded about the subject and ofcourse there can't be any alternative to the way it is.
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I guess we are if the nay sayers are close minded about the subject and of course there can't be any alternative to the way it is.
There were alternatives and they were discussed, this solution, ENY, was determined to be the best solution for the problem, not only by the community but also by HTC.
HiTech's own words on the subject:
Working together is not penalized. We are not trying to implement a system where consentrating your forces is hampered.
But it realy is a basic game concepts that all sides have the same number of players. If you don't belive that concept, please sight one case where a game is not designed with that in mind. And please do not tell me AH is war, because it is not, it is a War game. And games are ment to be fun and fair. While war is not ment to be either fair or fun.
With equal sides, doing what it takes to win , is what game play is. In AH there are multiple levels of winning, makeing a capture,just shooting down more people than shot you down, ending the war. All are items of game play in AH.
Having more on your team gives your side an unfair advantage to all other sides. All items of game play are effected by that imbalance. And there realy is nothing that the sides with less numbers can do about it. They can not swith countries to even the numbers, if they move to the country with more numbers it just makes everything worse. They could make a treaty, but that only works in a defensive mode.
Equal sides is such a basic consept that over the life of AH the sides have maintained a fairly equal number, the resone is realy simple, people have more fun when the sides are equal.
So now the question becomes not IF the sides should be equal,
but how to accomplish that equality with least impact to the social apspect of the game.
HiTech
It was not done do to any whines.
It was not pushed by anyone that has connections with HTC.
Inbalance had become a problem that had to be delt with.
It was discused for alternatives before being implemented.
It has worked to lower side imbalance issues.
It does not force you to play any certain way, it simply presents you with a choices.
HiTech
With out the ENY. When a side imbalnced happed, the ones complaining most were the underdogs. Could they do anything to help fix the imbalance?
Answere no . Changing sides would just make the problem worse.
With the ENY system. Those complaining , are now the Big side. Can they do somthing to help balance the sides.
Answere yes.
Will normal eb and flow of the arena occasionaly imbalance sides.
Answere yes.
Will the ENY system damapen those peeks, absolutly.
HiTech
I can't find that link for the thread where the community discussed the options for side balancing with HiTech. Regardless, I doubt you'd read it anyways because you want what you want w/o regard to how it effects the rest of the community.
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There were alternatives and they were discussed, this solution, ENY, was determined to be the best solution for the problem, not only by the community but also by HTC.
HiTech's own words on the subject:
I can't find that link for the thread where the community discussed the options for side balancing with HiTech. Regardless, I doubt you'd read it anyways because you want what you want w/o regard to how it effects the rest of the community.
No we don't!
We just are looking for better balancing method, if one could be implemented and thats about it. I can't believe you would be opposed to better way of balancing the countries would you?
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No we don't!
We just are looking for better balancing method
Taking an ENY poll like this is not "looking for a better balancing method"
I would like to show how many Aces high players are against the ENY, please respond by posting a reply to this post yes or no (YES-get rid of ENY), (NO-keep ENY)
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No we don't!
We just are looking for better balancing method, if one could be implemented and thats about it. I can't believe you would be opposed to better way of balancing the countries would you?
I missed the part where the better way was suggested? All I see is that you don't like what is in place. Good luck comming up with an idea that hasn't already been discussed and shot down over the last four years.
here it is elf http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,126649.0.html
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Taking an ENY poll like this is not "looking for a better balancing method"
Your right this a poll but look what it turned into. :salute
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I missed the part where the better way was suggested? All I see is that you don't like what is in place. Good luck comming up with an idea that hasn't already been discussed and shot down over the last four years.
here it is elf http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,126649.0.html
How about one arena with ENY attached to perk value to side with high ENY level and make fair so the younger players can afford to be a part of it.
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How about one arena with ENY attached to perk value to side with high ENY level and make fair so the younger players can afford to be a part of it.
Now all you have to do is explain that where it makes sense.
New players can play from day one now.
ENY has to cover all arenas.
In TA you can fly all planes to learn them.
In DA you can fly all planes and joust to learn them.
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How about one arena with ENY attached to perk value to side with high ENY level and make fair so the younger players can afford to be a part of it.
That was tried before ENY limiting. It didn't have an effect on balance. It is still in effect. You earn more perks by being on the low numbered side. ENY is actually the value used to figure perk points, and just happens to be the value they decided to limit planes with afterwards. Flying a high ENY plane earns perks faster.
Actually Im guessing I really don't understand what you're saying :)
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No we don't!
We just are looking for better balancing method, if one could be implemented and thats about it. I can't believe you would be opposed to better way of balancing the countries would you?
I am not opposed to anything better. You are not proposing any new alternatives.
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,126649.0.html
Read that thread and then propose something new. ENY is the least restrictive idea that anyone could come up with.
How about one arena with ENY attached to perk value to side with high ENY level and make fair so the younger players can afford to be a part of it.
That has been discussed as well. The biggest problem with that is that many players have huge bank rolls of perk points. I am a good example, I have 21,367 fighter perks currently. Many other vets have even larger bank rolls. This type of system simply won't slow down the horde at all especially if the perks are made light enough that newer players can purchase the late war hotrods as well. I could buy the late war hotrods all month long and never miss any perks I might lose.
Seriously friend, go read all 21 pages of that thread. :)
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The only way it would work is reseting perk points.
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In which case it would give an advantage to the 100+ hour club. Not sure that's a good thing either.
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But it would increase the value of flying for the lesser side.
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That was tried before ENY limiting. It didn't have an effect on balance. It is still in effect. You earn more perks by being on the low numbered side. ENY is actually the value used to figure perk points, and just happens to be the value they decided to limit planes with afterwards. Flying a high ENY plane earns perks faster.
Actually Im guessing I really don't understand what you're saying :)
I am not talking about earning more points but costing more. I'am wondering how many players that have so many points that this method would not effect them at all compaired to the general population in the game, and do those players have a higher tendency to horde, (if not ) then what is the problem with trying this in one arena to see how it would work. I realize trying this method is not as simple as how I'am portraying it here and I did not get into any details either at this point, but could this be tried.
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But it would increase the value of flying for the lesser side.
I agree with your assessment, but I bet the thread complaining about losing their perks would dwarf this thread. :D There would probably have to be some type of exchange to keep people from freaking out over it and other then free flight time for perks lost I can't think of many options and thats quite unlikely.
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I am not talking about earning more points but costing more. I'am wondering how many players that have so many points that this method would not effect them at all compaired to the general population in the game, and do those players have a higher tendency to horde, (if not ) then what is the problem with trying this in one arena to see how it would work. I realize trying this method is not as simple as how I'am portraying it here and I did not get into any details either at this point, but could this be tried.
The perk multiplier works exactly like this. If, combined with ENY limits, it is not enough to create balance, it certainly won't do so by itself. This has been tried, and the results are known.
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I am not talking about earning more points but costing more. I'am wondering how many players that have so many points that this method would not effect them at all compaired to the general population in the game, and do those players have a higher tendency to horde, (if not ) then what is the problem with trying this in one arena to see how it would work. I realize trying this method is not as simple as how I'am portraying it here and I did not get into any details either at this point, but could this be tried.
It wouldn't be fair. People would complain some were treated more fairly (less unfairly) than them. HTC would have to deal with an accusation of bias to some players, for however long the teeming masses of whiners would feel the righteous need to make it last. The present situation is fair, and already people are borderline accusing HTC of bias.
It is simply not comprehensive enough and not a better alternative to what we already have.
The players with that many perks have a not-negligible proportion (just a guess on my part, but I'm pretty sure it's accurate) of more experienced sticks, and it's my experience that they can change a furball as much as ~3-6 green to average sticks. Give them an uber plane and the effect increases proportionaly. They wouldn't even need to horde, they'd be free radicals screwing with the homogeneous and predictable dynamics of "warfare" in the MA because nothing would stop them from being unevenly distributed, independently of overall numbers (since ENY-perk system as you propose means nothing to them)..
It didn't work before people had masses of perks, and it's going to work less now.
I agree with your assessment, but I bet the thread complaining about losing their perks would dwarf this thread. :D There would probably have to be some type of exchange to keep people from freaking out over it and other then free flight time for perks lost I can't think of many options and thats quite unlikely.
Yep.
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I am not talking about earning more points but costing more. I'am wondering how many players that have so many points that this method would not effect them at all compaired to the general population in the game, and do those players have a higher tendency to horde, (if not ) then what is the problem with trying this in one arena to see how it would work. I realize trying this method is not as simple as how I'am portraying it here and I did not get into any details either at this point, but could this be tried.
Generally they have all those perk points because they don't fly perked planes........
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Generally they have all those perk points because they don't fly perked planes........
For that past 2 years, I have got a huge share of my kills, in perked planes (Me 262, Me 163, Tempest). Actually I have way more kills in Tempest's than in every other plane by far. As still I have almost 5000 fighter perks.
The current ENY limiter stops me from flying perk planes when numbers go out of whack.
Just further increasing perk cost's and perking planes like La7, Spit XVI, 190-D9 would not. And while the price is going up, the chances to actually having to pay it (=losing my ride) go down with ever increasing numerical advantage of my team.
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And while the price is going up, the chances to actually having to pay it (=losing my ride) go down with ever increasing numerical advantage of my team.
Add a cost to take a perk plane at all to the larger side? A percentage of the total cost that is non-refundable on landing. That sounds worthwhile to me even in the existing system.
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Add a cost to take a perk plane at all to the larger side? A percentage of the total cost that is non-refundable on landing. That sounds worthwhile to me even in the existing system.
Still it enables the outnumbering side to have 262's and Tempests regardless of arena numbers. More worse, you will then only find goods sticks in them, while new/ lesser skilled players will again raid the BBS and complain about "HTC taking their freedom of choice away"
So it'S less valuable as a balancing tool, but the people that hate ENY now would still hate it then. ;)
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Still it enables the outnumbering side to have 262's and Tempests regardless of arena numbers. More worse, you will then only find goods sticks in them, while new/ lesser skilled players will again raid the BBS and complain about "HTC taking their freedom of choice away"
So it'S less valuable as a balancing tool, but the people that hate ENY now would still hate it then. ;)
I was actually thinking the non-refundable perk cost would kick in before ENY kicked in such to entirely block the usage of the plane. Rough example, place the point at +2 ENY, so if ENY is at 3.0 then all ENY 5.0 and lower would have the non-refundable perk charge. Basically gives you two points of potential 'pain', one level where you start getting charged for your shiny perk ride, and another level where you can't actually fly it at all.
Of course, this also suggests modifying the ENY values of the plane set in order to make the new pain point worthwhile.
(I like to randomly muse about this stuff if you haven't noticed yet)
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YES: GET RID OF :devil
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I am not talking about earning more points but costing more. I'am wondering how many players that have so many points that this method would not effect them at all compaired to the general population in the game, and do those players have a higher tendency to horde, (if not ) then what is the problem with trying this in one arena to see how it would work. I realize trying this method is not as simple as how I'am portraying it here and I did not get into any details either at this point, but could this be tried.
It would appear you are suggesting that all of the planes be assigned a perk value. If that is the case, it would not be long before threads would be appearing here demanding a change because people are being denied the planes they want to fly, due to a lack of perks. A very large percentage of the players wouldn't be able to afford the planes they want to drive in a relatively short period of time.
BTW, if you REALLY want to affect change here...come here with a plan (demanding or polling for change does not qualify as a plan). Your plan should consider the pluses and minuses for the game and players (ALL of the players...not just you). I can tell you from experience, HT tends to go into vapor lock when you just start yelling for change. :)
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It would appear you are suggesting that all of the planes be assigned a perk value. If that is the case, it would not be long before threads would be appearing here demanding a change because people are being denied the planes they want to fly, due to a lack of perks. A very large percentage of the players wouldn't be able to afford the planes they want to drive in a relatively short period of time.
BTW, if you REALLY want to affect change here...come here with a plan (demanding or polling for change does not qualify as a plan). Your plan should consider the pluses and minuses for the game and players (ALL of the players...not just you). I can tell you from experience, HT tends to go into vapor lock when you just start yelling for change. :)
POINT TAKEN
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I can tell you from experience, HT tends to go into vapor lock when you just start yelling for change. :)
but... but I just wanna buy a coke and the dollar changer is on the fritz.
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I would like to show how many Aces high players are against the ENY, please respond by posting a reply to this post yes or no (YES-get rid of ENY), (NO-keep ENY)
NO
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no.
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Keep ENY. Get rid of people who start polls on the BBS :D
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Now that you mention it,,, most of the remarks made are from players I never heard of.....
Now that you mention it, most whines about the ENY are from players I've never heard...
ack-ack
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Keep the ENY. The ENY provides to much entertainment on these forums to remove it from the game.
ack-ack