Chiming in on the "Perk La7" Movement

[BUG_EAF322]

La-7's are just like litle baby seals
just hit em and finish em

[Wilbus]

Wohow! Bug, is that a quote from me about the P38???

[Creamo]

Isn't it something how some people can only flame when a topic is introduced.

I don't see how exaggerating to the point of outright lying is going to help your La7 boo hoo cause.

[EvilDingo]

The La-7 was not a rare plane. Almost 6,000 were manufatured during the war.

That's a hell of a lot.

All of the plane-shot-me-down whiners use the F4U-C as credibility for their argument. The F4U-C was used MUCH MUCH more than the La-7 is currently used, it has a great jabo loadout, and can launch from a carrier deck.

How does that compare to the La-7? It doesn't. The La-7 is a great fighter, specifically under 10k, but so are a lot of other AC in the MA. Like the other great fighters, the La-7 has a fairly low ENY value.

Where is the problem?

[Widewing]

Originally posted by devious
I despise the LA-7 and if I take every feasible opportunity to down one of the mothers.

I can't say anything about it beeing over- or undermodeled. It's a very good, late-war plane. It performs better than most other planes at low alts.

And I don't have a problem with it. Take that LA-7 vs. a 190D or 109G at 15k, you get one dead LA-7. Meeting a LA-7 in a 190D or 109G on the deck most likely means defeat (at least for me)

The LA-7 is an enemy, not a victim, and that's fine. No need to perk it.

dtx has 10 kills and has been killed 6 times against the La-7.

A6M5b, Kills of LA-7 in: 1 , killed by LA-7: 1
Bf-109 G2, Kills of LA-7 in: 2 , killed by LA-7: 2
FW-190A5, Kills of LA-7 in: 7 , killed by LA-7: 3

And that in my 2nd tour in AH.

Devious, like you, I don't find the La-7 to be a significant problem. Then again, guys like me who fly it enough to learn how to use it, ARE a major problem to others.

Here's some current tour numbers to chew on:

Against the La-7, I'm 30/5
In the La-7, I'm 85/15

These ratios are just about the same, meaning that it's as much tactics as anything else. Once you know how to fly the La-7, you will also know how to fight them and kill them. Know your enemy.

How about these: 10/3 against Dora, 5/1 flying it - 50/7 against P-51, 33/8 flying it. Again, it boils down to learning how to exploit the strengths and weaknesses of each type. To learn this, one must actually spend some time flying each type.

In addition, I have killed the La-7 in the following types:
P-51B
Fw 190D
Bf 109F-4
La-7
N1K2
Hurricane
F4U
F6F
Seafire
SpitXIV
Ki-61

Finally, I have similar or better K/D ratios in many other types:
Ki-61: 37/7
Hurri IIC: 71/13
SpitIX: 23/5
Yak-9U: 21/5
F4U-1C: 53/13
Typhoon: 14/3

It's not a matter of individual flying skill (I'm not a talented dogfighter), it's a matter of knowledge and tactics. Knowing the strengths and weaknesses of your plane and that of the enemy, and employing tactics to take advantage of those factors is 95% of the game.

If I, an average pilot in many respects, can defeat the La-7 without major difficulty, then I suspect that most could do the same once they gain the requesite experience.

You will find that some folks will belittle you for not playing the game the way they want you to. Ignore them. The simple fact of the matter is this: Good pilots (not necessarily the most skilled at furballing), are masters of the ambush. Killing La-7s is mostly a matter of having the tactical advantage at the outset, and/or being able to take advantage of opportunies as they arise.
 
My regards,

Widewing

[Apache]

Originally posted by Widewing


Devious, like you, I don't find the La-7 to be a significant problem. Then again, guys like me who fly it enough to learn how to use it, ARE a major problem to others.

Here's some current tour numbers to chew on:

Against the La-7, I'm 30/5
In the La-7, I'm 85/15

These ratios are just about the same, meaning that it's as much tactics as anything else. Once you know how to fly the La-7, you will also know how to fight them and kill them. Know your enemy.

How about these: 10/3 against Dora, 5/1 flying it - 50/7 against P-51, 33/8 flying it. Again, it boils down to learning how to exploit the strengths and weaknesses of each type. To learn this, one must actually spend some time flying each type.

In addition, I have killed the La-7 in the following types:
P-51B
Fw 190D
Bf 109F-4
La-7
N1K2
Hurricane
F4U
F6F
Seafire
SpitXIV
Ki-61

Finally, I have similar or better K/D ratios in many other types:
Ki-61: 37/7
Hurri IIC: 71/13
SpitIX: 23/5
Yak-9U: 21/5
F4U-1C: 53/13
Typhoon: 14/3

It's not a matter of individual flying skill (I'm not a talented dogfighter), it's a matter of knowledge and tactics. Knowing the strengths and weaknesses of your plane and that of the enemy, and employing tactics to take advantage of those factors is 95% of the game.

If I, an average pilot in many respects, can defeat the La-7 without major difficulty, then I suspect that most could do the same once they gain the requesite experience.

You will find that some folks will belittle you for not playing the game the way they want you to. Ignore them. The simple fact of the matter is this: Good pilots (not necessarily the most skilled at furballing), are masters of the ambush. Killing La-7s is mostly a matter of having the tactical advantage at the outset, and/or being able to take advantage of opportunies as they arise.
 
My regards,

Widewing

Agreed Widewing. I'm a mediocre pilot at best. Knowing thine enemy is very important.

The La7 is really not that big of a threat, nor is it flown nearly as much as 2 or 3 other types I can think of.

Heck, even as mediocre as I am, since tour 24 I'm 68-9 against it in all types of a/c. I'm batting 1000 this tour, 10-0 woohoo!

[AvidMC]

Arguing to perk the LA-7 is useless since we all know it won't be. As it has been said by a few posters, there is a need for uber planes so that newbies can have a ride they can kill in. The problem comes when the experienced pilots won't give up the training wheels. This won't change either so in short, deal with it!!!.

    It has been mentioned that the LA-7 bleeds E fast, I beg to differ with this based on an experience I had this weekend in the MA. Trying to help a countryman I dove to the deck in my P47-D30 to clear 2 LA7's from his tail. I closed to within 900 at a speed of aprox. 450+ At 900 distance the two LA7's Hi yo yo'ed to evade my closure. I continued straight figuring the yo yo would have bled of enough E on them, after all I was at 450+ MPH. I take a look back and I got the same 2 LA7's closing on me Arse from 500 distance, and I am still at 450MPH. Now either the pilots were dammed good and pulled two simultaneous zeroG yo yo's or that friggn plane is just flat uber. And the best part is that after I cleared my countryman's tail he continued on his merry way as I got banged by the 2 LA7's.

     I say don't perk the uber planes as dweebs need them to feel at home. But if you have been flying for awhile,  have gained enough skills to hold your own in the MA and are still upping in Spits, Nikies, and LA7's....Your nothing more then a lousy sheep raper

Avid

[Nifty]

No offence widewing and apache, but both of you guys are far from mediocre.  Same with Lazs.  You guys are good.    Not Leviathn in a Spit V good, mind you, but good nonetheless!  

La-7s below me are lunch.  La-7s above me are annoyances.  La-7s in a furball where I'm scrambling under 3-1 (or worse) odds are deadly.  

hmm, I think I can safely say that about every fighter plane in the game!  

edit:  unperk the Ta-152 for the June tour and see what it's usage and stats are.  I would venture to say it's usage after a tour or two (give the hype surrounding it a chance to die down) wouldn't merit any perking at all.

[Innominate]

This is only a semi-related issue, but
what about a new stat, that would appear next to kill ratio, a sort of perk-ratio.  So flying a n1k, la7, etc all the time would tend to count less than doing well in a "real" plane.

It would be a ratio of perks given vs perks earned(excluding the end-of-sortie multiplers)
f4u-1 and a n1k2 kill each other 5 times(5 kills each, 5 deaths each)
f4u-1 earns 20 perks, gives 1.25 perks, giving a ratio of 16.0
n1k2 earns 1.25 perks, gives 20, giving a ratio of 0.06
So while both show the same kill ratio, the f4u-1 pilot is shown to be winning against superior opponents.

[Midnight]

These perk arguments always seem to focus on the fleeting 1-v-1 engagements. In the heavily populated MA, 1-v-1 is rarely seen.

The LA7 has very good 'uber' qualities for speed, guns, turning, small size (harder to hit) etc.

It's not that it is hard to fight one, it's that when you get stuck fighting 3 or 4 of them and you see 3 more coming that you don't have a chance. When you finally get a shot, you make it quick or forget it, otherwise the other 3 will be all over you before you can blink.

[AKDejaVu]

I can always tell when a newbie reads a thread like this.  They are the ones in the La-7 pointed straight down at 500 knots.  It just pisses me off that I usually cant get close enough in time to get the maneuver kill.

We need to perk the Spit IX because newbies fly it and always HO with the turbo-lazer-hispanos.  We need to perk the N1K2 because newbies fly it and always HO/Turn/Fly-like-a-UFO.  We need to perk the La-7 cause newbies can be an ace in it.

The term "newbies" has become the perverbial "they" or "them".  I can tell when a newbie is flying any of these aircraft because they still fly like newbies.  These planes do not make them better.  If a newbie is shooting down a vet in anything... it is because the vet let his guard down.  Its time to stop making excuses.

I fly one of the slower planes in the MA and have NEVER had problems with the La-7.  I can only remember loosing one 1:1 engagement with one... and he started with an alt advantage.

I do know that the La-7 is a tough plane to kill when flying an F4u-1D (or c perhaps) because they have comparable turning abilities and the La-7 is faster.  But then... the P-51D/B does most things better than the Fw190s too.  And the Zeke does most things better than the C.202.  So what.

AKDejaVu

[Rude]

I personally liked Toad's song.

La7's are not an issue....a 51D or D9 or typhie, flown well can reak havoc in the MA.

My take is that some of you just can't handle that aircraft and are not willing to make the necessary adjustments to kill it. I guess it's easier for some to not want to play rather than to just tough it out.

[Widewing]

Originally posted by AKDejaVu

The term "newbies" has become the perverbial "they" or "them".  I can tell when a newbie is flying any of these aircraft because they still fly like newbies.  These planes do not make them better.  If a newbie is shooting down a vet in anything... it is because the vet let his guard down.  Its time to stop making excuses.

Bingo, right on the mark.

My regards,

Widewing

[Innominate]

I am a newbie.
Flying an N1k2 or la7 makes me better.  But, I always feel dirty flying those planes, so I avoid them.

[SlapShot]

Excellent post widewing !!!

Enuff of the La7 ... Lately all I have been seeing are hordes of 190s and 109s hovering above the "fight" waiting for the opportunity to dive/strike/zoom and its really pissing me off because I can't catch them ... they dives too fast and they zoom too fast, so it probably should be perked !!! ... NOT !!!

What I have learned (key to widewings point) is to wait/avoid and let them make the first mistake where they are not able to zoom ... bang ... your dead. Or, from alt, watch the boom/zoom and meet them at the zoom point ... bang ... your dead.

I flew the La7 quite a bit in Tour 26 and 27 but rarely this tour due to the lack of ammo. Its not the least bit intimidating to me because I know what it can do and what it can't.

Also, never, and I repeat never, have I been able to CLIMB, even with WEP, and reach speeds of 500+ mph in an La7. If it is possible, I would like to know how its done !!!