rshubert, come on over, let's talk..

[nopoop]

Hell Revvin I couldn't hit anything with the old system let alone the improved version.

Bombing doesn't float my boat.

I'm not masking anything, I was curious as to what you thought. My only thought is otto tends to be a can of worms as you well know.

Just as I'm not one to spend 40 minutes in a bomber to get up to altitude, I'm not gonna do it a fighter to shoot one down either.

No hidden agendas, just wanted an opinion from a bomber pilot.

[beet1e]

Furious. Thanks for your post. Hope you don't mind the fact that I've added a quote of yours to my sig. It is a good one.

But why do you need to kill strat guys in the MA? With all the special skills I'm hearing about that only the furballers possess, and given that strat guys don't DF because they can't (according to you), then I would have thought that the DA, dedicated to furballing, would be more of a challenge for you, and a better theatre for you in which to deploy your superior skills.

[Ack-Ack]

Originally posted by nopoop
I take an A20 up now and then but drop the hangy things right after I suck the gear up..and I don't use it for what it is designed for..

too bad.  It's really fun to fight your way to the target with a fully loaded A-20 and then destroy the town and dogfight in it.  IMO, you're just limiting yourself to a myriad of options.

Do you feel the addition of a more "realistic" bomb site mechanism added or detracted ?

Never fly level bombers myself, except the time I upped a Lancaster (before the 3 ship formation) and had M0RAY in the chin turret and flew the Lancaster around like a turn fighter.  I prefer the attack planes like the A-20 and Ju-87D-3.  It's a blast landing a multi-mission kill in an A-20 or Stuka.

Does the difficulty, or "time" needed to familierize oneself with bombing with current targeting system with success restrict the numbers of those that might enjoy bombers, possibly cutting down on the new blood ?

Would the addition of "otto" "buff tuff" and all the baggage that entails with those concessions add or detract from the current scheme of things ?

IMO, at first the new bombsight is pretty daunting to the new players and old ones alike (I can't calibrate it so I don't even bother) but there are many tutorials put out by other players that the learning curve is much less steep now that it was in the past.

As for 'otto' gunners, I thought they pretty much sucked in WB, at least when I was attacking a bomber but when I'd fly a Me110 low over an enemy field, it was a blast to turn on otto and buzz the field vulching planes as they took off.  But I like the self-gun system they had in AW and here in AH a lot better.


Ack-Ack

[nopoop]

I think your correct on the Beta argument Ackack. The old guard as you say seem to be more mano y mano.

I'm a year in here, but I new, or new of, quite a few of the beta team guys from they're days from WB. I can only comment on what I see. One sided of course because I'm from another game. Taken the low attendence of the game I came from, seeing everyone pull the plug and leave, coming here and seeing a whole lot of people I new way back when, the majority being fighters..

Can't comment on AW. Have no knowlege other than a pretty good stable of players arrived here.

Out of those that I flew with in the arenas going back to 98, the ones that still enjoy the flightsim thing tend to be of the mano y mano variety.

That's from my view.

That's why I asked the question "What do you think "

[Hooligan]

I started out in AW and remember some epic fights ...

Epic fights are good.  Actually epic fights are GREAT!!!  IMO the problem with AH MA strat is that it tends to eliminate epic fights rather than foster them.

All too often, base attacks result in porked fuel and destroyed hangers.  After which it is not unusual to see 40 guys circling a disabled base for 30 minutes, after which it may or may not change hands.

I'd much rather see bases change hands more easily than they do now.  Supose the maps were exactly half the size they are now with the same number of bases, except those bases were much easier to capture.  The likely result is lots of fast moving offensives with bases rapidly being captured and recaptured.  More base captures for the strat guys, more furballs for the furball guys.  In short, a lot more epic battles and everybody gets to do more of what they like.

Hooligan

[funkedup]

Did somebody really compare AH PA (Pork Arena) strat to Chess?  It ain't Chess.  It ain't even Checkers.  It's somewhere between Tic-Tac-Toe and Bingo.

[senna]

I think the longer ranges are to try to get the fighters and bombers to higher altitude rather than always T&B scraping off the deck. The pizza map was just a bit too large with too many bases. The tactical geographic aspects were sort of lost because of this (too many bases). Geography was different with lotsa of changes but sometimes felt like I was flying on mars. Less bases to amplify each bases strategic importance thus engraining its attack approach and route in the geography also resizing it a bit for game play. Otherwise pizza had lotsa potential.

I get my enjoyment 50% flying around or to or from each target area and 50% from the actual fights I encounter. 50% beauty, 50% death.

[nopoop]

The time factor is something I haven't thought about much, but is a factor.

A more fluid or quicker moving front with bases a bit closer would be of benifit to those not spending 90 plus hours a month playing. With a small window of "playing" time at a any givin time, results from a strategic point of view would actually happen in a time frame alotted, for a hour or so a day player. He would see results.

A easier moving front would also be of benifit to those that play in off primetime times.  A small number of players ( compared to primetime ) would see a result for their time online from the strategic point of view.

Tweak the fuel and dar a bit, throw in a few more CV groups...harden up the FH's a tad..

The "steamroller" wouldn't be needed. If it is used, a relatively small group can spoil the effect. You take your 70 guys and rollover bases. We'll just pluck them off one at a time on your flank..A small group wouldn't be impotant in primetime.

Grab a few guys and take some bases..

It would promote more individual confrontation in lieu of the gangbang.

Because in the end, it's not the furballers being a problem, nor is it the strat guys being a problem, the gangbang is the problem. Making adjustments in strat that make the gangbang unnecessary is the solution.

Would that be better or worse for the "full time" player ??

Or a benifit for all players ?

Is it a bastardation of strat ??

Or is it more choices by modifiing the strat ??

[Dead Man Flying]

Originally posted by Revvin
furballs in the MA are normally nothing to do with ACM, chess or whatever other grand comparisons you care to make, it's normally just gangbang the guy who's lowest forming a conga line shooting over each others shoulders while the other team tries to do the same. Chess? more like Snakes and ladders or a game of Kerplunk!

What you describe isn't furballing, it's gangbanging.  Given your confusion between the two, I can understand why you display such misguided contempt.

-- Todd/Leviathn

[Dead Man Flying]

Originally posted by Fariz
Sure, in a systems which are 100% clear of random component it is true. But AH has some randomization in a form of lag, warps, and evil wifes

Well, I've never blamed dying on lag or warps either in Air Warrior or in Aces High.  The evil wife thing on the other hand...

Though I defer to nopoop's expertise on this one.  How're those kneecaps recovering, nopoop?

-- Todd/Leviathn

[Creamo]

All this BK Fur and ball talk is exciting.

They dodge, and snap shot, and look around in excorsist view, and go full throttle and junk all the while. Big simmers these guys. And their cars go Whooooo! Woooooo! too.

Laz, go against a La7 in a 109E... man I just shiver. Spooky, spooky, mean. {clenching a fist}

[nopoop]

Believe it or not Levi the kneecaps are doing fine. My lady and I have come to the agreement to work on specific body quadrants each tour. Got to keep her happy.

This month we're working over the feet. Can't walk now but the knees ?? Not a problem.  Next tour we're back to the upper body and I'm alittle hesitant about that. Thinking of trying the hangy things on  A20's as Ack-ack suggested. But the upper body is always a tough tour..

BTW Rshubert, Creamo has interjected a worthy addition to your vocabulary arsenal being you've joined the boards, in his "special" Creamo way.

The word "tard" is accepted here as an exclamation of dweebery. You'd be surprised at how many tards we have here. WHY I HAVE BEEN ACCUSED OF BEING A TARD RIGHT ON THIS VERY BOARD !!!

I was shocked and hurt. But its a little hurt in the big picture. You haven't met my wife.

Add it to your vocabulary and use it with gusto when the need arises.


_______________________
nopoop
The Blue Knights

pssst !! Rshubert, if you have noticed no one talks to Creamo. That's a good thing to do. He's....ah....different if you know what I mean..

[beet1e]

Tweak the fuel and dar a bit, throw in a few more CV groups...harden up the FH's a tad..

I still don't understand the needs of the furballer to keep changing strat in the MA. You're now calling for FH "hardness" to be increased a tad. What is a tad? How hard were FHs in WW2, and how many tads is that? What effect do you want to see?

The furballers have no interest in strat, and yet here is yet another example of the non-strat guys calling for alterations - to strat. Why why why why why............. do you guys not simply up sticks and move to the DA? Think of the advantages...

• The DA would be stuffed with like minded guys, with superior flying skills.
• Your arena would be unsullied by us strat turkeys.
• Whenever you began an engagement, you would know it would be against a fellow dedicated furballer, and would therefore be more of a challenge and hence more interesting than the mundane task of killing a strat turkey.
• You could take advantage of fields close together, and the engagements would be on equal terms.
• Air starts could be made available, to save you wasting precious time in that climb to 5K.
• You would be free from the suicide fuel porker, and would be able to take of with as much fuel as you need at any time. The pork and auger guys would be no threat to your fun.
• The strat turkey guys would be happier. No longer would their missuns be affected by all those superskilled furball cherrypickers.
• HTC would be a lot happier. No longer would they have to field whines about maps and map rotation. No longer would there be calls to move fields closer together, harden FHs, address the suicide fuel porker problem.
• Buffs would not be there to ruin your fun.
• There would be no calls to perk bombs of 100lb or more on jabo planes.

That's what - 10 good reasons to move to the DA, and everyone wins! You win - your furball engagements will be more interesting against guys with superior skills. The strat turkeys win - their missions have more chance of success. HTC wins - no more strat whines! That's not just a win-win situation, it's win-win-win!

So what's stopping you guys? The DA is just a mouse click away. Staying in the MA is like going to that English tea room and complaining about the coffee, when there's a Starbucks just around the corner.

It does not make sense.

[Ack-Ack]

Originally posted by nopoop

Would that be better or worse for the "full time" player ??

Or a benifit for all players ?

Is it a bastardation of strat ??

Or is it more choices by modifiing the strat ??

Or ask yourself why does it seem that new players gravitate towards ground attack and bombing missions instead of dogfighting?  Is it because the learning curve is not as steep as it would be if they were to just start off dogfighting from day one?  Would changing the strat system help matters?  Would making bases closer together or adding more of them help matters?  Or how about having a formal training program like the ones from AW or WB help matters?  If a new player had the option of entering a well organized training program and was taught ACM, wouldn't that give the new player the confidence he needs to seek out such fights?  You'll still get those that do nothing but ground attack missions but you'll also get those that would have maybe gone the attack route because the easier learning curve but now that they've been taught ACM and other fighter tactics that dogfighting won't seem so daunting to them.



Ack-Ack

[lazs2]

Ok grim... allmost allways.  statisticly... never.

hubert..  after you have done this a few months you might get the point of those films.  maybe not.. if you don't then..

well.. you need to attack both low and slow drex and leviathn... you can have all the advantages... you can do it 30 times and have your best buddy help you in your most organized way..  both those guys will hand you your bellybutton every single time.  chances are... with your lack of experiance... you won't even know what or how it happened.

They do it consitently to guys, and teams of guys, that are the best flight sims have to offer...

beetle.. don't be obtuse..in other words... don't be beetle.. I don't want to go to the da...  I want a place in the MA.  If HTC thinks my ideas suck then they will ignore them.. if they think that yours suck they will ignore you.

lazs
Public Relatations Officer for the BK's