General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: tboy1972 on June 26, 2016, 01:46:27 AM
Title: loss of members
Post by: tboy1972 on June 26, 2016, 01:46:27 AM
so why in the world are there 13 players on a Saturday night? I love this game, and have been paying for many years, but I think it is dying. I remember when I would log on and there would almost always be an update to download. I couldn't tell you the last time I saw an update to this game, other than the beta for aces high 3, which by the way will never attract enough players to make it worth while. This is really sad, and I can see the end of this game in site.
that is sad.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Lusche on June 26, 2016, 03:42:12 AM
I couldn't tell you the last time I saw an update to this game, other than the beta for aces high 3, which by the way will never attract enough players to make it worth while.
For the record, AH3 beta is about a new graphic engine completely rebuild from scratch, wich is way more work than the usual game updates you are referring to. And the AH development team is quite small. That's why the last update (bringing us the Tu-2) was 29 months ago.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Max on June 26, 2016, 08:03:33 AM
It should also be noted that Hitech Creations has not engaged in any paid advertising for some time now. No doubt, that will change when beta goes live.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FLS on June 26, 2016, 08:06:45 AM
I saw 191 players Saturday night.
The beta is the AH3 update to Aces High.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Ratsy on June 26, 2016, 08:29:21 AM
The darkest hour is always just before dawn.
No more needs be said.
:salute
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: nrshida on June 26, 2016, 08:31:38 AM
It should also be noted that Hitech Creations has not engaged in any paid advertising for some time now. No doubt, that will change when beta goes live.
As a bit of a realist, unless there are some big changes in game play (some Im sure I wont like) this game is going to wallow along only for a short time after the AH3 update.
You post that like your proud of that number. Just a couple of weeks ago there were over 300 on a Saturday night.
Pretty graphics may bring in new players IF they run the ads MAX is so optimistic about, but what is there that is going to entice them to stay?
Bullys sending PMs? Large learning curve so that they can barely compete? Runners and bailers who enjoy AVOIDING combat? Lack of radar for hours on end? Huge maps to spread out fronts? Puffy ack that can kill a maneuvering fighter but cant hit a SET of buffs. Being part of a horde or dying to one is your main choice of flights?
I haven't been able to spend a lot of time in the Beta tho I do load each update and check to see if the basics work on my computer (updates, loads, starts, roll a plane or two check FR ) but the biggest thing I see right now is the update points to tanking more than anything else. Of course your cant make "air" look all that much better. I just hope it doesn't turn into Aces Low with any new player that come in.
Im sure the VR support HTC is adding will be a big seller with some people, but is that market all that big to support all the time involved in adding and tweaking it? How long has this delayed the release of AH3?
Lots of questions but very few answers. A nice "round table" setup with HTC would be cool for getting answers, but this would delay the release more :D Ah well, all we can do is to continue to support HTC by paying our subscriptions and hope for the best.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: LCADolby on June 26, 2016, 09:44:43 AM
Go ask Alice, I think she'll know. When logic and proportion have fallen sloppy dead. And the White Knight is talking backwards and the Red Queen's off with her head. Remember what the dormouse said; Feed your head Feed your head! :old:
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Lusche on June 26, 2016, 09:52:42 AM
Go ask Alice, I think she'll know. When logic and proportion have fallen sloppy dead. And the White Knight is talking backwards and the Red Queen's off with her head. Remember what the dormouse said; Feed your head Feed your head! :old:
takin the pills today, I see... :x
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: wil3ur on June 26, 2016, 10:08:29 AM
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: JunkyII on June 26, 2016, 10:41:12 AM
Blame land grabbers.
Seriously, the good fights we see are spawned from capture attempts, the bad fights we see are either a horde or the hide and seek stuff we see. They make up the majority of the game, if more of the leaders of these capture attempts focused on building a fight instead of ending one, we'd be better off.
That being said, any fighter pilot who is afraid to get their hands dirty and kill a few town buildings to help a capture along is also taking away from the fight. Must remain dynamic.
We can do our part to make others gameplay more enjoyable...give a check 6, not HO, not be the 3rd or 4th in, not drop FHs at the only furball, ask if someone needs help (they may not want it), run some supps...ect ect.
I know when I'm playing, I'm probably more worried about how my enemies death experience is more then my satisfaction over the kill....got plenty of each in all categories against most of the sticks in the game so it really doesn't matter to me...here for a fight and fun banter...and the occasional FUSS when some turd wants to run their mouth :D
:salute
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Easyscor on June 26, 2016, 12:26:28 PM
As a bit of a realist, unless there are some big changes in game play...
The loudest criticism is always about game play. The game play has gone through a few changes since I started playing but the current version is still very much the same as when I started. It's the same game-play that hooked you to begin with. You weren't wrong to enjoy it and new players will like it just as much as you did, so long as they feel welcomed into the arena.
For starters, yes, the new general graphics are superb. I don't like spending time in AH2 anymore because of it. The new sound system is first class and the ambient sound is really a nice touch if you appreciate that sort of thing. You touched on VR. The effort put in to VR will pay off simply because early adopters will want to try them in a flight sim. The high learning curve is actually part of the appeal for midlevel players in AH. There is always something new to learn, a new surprise if you will.
Do I wish Beta was already here? You bet! I would've been happy with the graphics alone but you might have wanted new sound packs or support for the new VR glasses you just spent six hundred dollars to use in the game.
I could go on, but you've been around long enough to know this is the best product in its category and only lacked the better graphics and features needed to be appealing to new users.
Gezz, I sound like a fanboi. Ouch!
:cheers:
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Randy1 on June 26, 2016, 12:40:23 PM
Not one mention of the changing economy and the tablet, game-system growth and down-falling of the desktop PC. it is not the people that have changed nor the game. Keep in mind intel laid off a large number of employees in the PC chip department.
What complicates our low numbers is the AH players that enjoy a particular part of the game. As a percentage of the population of AH, these players complaining about lack of play in their style are a low percentage group. When numbers were up high, a low percentage segment of play still had enough numbers to make it worth while. Now with the decline, there just isn't enough play to suit their needs.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: The Fugitive on June 26, 2016, 01:16:21 PM
The loudest criticism is always about game play. The game play has gone through a few changes since I started playing but the current version is still very much the same as when I started. It's the same game-play that hooked you to begin with. You weren't wrong to enjoy it and new players will like it just as much as you did, so long as they feel welcomed into the arena.
For starters, yes, the new general graphics are superb. I don't like spending time in AH2 anymore because of it. The new sound system is first class and the ambient sound is really a nice touch if you appreciate that sort of thing. You touched on VR. The effort put in to VR will pay off simply because early adopters will want to try them in a flight sim. The high learning curve is actually part of the appeal for midlevel players in AH. There is always something new to learn, a new surprise if you will.
Do I wish Beta was already here? You bet! I would've been happy with the graphics alone but you might have wanted new sound packs or support for the new VR glasses you just spent six hundred dollars to use in the game.
I could go on, but you've been around long enough to know this is the best product in its category and only lacked the better graphics and features needed to be appealing to new users.
Gezz, I sound like a fanboi. Ouch!
:cheers:
I agree with everything you said except the game play, it has changed drastically from the old days. Believe it or not, Im a fanboi and will gladly continue to hand over money to HTC as long as they have the servers running, just like I did in AW.
Not one mention of the changing economy and the tablet, game-system growth and down-falling of the desktop PC. it is not the people that have changed nor the game. Keep in mind intel laid off a large number of employees in the PC chip department.
What complicates our low numbers is the AH players that enjoy a particular part of the game. As a percentage of the population of AH, these players complaining about lack of play in their style are a low percentage group. When numbers were up high, a low percentage segment of play still had enough numbers to make it worth while. Now with the decline, there just isn't enough play to suit their needs.
While those things do seem to have an impact on casual game players, "gamers" still build their own PCs and run right on the edge of technology for the best gaming experience. A perfect example is VR headsets.
While all the new bells and whistles are great and I applaud HTC for all the work they are doing and greatly look forward to them moving into AH3, if things are not tweaked and the bullying continues, the griefing continues, and the general lame game play that turns players off, they will not be able to sustain sufficient numbers to keep it going.
I don't know if any one at HTC plays any more. If they do Im sure they are under shades as I feel sorry for them when they DO step into the MA as they are bombarded with questions. Years ago they would hang out and chat, but back then the numbers were low and things not so hectic. But if they are not playing any more how do they know how things are going? I know there was a huge and drastic change in radar at one point. My thoughts are that someone logged in from HTC and saw a vast majority of the players running NOE avoiding ANY type of fight and they made drastic changes to clear that up. Calmer heads prevailed later an reset the dar, a compromise of DAR that was easy to avoid or one that showed you as soon as you got wheels up, to a middle ground, to what we have today.
These are the kind of changes we need not, nothing drastic, but tweaks. Not to remove options in game play but to adjust things so that players avoid the gamier aspect and try to achieve their ends in a more beneficial way for everyone. Fight for bases instead of stealing them. Fight your way back from your milk run in the buff instead of bail. People still get to do the things they like, but adding the tweaks makes it fun for more players. If this is the place to have fun wouldn't you think they would have more players jumping in to HAVE that fun?
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Brooke on June 26, 2016, 01:34:31 PM
Pretty graphics may bring in new players IF they run the ads MAX is so optimistic about, but what is there that is going to entice them to stay?
The AWESOMENESS of Scenarios! :aok
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Easyscor on June 26, 2016, 01:48:38 PM
I'll concede your two points on dar alt and bomber bailing, and I'll add one other I forgot about that startled me. Unfortunately, taking the outside view from the IL2 made it unusable for base defense, it's only roll in the MA. SA became impossible so it turned into another hanger queen.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: ONTOS on June 26, 2016, 01:50:14 PM
I think the new sounds stink. Particularly when one is use to custom sounds. The engines sound like a 35 hp Johnson out board motor that is turning to many rpms's The colors look like they were painted by Monet. So far I find nothing to redeem AHIII. Frame rate for me is 30-59 and is constantly changing. I do not apologise for my bluntness. Some one has to say the king is not wearing any cloths. When AHIII is put into place, membership will fall, in my opinon.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Brooke on June 26, 2016, 01:58:28 PM
The large majority of people think the look of AH3 is a large step up from AH2.
I have a $400 computer and a $130 graphics card, and with default AH3 settings, I'm pretty solidly at 55-60 fps.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: wil3ur on June 26, 2016, 02:04:06 PM
I'll concede your two points on dar alt and bomber bailing, and I'll add one other I forgot about that startled me. Unfortunately, taking the outside view from the IL2 made it unusable for base defense, it's only roll in the MA. SA became impossible so it turned into another hanger queen.
You can move your head position around in the IL to and set views that work very well. The F3 excuse is lame. The plane is still just as good as it ever was, and I dogfight in it quite a bit. Some people just need a crutch, which is why spixteens, lgays and runstangs are so popular.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Easyscor on June 26, 2016, 02:13:37 PM
You can move your head position around in the IL to and set views that work very well. The F3 excuse is lame. The plane is still just as good as it ever was, and I dogfight in it quite a bit. Some people just need a crutch, which is why spixteens, lgays and runstangs are so popular.
I'll need to look at the views. From what you say, they've changed it. That would be excellent! As I said, I stopped using it for lack of SA. At the time, no mater where you tried to move your head position, all you could see was the solid wall between the pilot and the gunner. At that time, the outside view wasn't a crutch, it was necessary to use the plane without a gunner.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Easyscor on June 26, 2016, 02:21:08 PM
I just checked. The view now is better then I remember, but without Track IR I will stand by my statement. It's SA is unusable with standard hardware.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: lefty2 on June 26, 2016, 02:23:31 PM
This that and other thing doesn't matter. the key element in this game is the the player base with out enough players nothing else matters!!!
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FLS on June 26, 2016, 03:07:51 PM
I'll concede your two points on dar alt and bomber bailing, and I'll add one other I forgot about that startled me. Unfortunately, taking the outside view from the IL2 made it unusable for base defense, it's only roll in the MA. SA became impossible so it turned into another hanger queen.
Yes I forgot that one, but like the Chog it did put it back into a position that while still usable, it no longer is a "norm"
I think the new sounds stink. Particularly when one is use to custom sounds. The engines sound like a 35 hp Johnson out board motor that is turning to many rpms's The colors look like they were painted by Monet. So far I find nothing to redeem AHIII. Frame rate for me is 30-59 and is constantly changing. I do not apologise for my bluntness. Some one has to say the king is not wearing any cloths. When AHIII is put into place, membership will fall, in my opinon.
The custom sounds will be back but will take the editors a bit of time to set them up for the new system. No one is going to invest the time to revamp their custom sound packs until AH3 is released so that they know things wont change again. I don't think the graphics are going to chase many away. Most will bit the bullet and upgrade to stay in the game. After all it is a GREAT game which makes it worth it.
This that and other thing doesn't matter. the key element in this game is the the player base with out enough players nothing else matters!!!
Instead of complaining, maybe you should suggest a cure for that issue? I agree numbers are low, but HTC isn't going to wave Harry Potter wand and POOF we have 600+ players on all the time again. What do you think could be done?
You seem to be saying the game play was better when there were fewer players.
Not at all, however if it is the right players, less could be more.
300 players, 10% want to fight whether it is in a GV fighter or buff, head to head for a base you have 30 players trying to have fun while the rest are running from fights, hiding in ack, bailing from a fight and so on.
100 players and all want to fight, which is better? Less is more in that instance.
The drastic differance in game play comes from in the old days were you had squads that had squadnights in the MA that went H2H with squads on the other teams. Whether it was a fight group that ran cover for a capture group, or a squad like the BOPs that did it all, it was all about fighting. Squads TRAINED new members, not just said "fly with me and Ill tell you what you did wrong as I clear your 6 racking up a kill count" Squads trained at making missions and exicuting them until they were second nature.
Now we got guys that load a mission with heavy fighters with cannons and the mission briefing is flatten the field then the town and hope the goon makes it. I'd say that half the players playing now could load up a teamspeak channel and be happy playing off line while they chatted with each other.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: earl1937 on June 26, 2016, 03:51:00 PM
Not one mention of the changing economy and the tablet, game-system growth and down-falling of the desktop PC. it is not the people that have changed nor the game. Keep in mind intel laid off a large number of employees in the PC chip department.
What complicates our low numbers is the AH players that enjoy a particular part of the game. As a percentage of the population of AH, these players complaining about lack of play in their style are a low percentage group. When numbers were up high, a low percentage segment of play still had enough numbers to make it worth while. Now with the decline, there just isn't enough play to suit their needs.
:airplane: I am probley wrong, but when they took Trinity out of play and put in Greebo's map, we started losing players and the rest is history! Some of the biggest "fur balls" and base taking missions were when the Trinity map was in play...there never has been a satisfactory answer as to why Trinity was removed from rotation! No, don't hand me that crap about map being to big, it was a strategy map, you just had to think ahead a little bit! I use to get 40 to 50 bombers in my missions and now, am lucky to get 6 bombers, that is why I have slowed down my game play! I just plain lost interest because everyone wanted to furball instead of capturing bases!
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: WEZEL on June 26, 2016, 03:53:06 PM
It's not the game , it's the players that for the most part don't make the game enjoyable.......just sayin.
Ps. don't know if I can hang on till AH3 comes out just for that reason.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Lusche on June 26, 2016, 03:53:54 PM
It's not the game , it's the players that for the most part don't make the game enjoyable.......just sayin.
Ps. don't know if I can hang on till AH3 comes out just for that reason.
While I wont disagree with you Wezel,you could always come and shoot at me in the TA,as you know everyone does and you used to enjoy chasing me around!
:salute
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Rich46yo on June 26, 2016, 04:37:55 PM
I personally believe there will be a good response to the release of lll. It will take time but a lot of the old players will come back and new ones will join.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Brooke on June 26, 2016, 05:25:00 PM
Man I have to give you credit, you never miss a chance to push those do you! LOL!
Never! :aok
Quote
Personally I've tried a couple
Do you remember which ones you tried? I'm curious because there are some in the past that, if a person were to try only a couple, I wish those weren't the ones. :aok
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: The Fugitive on June 26, 2016, 05:29:20 PM
pay me and ill bring 600+ players. I pay them i expect them to do there job!!!!!!
as far as i can see they do nothing about the player base but watch it decline!!!!!
....and their "job" is to provide you a game, and server. Have you read the "Terms of Service"? Anything after that, new planes graphic and sound updates and so on is totally at their discretion.
By your answer "pay me and ill bring 600+ players" you tell me you haven't got a clue as to how to increase the numbers. Its not like you would be giving away state secrets or something, speak up. Afraid you might give away a good idea and increase the population and thus your fun factor with out collecting a fee? :rolleyes:
Do you remember which ones you tried? I'm curious because there are some in the past that, if a person were to try only a couple, I wish those weren't the ones. :aok
No, I don't remember the names, I admit they were a long time ago tho. I'm an instant action kind of guy. I'll take a few minutes to get to 10k and the next base over but thats about it. If I don't find some action there I'm off looking for it someplace else.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Lazerr on June 26, 2016, 05:37:52 PM
No.. this is just concern for something we care about.
If we didnt, i know myself, wouldnt waste me time coming here to post.
Id just move on. I dont see any of the current features of the new game changing my feelings.
Today after work i upped with a buddy to go pork a central base on the islands of the current map in the MA.
We were greeting by several manned guns, and three wirbles on the base, no opposition in the air at all.
And get this, those same guys had the field resupped within 10 minutes.
Borrrrrrring... and dont tell me to sit in a bomber for 2 hours to bomb strats, or go sit over a vehicle spawn and kill m3's... both of those ideas suck.
And that kind of makes the game suck.
Get the picture now? This happens regularly.
But dont worry, the new version of the game has additional manned ack guns with barely better graphics that will cause 1/3 of the current slum to close accounts due to poor gaming rigs.
Like i said, I logged out of the game to post this, rather than play, because I hate to see whats happening and I care enough to take the time.
I wont be on the rest of the evening.. i will surf cable tv to keep myself occupied.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: guncrasher on June 26, 2016, 05:54:43 PM
funny I played last night and there were 200 players online. not sure where he got the 15 players from.
semp
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: JunkyII on June 26, 2016, 05:56:12 PM
As a knight, I did have to fly 3 sectors to the bish rook fight to find a for sure fight....that should not be the case at any time in game. I feel like you shouldn't have to fly multiple sortie to find a fight, ever.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Lazerr on June 26, 2016, 06:23:06 PM
200 on a saturday night when we had 600 minimum a few years back?
Are you here just to type or make a valid point?
Regardless of how many play now and then, they ones we have are taking the sellout route because its available to them.
Its also the boring route, hence numbers are 1/3rd what they used to be, throughout all times of the 24 hour day.
semps post are all based around his experiences. It is obvious that if there are 200 players on when he is on there are 200 players on at all times. The same goes for if he is having fun everyone else must be having fun.
personally I don't have an issue with more ack, Id be in favor of a no kill zone in the airfield limits and do away with vulching all together. Maybe it would get some of these guys hiding in the guns into a plane if they were sure they would get some time to get some air under their wings and a little E. They would still have to come out to defend the town and a fight would likely get going.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Lazerr on June 26, 2016, 06:34:19 PM
I like that idea also.
I think the manned ack were added to towns however. Id have to check to be sure.
That would be a huge -1 if I am right.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: USCH on June 26, 2016, 07:38:27 PM
But dont worry, the new version of the game has additional manned ack guns with barely better graphics that will cause 1/3 of the current slum to close accounts due to poor gaming rigs.
Like i said, I logged out of the game to post this, rather than play, because I hate to see whats happening and I care enough to take the time.
I wont be on the rest of the evening.. i will surf cable tv to keep myself occupied.
this I fully agree with, me too I'm watching lame shows on Netflix. And I love this game.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: bustr on June 26, 2016, 07:52:59 PM
I'll need to look at the views. From what you say, they've changed it. That would be excellent! As I said, I stopped using it for lack of SA. At the time, no mater where you tried to move your head position, all you could see was the solid wall between the pilot and the gunner. At that time, the outside view wasn't a crutch, it was necessary to use the plane without a gunner.
If you set TR to yaw and pitch then TR inherits your saved HPS views. Then you can move your IL2 9 and 3 oclock wing view forward, up and out. Slide your rear view to look down the channel one side or the other. Set better back side views and adjust your up side and up back.
I end up furballing in my IL2 because most of my green guys cannot kill fighters on demand. I only us TR in 2-axis mode because I get better 6-views without all the chair yoga. And yes I messed with my profiles out the (ying yang) and decided I get better views in 2-axis mode because I can set the HPS to the best view possible. It also keeps the IL2's reticle centered on the windscreen.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: waystin2 on June 26, 2016, 07:57:20 PM
I saw the title and thought Lorena Bobbitt was back! :uhoh
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Gman on June 26, 2016, 08:11:18 PM
I think all of us would be wise to give HTC a break on criticism of the current game and state of things - I'm sure they are well aware of the decline since the glory days and peak player numbers of the late 2000s. There is NO point in investing energy into fixing any issues/problems with the state of the game and the gameplay when such huge changes are on the way and a completely new game coming - a new game with so far some possibly unknown potential changes. That being the case, what's the point in worrying about the current state of things so much, if at all?
Give them time to get AH3 out and live - 95% of HTCs energy and resources IMO should be going into that, not complaints about AH2 issues - and there are issues, everyone including HTC knows this.
Once AH3 is live, then give HTC some time to adjust things as they need to be tweaked with the new game. THEN, if there is no response to legitimate concerns and criticisms that are current AH2 problems (that's even if they carry over), after a reasonable period of time with the new game, I'll be banging my gong along with the rest of the usual suspects. IMO for now, it's not only pointless, it's a bit unfair.
I've said it before in other recent posts, online PC WW2 gaming is easily at an all time high, there are hundreds of thousands playing various WW2 games, and AH3, especially with the VR support in the future, IMO will have the potential to surpass the peak numbers of the glory days 6 or 7 years ago. The less static we put into the signal right now, the better.
I try and always slip in the "return to peak numbers fixes a majority of the issues", and I still believe this largely to be the case, regardless of any potential AH3 gameplay mechanics changes, or even if there isn't much in this regard (I still believe the original gameplay model is very sound, how else did it last 17 years ffs). Maps too large, hard to find fights - all the major repeating complaints - poof gone like chaff in the wind when there are numbers to fill the arenas. AH3 has the potential to do this, especially once word starts to circulate of it to the aforementioned hundreds of thousands of current online WW2 PC gamers out there. I'd bet less than 10% even know about this place, and when that changes...
I for one can't wait for that. Especially in VR, it's going to be sick.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: lefty2 on June 26, 2016, 08:47:16 PM
Just remember what happen to AW they putzed around and look what happen to them
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: The Fugitive on June 26, 2016, 09:33:34 PM
Just remember what happen to AW they putzed around and look what happen to them
AW didn't have the money to invest into the game. They sold it to EA games with an understanding that they would put the money into it. EA games closed AW and used the on-line software they were looking for. That is what happened to AW. They didn't "putz around" they made a change for what they thought was for the betterment of the game.
HTC is rebuilding the game, graphics and sound wise from the ground up. Investing in more employees would run the company out of money faster with the slowly dwindling income so they work with a small crew. While saving money it does slow progress down. Advertising for AH2 wouldn't be smart as it wouldn't return enough income as the game stands now. Once the upgrade to AH3 goes live I hope they run some ads to increase traffic.
Again, you haven't posted any helpful hints/tips on how HTC could bring the numbers up. What are your ideas?
GMAN, there are a couple of things they could do tomorrow morning that wouldn't take more than a few minutes of their time away from AH3. Remove the large maps until the population can once again support them. Second adjust the percentage of bases to need for the win on the small maps to help them last longer. Do you remember the fights we had when the win the war was set to taking all the bases on another team? The battle for the last base was epic! If they change the win mode to 90% of your own and say 40% of each think of the battles as the countries getting hit fight back to save the last 25% of their bases.
Two small changes that are nothing more than a couple of table changes and the dynamics of the game change dramatically. Would it help? Would it make the game more fun for more people? I don't know, but it is something that could be tried and it certainly would "look" like they are working on making things better.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: BaldEagl on June 26, 2016, 09:50:47 PM
Instead of complaining, maybe you should suggest a cure for that issue? I agree numbers are low, but HTC isn't going to wave Harry Potter wand and POOF we have 600+ players on all the time again. What do you think could be done?
What's the point in that? Everything's been discussed ad nauseum for years with no action taken by HT.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FLS on June 26, 2016, 10:07:25 PM
No.. this is just concern for something we care about.
If we didnt, i know myself, wouldnt waste me time coming here to post.
Id just move on. I dont see any of the current features of the new game changing my feelings.
Today after work i upped with a buddy to go pork a central base on the islands of the current map in the MA.
We were greeting by several manned guns, and three wirbles on the base, no opposition in the air at all.
And get this, those same guys had the field resupped within 10 minutes.
Borrrrrrring... and dont tell me to sit in a bomber for 2 hours to bomb strats, or go sit over a vehicle spawn and kill m3's... both of those ideas suck.
And that kind of makes the game suck.
...
Why waste your time doing that when you can duel your buddy?
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FLS on June 26, 2016, 10:09:33 PM
Not at all, however if it is the right players, less could be more.
Sounds like the qualitative difference in game play is not numbers or maps but the attitude the players bring to the game. :aok
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: ROC on June 26, 2016, 10:14:01 PM
There is a limit to what you can do with an old version. I just went through this with my company. Over 24 businesses like mine throughout California. Each independent, each one software based, and the software was 10 years old. It had been patched, fixed, modified, adjusted time and time again to keep up with the wishes of my customers. But, it was at the peak of what obsolete software could do. 2 years ago we embarked on a new system, one that would Start at the level our current system was Peaked at. It was designed to expand, to build on, to grow. We don't need to rebuild the entire database to plug in a new tool later. But, we were on hold for that 2 years. How do we market what's coming? How to we compete with what might be in a world tainted by vaporware? We couldn't, so we waited. Some in our network complained that they were not being listened to because the changes they demanded were not being implemented. We tried to tell them, it's coming, the current system can't do that, the new one does, here, look at the alpha version. They didn't understand, it wasn't the software and a long term strategic plan, it was what they wanted right now. So, they left our network and started a newer, better, greater thing. But, ours finished in October and we rolled it out. Theirs was scheduled to launch in January, it didn't work. Their system had 6 companies join it, my system had 13. 6 months later, we are now 18 and they are 5. We brought in new companies and took one of theirs. Our system is doing everything we wanted, and we can market. Our market share skyrocketed, we used to be a collection of loosely affiliated companies, we now merged into a single shared database and are the single largest networked system like ours in the nation. We have former national competitors now asking how they can piggy back on our system and are in negotiations with them to spend their money branding our product. We lost members in the process to better marketing and deep pockets from that other network that left us. We just smiled. Last week, that network called and asked if there was any way we could collaborate. I said no. No reason to collaborate, when they lose their members, their members have a home and we are marketing that base aggressively. Patience. I know tech. I know HTC. I have no doubt they know exactly what they are doing. AH2 is maxed out, peaked, beyond patching and expansion. This new version is better than the old one by leaps and bounds, and it's just the base of the possibilities. Just looking at what the foundation of the system can do reeks of possibilities many haven't grasped yet. This is about to get good.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: WEZEL on June 26, 2016, 10:22:07 PM
While I wont disagree with you Wezel,you could always come and shoot at me in the TA,as you know everyone does and you used to enjoy chasing me around!
I might take you up on that :salute
:salute
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: The Fugitive on June 26, 2016, 10:25:57 PM
Sounds like the qualitative difference in game play is not numbers or maps but the attitude the players bring to the game. :aok
I've always said it was the players causing the problems. HTC has made a great game here and I don't think anyone is trying to limit what other want to do. Land grabbers can grab land, gvers can gv, bombers can bomb, and fighters can fight. The only thing that needs to be in common is that all of them fight for their action.
You want to bomb strats, no problem but you cant bail when Zoney comes diving in.
You want to GV, no problem but you cant tower out when someone pickles a bomb or gets too close with their M18
You want to pork ord along the front, no problem just don't lawn dart it when you run out of ord and fight the defender that came out.
You want to take a base, no problem but try it with co-ordinated ops buffs, fighters and GVs with a plan other than "flatten everything and hope the goon makes it in".
Too many players have "bastardized" the game with cutting corners and lame game play that most don't even know what is available in the game. With so many options available why do we see the same 3 plans all the time?
Players are not going to change. Thats why I think HTC should tweak a few settings to bring back some of the other options and so generate more action/excitement in the game. Make it more beneficial to fight for those actions instead of looking for the easy way to accomplish those actions.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Vulcan on June 26, 2016, 10:45:33 PM
I think people are unfairly comparing AH to other online games. The market demographic is way different, most AH type games are the realms of the mature gamer. You will get way different population peaks and troughs compared to twitch gaming. We're not all twelvies playing after school til midnight.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Tumor on June 26, 2016, 10:49:26 PM
There is nothing wrong with AH the game. Nothing. Anything wrong, is a direct reflection of the ***clownery that goes on IN the game, BY PLAYERS. A game with a WW2 combat setting, where absolutely anything goes as long as you can get away with it. Game-the-Game types are the worst thing that ever happened to Aces High. Want to know what's changed? The players have. Used to be a whole lot of people who had respect, admiration and dreams involving WW2 combat... they'be been replaced by those who can't wait to make something go bang-bang and make pretty colorful explosions. There's your change. And people wonder why numbers are in the tank.... <smh> :headscratch:
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Brooke on June 26, 2016, 11:03:19 PM
Remove the large maps until the population can once again support them. Second adjust the percentage of bases to need for the win on the small maps to help them last longer.
I, too, think it would be a lot better for fun to increase players/area -- most especially outside of peak hours in the game, when play can become a sprinkling of players scattered over 100 sectors.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: wil3ur on June 26, 2016, 11:05:15 PM
Get rid of CM and profanity filters, nothing worse than getting muted for saying something only a 90 year old woman would consider profane. If people are that easily offended, they should not be on the internet. :old:
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Traveler on June 26, 2016, 11:36:56 PM
113th Lucky Strikes is down to two members, and we left the game early last Saturday night East Coast prime time rather then continue to suffer unnecessary ridicule we received from out team mates, when attempting to get some help re-supplying bases to get some ords up.
It's really a shame, game was always a lot of fun, even if it hasn't really changed in the last 18 years or so and the capture the flag game play is stale as all get out. The people were fun, but not any more. Or at least that's how it seems to me.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FLS on June 26, 2016, 11:42:13 PM
Get rid of CM and profanity filters, nothing worse than getting muted for saying something only a 90 year old woman would consider profane. If people are that easily offended, they should not be on the internet. :old:
Polite conversation is a useful skill. Negativity is contagious.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: wil3ur on June 27, 2016, 12:09:56 AM
Never said anything was negative... just people need to lighten up.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: lefty2 on June 27, 2016, 12:14:22 AM
Polite conversation is a useful skill. Negativity is contagious.
:aok I remember years ago the old chatrooms. back then some were not monitored and every other word was profound profanity in every sort of way. i believe wil3er has it backwards and people who have to use that type of language online should realize it is more destructive then constructive. considering the verbal abuse that goes on in ch 200 now i can see what would happen if there was no language filters. i would be to busy squelching players and never get up in the sky so you guys could shoot me down.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Lusche on June 27, 2016, 02:56:50 AM
Helpful hints/tips... Advertise and promote simple. Its not rocket science. If you need help look it up on the internet many many ideas.
But it's not a magic wand either. Over the years I have read countless posts of "they just need to advertise more", occasionally with some brilliant 'new' ideas which actually have been tried before. And failed. Advertisement is a fail when the cost to get new players to subscibe is higher than the averge revenue you get from that subscription. You don't only need to generate interest (which is indeed relatively easy once you put enough money in, but your product must have an appeal enough for people to actually sign on for long enough to cover the advertisement expenses.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Gman on June 27, 2016, 03:31:15 AM
I've continually said that AH is a niche market game, and by definition attracts an atypical gamer crowd - which isn't a bad thing in most cases. It's just that in that overall pie of hundreds - literally hundreds of thousands of online WW2 PC gamers out there in the last few years with the usual suspect list of more simplistic games - there ARE players looking for something more than what they currently play (WT) in terms of difficulty of both the game and the skill of opponents. These, and other new players are what AH3/HTC sure could use and could be fairly easily targeted. Space games also - Star Citizen and Elite Dangerous also have a large fraction of older more "mature" - whatever that means in this context - players with the $ and the investment in VR and HOTAS controllers already, who obviously want a complex and competitive environment.
Fugitive - I don't disagree, a couple what seems to be simple changes, pulling a few large maps out of the rotation and some other things which many players are convinced should be an easy switch, would make AH2 while we're still playing it a lot better experience. I think the below response aptly covers it.
Quote
What's the point in that? Everything's been discussed ad nauseum for years with no action taken by HT.
Also - I sometimes wonder how some people here have decreed that this particular community is more "mature" than that of other games out there - that's pretty ridiculous on every 2nd day, at best. Perhaps more mature in terms of the digits in the "state your age" column, but nothing more than that. I've seen equal amounts of "maturity", even more in some, in a huge swath of other online games. Taking a look over the past years forums - Skuzzy has had an MG firing 1500rpm lock emoticons with "rule#" tracer rounds mixed in every 2nd round spraying page after page after page. Any sense of superiority here in the "mature" department is a figment of the imagination. Does the game require a more dedicated, committed, competitive, and a number of other adjectives type of player? Yes IMO. Maturity doesn't enter into it.
IL2's recent games, Rise of Flight, the Falcon BMS community, the DCS community - go check out Eagle Dynamics forum, and compare the amount of moderation required - or perhaps not required depending on opinion - over there. War Thunder - I think the case can be made that due to the monthly cost involved here that the lions share of the potential "immature" or what have you potential customers there are pretty much abated from the starting gun.
Quote
But it's not a magic wand either. Over the years I have read countless posts of "they just need to advertise more", occasionally with some brilliant 'new' ideas which actually have been tried before. And failed. Advertisement is a fail when the cost to get new players to subscibe is higher than the averge revenue you get from that subscription. You don't even need to generate interest (which is indeed relatively easy once you put enough money in, but your product must have an appeal enough for people to actually sign on for long enough to cover the advertisement expenses.
Very wise post, agreed 100%. It's not rocket science, but it's no simple matter either. Whatever HTC has planned with regards to advertising and capturing new players will have had to have had thought, as well as practice, and a lot of both put into it before unleashing the full force of the endeavor. I said before that there are assets here they could call on in this regard, AckAck for example has worked in the gaming sector, and specifically in gathering intel on competitors for one of the larger game companies around, as well as for CH and so on. There are others here too, plus I'm sure HTC knows a lot of people over the 17 years they've been around to call on for opinions regarding this, people we'll never hear or know about.
I know HT has mentioned a few times recently how poorly the add campaign and return on investment HTC received during the airing of a really, really well done docu-drama history thing on TV about WW2 aces. IIRC HT said they got exactly ZERO new adds from that, and it wasn't all that long ago either, certainly since the #'s noticeably dropped from the highs of 2009 or whatever.
A result like this understandably makes future plans seem to be a very, very dangerous matter if you put yourself in HTCs shoes, and rightfully so IMO. However, I return to the original premise I've repeated often - along with many others here - PC gaming is on a huge upswing, in hardware, and specifically in interest in online WW2 games, and massively multiplayer games as well. Finding the right formula in terms of both the new product, and a plan to promote it - I still believe it isn't rocket science, and that if HTC can put together such a product as AH2 and now AH3, they should be able - even if they need to call in some outside support - a plan of action to rapidly draw a lot of new players here.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FLOOB on June 27, 2016, 04:11:02 AM
Holy toejam all of you are still talking about Aces High
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: lefty2 on June 27, 2016, 04:48:34 AM
But it's not a magic wand either. Over the years I have read countless posts of "they just need to advertise more", occasionally with some brilliant 'new' ideas which actually have been tried before. And failed. Advertisement is a fail when the cost to get new players to subscibe is higher than the averge revenue you get from that subscription. You don't only need to generate interest (which is indeed relatively easy once you put enough money in, but your product must have an appeal enough for people to actually sign on for long enough to cover the advertisement expenses.
I understand all that what you do is come up with new ideas, new ad campaign measure the results and use the ones that work. The one thing that you don't do is give up and do virtually nothing to build and support your customer base. I think it's plain to see that this is what's happened and it's a shame. I see in another thread that someone has gone so far as to suggest a charity raffle now how embarrassing is that.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: LCADolby on June 27, 2016, 06:26:40 AM
It's not been the same since the zones were removed :old:
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Traveler on June 27, 2016, 08:22:34 AM
Get rid of CM and profanity filters, nothing worse than getting muted for saying something only a 90 year old woman would consider profane. If people are that easily offended, they should not be on the internet. :old:
Have to disagree with you there. profanity has no place in any conversation, at any time. I feel sorry for many of the youth of today who seem unable to express themselves in any situation without the use of it. I was a combat medic in Vietnam, trust me, I've heard it all. I believe its use actually diminishes the users message as well as the user in the eyes of most people that are subjected to the profane rant. I don’t want to read it, I don’t want to hear it on channel. 113th has been around for a lot of years, here and before AH in AW, it has always had a family friendly rule about the use of profanity. A lot of people played without using headsets and whatever was said was available for the whole family to hear. Do you really want your wife or kids exposed to that level of profanity?
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: JunkyII on June 27, 2016, 08:27:22 AM
Never said anything was negative... just people need to lighten up.
You said people who are offended shouldn't be on the internet. I consider that negative. Most players don't get muted even though we all know the same words.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: LCADolby on June 27, 2016, 08:33:58 AM
Didn't they get rid of the zones because we were all complaining about it?? Can't remember, feel like that was 8 years ago.
They decided to stick all the strats together in 1 point affecting the whole side, rather than each zone. It took targets away from being spread throughout the map and squished into an isolated point sometimes hundreds of miles from any front. Biggest mistake I thought, no Idea how it came about.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Lusche on June 27, 2016, 09:02:27 AM
They decided to stick all the strats together in 1 point affecting the whole side, rather than each zone. It took targets away from being spread throughout the map and squished into an isolated point sometimes hundreds of miles from any front. Biggest mistake I thought, no Idea how it came about.
Actually introducing the central strats was a *beep* great thing. Just the relocation mechanism was flawed, and it would have been better to keep some 'zone' factories for more short/midrange bombing. Removing the central strats again, but keeping their individual settings functions was what created a mess in terms of balance & gameplay.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: ONTOS on June 27, 2016, 10:51:36 AM
I must agree with Traveler, profanity is the lowest form of communication. It serves no purpose only to let people know you are ignorant of proper language. People have got far away from good manners and ethics, it shows the disintegration of our country in one of several ways. Of course, it is still a free country (so far) and you are aloud free speech. It's a shame that we have sunk so low, that the use of profanity is concerted normal. Many people may think it normal, it is not.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Wiley on June 27, 2016, 10:53:41 AM
I understand all that what you do is come up with new ideas, new ad campaign measure the results and use the ones that work. The one thing that you don't do is give up and do virtually nothing to build and support your customer base. I think it's plain to see that this is what's happened and it's a shame. I see in another thread that someone has gone so far as to suggest a charity raffle now how embarrassing is that.
When the current product's greatest weakness in attracting new players is the graphics, and there's a new version coming out (somewhat) soon that looks better, why on earth would you advertise the old version? The new one has a much better chance of getting people interested. Faster would be better, sure, but IMO advertising the current live game would be a bad idea compared to advertising once AH3 goes live.
Wiley.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FishBait on June 27, 2016, 11:12:57 AM
I've said it before & I'll say it again, the learning curve of this game is so steep that its vary nature forces new players to resort to 'lame' gameplay & tactics in order to survive. For many, that can be very offputting. I have to assume most new players don't last past the trial period. All they learn is that for $15 they can either be slaughtered like sheep within minutes of upping, or survive solely by hugging ack and joining a horde. What you're left with after most drop out are: A) the very small minority who have the moxy (or stupidity... not sure which ;)) to put in the work to get some skill in this game, or B) a much larger number of players who find it fun to hide in ack, up in hordes, etc.
I think what we're experiencing now is the direct result of this slow but steady decline in player quality. It's not that they need help they're not getting. It's that they never cared about gaining skill in this game to begin with. I've PM'd many players who I've just killed offering to help them in the DA/TA, and to date not a single one has taken me up on the offer. In my opinion, we're simply not providing a sufficient introduction to the game to keep potentially-valuable players from walking before their trial period ends. What we're left with are the scraps.
I truly believe that if more energy and attention was placed on providing some sort of structured training environment for new players, we'd not only see the gross number of players go up, but along with it an increase in the ratio of quality players to those who are making the game what it is today.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Wiley on June 27, 2016, 11:34:58 AM
I truly believe that if more energy and attention was placed on providing some sort of structured training environment for new players, we'd not only see the gross number of players go up, but along with it an increase in the ratio of quality players to those who are making the game what it is today.
You're assuming people actually want to get better though. This game's learning curve is a rarity in gaming these days. Most people don't want to put in the time to learn a game as deep as this unless there's something to work towards. Making some kind of number tick up in a database for some reason causes people to invest a lot of time in a game. When that incentive's not there, very few people want to put in the time to get good for some reason. The other thing with this game is there's no matchmaking.
First sortie fliers are lumped in with 16 year vets, all in the same arena. It helps to be some kind of masichist when that's the scenario. I honestly don't know how I put up with the early days of my flight sim career getting stomped on day in and day out. I guess because I just loved flying cartoon planes.
In my flight sim career I've likely spent more time than most talking with trainers, but I really had to be in the mood to train. If the game had some kind of structure that made training necessary at times, I wouldn't have liked that much. I'm not sure what structured training would even look like.
Wiley.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FishBait on June 27, 2016, 11:54:45 AM
You're assuming people actually want to get better though. This game's learning curve is a rarity in gaming these days. Most people don't want to put in the time to learn a game as deep as this unless there's something to work towards. Making some kind of number tick up in a database for some reason causes people to invest a lot of time in a game. When that incentive's not there, very few people want to put in the time to get good for some reason. The other thing with this game is there's no matchmaking.
First sortie fliers are lumped in with 16 year vets, all in the same arena. It helps to be some kind of masichist when that's the scenario. I honestly don't know how I put up with the early days of my flight sim career getting stomped on day in and day out. I guess because I just loved flying cartoon planes.
In my flight sim career I've likely spent more time than most talking with trainers, but I really had to be in the mood to train. If the game had some kind of structure that made training necessary at times, I wouldn't have liked that much. I'm not sure what structured training would even look like.
Wiley.
We're 100% on the same page, really.
Regarding 'structured' training, I wasn't envisioning anything mandatory. I was thinking more along the lines of things like in-game (and in-depth) documentation/tutorials/process checklists, being assigned a trainer during registration (who you're free to contact or not at your discretion), expanding and better organizing web-based instruction, staff / trainer led noob missions flown at regular intervals daily, etc. Just rolling ideas off my head - so they may not be well-thought out idead - but just to give you the jist of what I was thinking.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Zoney on June 27, 2016, 01:04:59 PM
This is a tough, unforgiving game. So was AirWarrior 2 decades ago. I do know why I stuck with it. Because I wanted to be one of "those" guys. Those guys that killed me over and over and over.
I had been playing AW for about a week. Just enough time to have gotten a few kills, probably newbies like myself. I had learned that having a bit more alt than your opponent was useful. With this newfound, precious knowledge I attacked some fool that was flying around near the deck. 2 turns later, I'm dead. Ha! He got lucky, I'll show him! Went back to where he had been and there he is stupidly still flying low and I pounced. Tower. Grab another plane and attack with anger. Tower. Get more alt on the next attack. Tower. Get a different plane, because that's obviously the problem. Tower. Get in the same plane as him. Tower. Attack from co-alt. Tower. Call him name and attack. Tower. Call his mother names and attack. Tower. Attack him while he's fighting another plane. Tower. Drink a beer. Tower.
Then my tormentor said: "Hey Zoney, you want some help?" "Yes". "OK, I'm in a little squad here called the Pigstompers, join it, there are always some of us on. We can help you to have more fun."
It was Deth7. I did have more fun. I stuck it out. I made friends.
Here's the point I am attempting to make.
The squad thingy is invaluable.
I think we should have a "Training" squad. Some place for people to start, all on the same vox so they may each learn as everyone is asking questions. A place to be with new friends that will most likely become permanent friends even if the squad is not their permanent squad. A squad also registered with FSO's to haul those new guys in there too. It needs a patient and giving CO & XO. They can train together in the TA and the DA knowing they aren't up against a 20 year veteran uberstick that they envision laughing at their deaths.
No, we aren't going to call them the "Baby Seals" or anything derogatory.
No, it won't be run by me, sorry, I'm in JG11 for life.
Actually, and don't laugh now, I was thinking Dolby. He's even English so he sounds smart.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Brooke on June 27, 2016, 01:12:41 PM
This is a tough, unforgiving game. So was AirWarrior 2 decades ago. I do know why I stuck with it. Because I wanted to be one of "those" guys. Those guys that killed me over and over and over.
I had been playing AW for about a week. Just enough time to have gotten a few kills, probably newbies like myself. I had learned that having a bit more alt than your opponent was useful. With this newfound, precious knowledge I attacked some fool that was flying around near the deck. 2 turns later, I'm dead. Ha! He got lucky, I'll show him! Went back to where he had been and there he is stupidly still flying low and I pounced. Tower. Grab another plane and attack with anger. Tower. Get more alt on the next attack. Tower. Get a different plane, because that's obviously the problem. Tower. Get in the same plane as him. Tower. Attack from co-alt. Tower. Call him name and attack. Tower. Call his mother names and attack. Tower. Attack him while he's fighting another plane. Tower. Drink a beer. Tower.
Then my tormentor said: "Hey Zoney, you want some help?" "Yes". "OK, I'm in a little squad here called the Pigstompers, join it, there are always some of us on. We can help you to have more fun."
It was Deth7. I did have more fun. I stuck it out. I made friends.
Here's the point I am attempting to make.
The squad thingy is invaluable.
I think we should have a "Training" squad. Some place for people to start, all on the same vox so they may each learn as everyone is asking questions. A place to be with new friends that will most likely become permanent friends even if the squad is not their permanent squad. A squad also registered with FSO's to haul those new guys in there too. It needs a patient and giving CO & XO. They can train together in the TA and the DA knowing they aren't up against a 20 year veteran uberstick that they envision laughing at their deaths.
No, we aren't going to call them the "Baby Seals" or anything derogatory.
No, it won't be run by me, sorry, I'm in JG11 for life.
Actually, and don't laugh now, I was thinking Dolby. He's even English so he sounds smart.
good idea Zoney. kinda reminds me of that movie Flyboys. Maybe use that for a squad name lol. to be honest the learning curve in this game is more like a flat wall with very few footholds. whenever someone offers help, take every bit of advice you can.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Shuffler on June 27, 2016, 01:39:17 PM
so why in the world are there 13 players on a Saturday night? I love this game, and have been paying for many years, but I think it is dying. I remember when I would log on and there would almost always be an update to download. I couldn't tell you the last time I saw an update to this game, other than the beta for aces high 3, which by the way will never attract enough players to make it worth while. This is really sad, and I can see the end of this game in site.
that is sad.
AH II will not be updated. No reason to as AH III is replacing it soon.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Shuffler on June 27, 2016, 01:42:32 PM
For those that have not been in AH III, the game will change. The bases are different. Even the GV bases have rolling hills on them. You can't see from one side to the other.
If you are on the deck your own base is hard to find since it blends in so well.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FishBait on June 27, 2016, 02:09:46 PM
This is a tough, unforgiving game. So was AirWarrior 2 decades ago. I do know why I stuck with it. Because I wanted to be one of "those" guys. Those guys that killed me over and over and over.
I think we should have a "Training" squad. Some place for people to start, all on the same vox so they may each learn as everyone is asking questions. A place to be with new friends that will most likely become permanent friends even if the squad is not their permanent squad. A squad also registered with FSO's to haul those new guys in there too. It needs a patient and giving CO & XO. They can train together in the TA and the DA knowing they aren't up against a 20 year veteran uberstick that they envision laughing at their deaths.
I think this is an awesome idea, and would be happy to get involved in some capacity if it ever came to fruition.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: pipz on June 27, 2016, 04:08:39 PM
I think this is an awesome idea, and would be happy to get involved in some capacity if it ever came to fruition.
We have this now. It is called the Training Arena.
How much time have you spent there with the new folks? How many new folks actually go to the TA?
I think most new folks go straight to the MA. They do not even read any of the web pages that have info on the most basic controls or commands.
You have to have folks who want to learn before you can teach them anything.
Too many so called free games where you can buy yourself to the top out there. There is no up, down, up, down, left, right, left, right, press a&b button shortcut here.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: whiteman on June 27, 2016, 05:20:39 PM
When AHIII is out I think some oldies will be back and new people will come in as well. I'll make time when it does. If you want to play against the best in this genre, this is the place to go.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Wiley on June 27, 2016, 05:27:09 PM
I think most new folks go straight to the MA. They do not even read any of the web pages that have info on the most basic controls or commands.
It would be a really stellar idea though to have that information in game. Regardless of personal feelings on it, look at 95% of the rest of the games out there. Copious amounts of help and hand holding available in game, right at your fingertips from the first time you start them up. This is what people have come to expect.
Here, the information exists, but it's not right there available for you. You have to go looking for it in relatively obscure places compared to most other games.
Wiley.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: bustr on June 27, 2016, 06:37:45 PM
In the past when we had the numbers, the newbie relied on the mission to hide in and learn the game. The vets relied on the massed mission to provide action if nothing else was going on. The newbie learned the game and air combat by hiding safe in the mission which almost every night many were launched by the well known mission stars of each country. The mission acted as a mentoring process where the newbie could return to with the knowledge that they could gain a few victories or just not get shellacked every time they upped alone.
Fast forward to our low numbers today. It is not like we don't have the numbers for missions. We no longer have many vets who want to do more than wait for action to start up and take advantage of the short window of opportunity to pick people. Or play out their lone wolf fantasies. Newbies have never done very well as a rule learning the game by dueling in the DA. Our current lone wolf mentality by many vets who want the action brought to them will hurt the ability of the game to keep newbies. So you get lame game play directly due to the lack of an in game function that doubles as a mentoring and peer pressure process. Our current vets act as poorly and childish as the newbies they accuse of being the source of all the lame game play in the game that they feel is killing the game. And they all sit back waiting for someone else to get the newbies straightened out and bringing the action to them instead of leading by example with missions.
A very tiny percentage of new subscribers have what it takes to become lone wolf DA stars which is what todays game is forcing on newbies because the vets no longer want to be engaged in creating the action. The majority of newbies will happily keep paying their subscription if they perceive a fun process is in place to hide in until they build the experience to venture off alone. That has always been a 3-18 month process depending on the person. Has no one ever wondered how we kept so many newbies who never went to the TA, or the Wiki, or read anything in the forums over all of those years before 2009?
Today the attitude is that it's some one else's responsibility, and todays vet just wants quick action and screw missions or lead anything to create fun. Newbies like small children do what they see, not what you tell them to do. "We" have let our future newbies and "our" game down with the current general lone wolf screw you attitude.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FishBait on June 27, 2016, 06:56:34 PM
We have this now. It is called the Training Arena.
How much time have you spent there with the new folks? How many new folks actually go to the TA?
I think most new folks go straight to the MA. They do not even read any of the web pages that have info on the most basic controls or commands.
You have to have folks who want to learn before you can teach them anything.
Too many so called free games where you can buy yourself to the top out there. There is no up, down, up, down, left, right, left, right, press a&b button shortcut here.
When you're new you don't know what to do. The online documentation is - or at least was - partial at best, disorganized, with many of the gaps being filled in by the community, meaning you had to know where to look, or go on a google hunt to find it. and hope it wasn't outdated by the time you did.
Ask questions in the text buffer & you may get help, or you may not. Depends on who feels like answering at the time. Sure there's a training arena. Will there be anyone in there? Doubtful. As a new guy I don't even know for sure how the TA is to be used, or if I'm to use it, but the fact it and the DA are empty 90% of the time will likely give me the impression that it's not a usable resource.
Without a doubt - many people don't want to learn. That's what we're getting now. But I strongly believe that the lack of reliable, intuitive resources designed to get new players up to speed in a reasonable timespan is turning a lot of potential players away.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Masherbrum on June 27, 2016, 07:27:23 PM
It would be a really stellar idea though to have that information in game. Regardless of personal feelings on it, look at 95% of the rest of the games out there. Copious amounts of help and hand holding available in game, right at your fingertips from the first time you start them up. This is what people have come to expect.
Here, the information exists, but it's not right there available for you. You have to go looking for it in relatively obscure places compared to most other games.
Wiley.
I would tune the Help Channel, which is number 6. I lost count of the jerks tuned to it and lost chat privs because if the crap they typed.
The Community has be willing to help in the first place. The sad fact is, most won't. I also lost count of hours spent in the TA informerly training newbies, while the "experts" hid under a rock and padded their scores.
I am the one who will give the newbies the free pass and put the responsibility onto those who have been here long enough to know better.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: bustr on June 27, 2016, 08:58:29 PM
Saying that access to learning materials and related things is the problem that keeps newbies from staying with the game is like saying there has to be a law passed to make rednecks smarter while you hide in your gated community. Before 2009 newbies didn't read anything past finding out how to start the engine and get the gear up. They relied on following the missions around and listening to us in the missions.
If learning materials was the answer, anyone by age 10 can read the AH online hand book, look at the clipboard and get into the air. We had sqweekers doing just that up to 2009.
We lazy self indugent vets are the reason the newbies don't stay, and the ones who do won't fight. Because most of the moderate team oriented players willing to create fun left as the fortunes of our economy got bad. And because our community became a 24x7 cess pit of woe is me the newbies are killing this game, I can't find any fights and Hitech is a "bleeping something" because he killed our game.
You guys are the only vets left in the game, and universally you have some truly foul attitudes about the game, Hitech, and other players. So the newer younger players who stay, are just following what you are showing them to do.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: LCADolby on June 27, 2016, 09:15:06 PM
Pigs on the Wing members killed the game. Who in the world wants to read a wall of text that has so much anal... I mean analogies. :o
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: wil3ur on June 27, 2016, 09:35:04 PM
Never read any AH documentation, but I still have a printed copy of In Pursuit laying on my desk. It's not the most informative of materials, but it's a great primer to basic ACM. Everything after that is much better learned by trial and error.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Estes on June 27, 2016, 10:47:10 PM
Hell, if there was online training/manuals that are at least comparable in scope to what we have now when I started I didn't know about them. I was told "get a copy of The Bible" - still have that book somewhere.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Masherbrum on June 27, 2016, 10:58:26 PM
Hell, if there was online training/manuals that are at least comparable in scope to what we have now when I started I didn't know about them. I was told "get a copy of The Bible" - still have that book somewhere.
Finally got mine personalized from the man himself at Dayton in 2008.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: nrshida on June 28, 2016, 01:19:49 AM
Our current lone wolf mentality by many vets who want the action brought to them will hurt the ability of the game to keep newbies. So you get lame game play directly due to the lack of an in game function that doubles as a mentoring and peer pressure process. Our current vets act as poorly and childish as the newbies they accuse of being the source of all the lame game play in the game that they feel is killing the game.
I absolutely disagree. You continue to project your perceptipn onto others. I am a lone-wolf and I do not want the action brought to me or everyone to play my way. I think it's not unreasonable to be able to find some other players who are also looking for combat in a combat simulator. That's the extent of our complaint (even though I don't speak for the others). With numbers so low the percentages of non-combatants proportionally rises.
The core cause for drop in numbers is likely environmental (external to the game, cultural shift, economics, alternative activities). The internal cause is disatisfied players which can't be caused by the minotity you persistantly and unwaveringly attack, because as I've mentioned already, you can't force someone to dogfight. But of course you take every opportunity to blame the players who you can apparently only view as exploiters.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Brooke on June 28, 2016, 01:26:31 AM
Saying that access to learning materials and related things is the problem that keeps newbies from staying with the game is like saying there has to be a law passed to make rednecks smarter while you hide in your gated community. Before 2009 newbies didn't read anything past finding out how to start the engine and get the gear up. They relied on following the missions around and listening to us in the missions.
If learning materials was the answer, anyone by age 10 can read the AH online hand book, look at the clipboard and get into the air. We had sqweekers doing just that up to 2009.
We lazy self indugent vets are the reason the newbies don't stay, and the ones who do won't fight. Because most of the moderate team oriented players willing to create fun left as the fortunes of our economy got bad. And because our community became a 24x7 cess pit of woe is me the newbies are killing this game, I can't find any fights and Hitech is a "bleeping something" because he killed our game.
You guys are the only vets left in the game, and universally you have some truly foul attitudes about the game, Hitech, and other players. So the newer younger players who stay, are just following what you are showing them to do.
Who, exactly, are you talking to?
Perhaps it would be best if you just threw out the names of the players in question instead of casting a net over all the 'vets', so as not to cause any undue confusion. Right now you're painting with a pretty broad brush.
You know as well as I do that if you're not one of a handful of select members, no-one's going to join your missions. And if you're a knight - even if you are one of those select people - most times you won't get enough signed up to matter. I've tried in the past. After the 50th or so time of being ignored, I gave up. But yeah, it's our fault.
Speaking of POTW - my countrymen! I love your squad and its members. That being said, I'm not exactly seeing much in the way of POTW missions in my timezone. And by not much I mean pretty much none at all. At least not enough to be memorable. But yeah, it's our fault.
I routinely salute my opponents, PM them suggestions, and offer assistance in the TA/DA when I feel they might benefit from it. To date I haven't been taken up on an offer yet. I'm sure that's my fault too. Perhaps I should stop being lazy & self-indulgent, get off my butt, and go take some charm lessons. Because while I'm not sure why no-one seems interested in learning, I know now that it's surely my fault.
Alchemists are still running missions like clockwork, yes? Just like they always have. I was an alchemist for about a week when I first started. It is a great way to get noobs in the game. It's also a great way to learn to horde & ho (If that's your thing. It wasn't my thing so I left early.). They have the opportunity to teach new members the ropes, and instead they teach them gameplay tactics which further undermine everyone's fun but theirs. I guess it's their fault for not running missions right. Or maybe my fault again for allowing them to run them wrong?
Even if everything you assume is true - that it is all our fault - I don't think your plan of chastising everyone into complete agreement is going to work. So while it may be cathartic, this exercise doesn't have much hope of changing the current state of affairs. But by all means, give it a shot. I suggest we start with the aforementioned Alchemists, since they likely have one of (if not the) highest missions participation rates in the game. You get to browbeating them, and I'm sure that before long they'll be raising our newbie chicks up in a proper environment.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: DmonSlyr on June 28, 2016, 09:13:36 AM
All this game needs is a few adjustments to the maps. A few new maps, an easy adjustment to the DA (furball area) where the fields are all green and there is no alt cap. 5 bases 5 miles apart for easy upping, no vulching, no ack hugging, and nothing but FFA madness. It would bring in a lot of players and create excitement. Then just a few tweaks to the MA maps. Less 25k mountains. 15 mile apart bases, funneled action such that you see on festers map, just a lil bit smaller parameters. I promise you would see a lot more people involved in the game. It has nothing to do with the players as much as it does the layout and playability of the maps. It's an easy fix.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Wiley on June 28, 2016, 09:39:58 AM
I would tune the Help Channel, which is number 6. I lost count of the jerks tuned to it and lost chat privs because if the crap they typed.
The Community has be willing to help in the first place. The sad fact is, most won't. I also lost count of hours spent in the TA informerly training newbies, while the "experts" hid under a rock and padded their scores.
I am the one who will give the newbies the free pass and put the responsibility onto those who have been here long enough to know better.
The sad fact is, most people aren't GOOD at it. Just because someone is decent at the game doesn't mean they can impart how to do what they do to another person. I know I'm one of them. If people have specific questions I can and usually do answer them. But when the question is "how do I get better?" I've got very little.
Wiley.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: JunkyII on June 28, 2016, 10:24:43 AM
Saying that access to learning materials and related things is the problem that keeps newbies from staying with the game is like saying there has to be a law passed to make rednecks smarter while you hide in your gated community. Before 2009 newbies didn't read anything past finding out how to start the engine and get the gear up. They relied on following the missions around and listening to us in the missions.
If learning materials was the answer, anyone by age 10 can read the AH online hand book, look at the clipboard and get into the air. We had sqweekers doing just that up to 2009.
We lazy self indugent vets are the reason the newbies don't stay, and the ones who do won't fight. Because most of the moderate team oriented players willing to create fun left as the fortunes of our economy got bad. And because our community became a 24x7 cess pit of woe is me the newbies are killing this game, I can't find any fights and Hitech is a "bleeping something" because he killed our game.
You guys are the only vets left in the game, and universally you have some truly foul attitudes about the game, Hitech, and other players. So the newer younger players who stay, are just following what you are showing them to do.
I probably am considered to have a foul attitude so I'll bite.
The "lone wolfs" are normally the guys who bring POTW pretty good fights in the MA especially when we up in mass, not many of the other big squads up against us anymore for long...When's the last time Jokers stayed around to fight us?? :ahand
Most long timers I have issues with are just hypocrits or the way they play the game is truly toxic(bomb bailers,La7 runway vulchers, ect ect)....hell Sawzaw HOed me last night in a 2 v 1 even though I've personally received PMs from him about how Im a "c0rk sucker" for an HO...I've never done it, wingman might have :) (I thought we were cool after our DA encounter Saw??? I mean yea I probably was going to kill you and him but at least it would have been a good fight)
My biggest problems with the game right now are Resupply, and Man gun usage....I think Resupply should take longer to get initial town buildings up, and Man guns should not be enabled until VH or FHs are down. Resupply Solution would give base takers a better chance to take a field that was probaby not defended in the first place...which would cause people to start upping to defend more....With a restriction on man guns people would up more whirbs right??? Well at least it would be a scored sortie and the perks for the attacker would be higher.
Sent this from my phone so probably filled with mistakes lol.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: JunkyII on June 28, 2016, 11:00:27 AM
Perhaps it would be best if you just threw out the names of the players in question instead of casting a net over all the 'vets', so as not to cause any undue confusion. Right now you're painting with a pretty broad brush.
You know as well as I do that if you're not one of a handful of select members, no-one's going to join your missions. And if you're a knight - even if you are one of those select people - most times you won't get enough signed up to matter. I've tried in the past. After the 50th or so time of being ignored, I gave up. But yeah, it's our fault.
Speaking of POTW - my countrymen! I love your squad and its members. That being said, I'm not exactly seeing much in the way of POTW missions in my timezone. And by not much I mean pretty much none at all. At least not enough to be memorable. But yeah, it's our fault.
I routinely salute my opponents, PM them suggestions, and offer assistance in the TA/DA when I feel they might benefit from it. To date I haven't been taken up on an offer yet. I'm sure that's my fault too. Perhaps I should stop being lazy & self-indulgent, get off my butt, and go take some charm lessons. Because while I'm not sure why no-one seems interested in learning, I know now that it's surely my fault.
Alchemists are still running missions like clockwork, yes? Just like they always have. I was an alchemist for about a week when I first started. It is a great way to get noobs in the game. It's also a great way to learn to horde & ho (If that's your thing. It wasn't my thing so I left early.). They have the opportunity to teach new members the ropes, and instead they teach them gameplay tactics which further undermine everyone's fun but theirs. I guess it's their fault for not running missions right. Or maybe my fault again for allowing them to run them wrong?
Even if everything you assume is true - that it is all our fault - I don't think your plan of chastising everyone into complete agreement is going to work. So while it may be cathartic, this exercise doesn't have much hope of changing the current state of affairs. But by all means, give it a shot. I suggest we start with the aforementioned Alchemists, since they likely have one of (if not the) highest missions participation rates in the game. You get to browbeating them, and I'm sure that before long they'll be raising our newbie chicks up in a proper environment.
FishBait, get that knife away from POTW. Unless you've flown on our squad vox, just assume you know nothing about us. Most of our mission, which we refer to as Pig mass....are normally only pigs and people hanging on our vox. This isn't because we don't like the Knights or something but we do understand the size of our squad with another 12-15 countrymen creates an unstoppable horde...one that isn't fun for either side...yea the land grabbers get a base but was the fight for it worth it???EDIT: (Have you ever seen a base with all of POTW and JG11 over it??? Awesome to see that much cohesion in an attack group but literally there ain't enough red guys to go around...we hungry!!! )
We run pig missions and Waystin posts here every Tuesday "visitors are welcome, PM a pig in game for vox channel" not many visitors show up these days and don't stay for good...we have a good time and I know for at least my part...try to make it enjoyable for everyone too.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: guncrasher on June 28, 2016, 11:24:30 AM
fishbait, what time zone are you on? we have squad knight every tuesday at 5 pst. we participate in every fso. saturday knights you will see us from 5 or 6 pst till early morning.
semp
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FishBait on June 28, 2016, 12:06:07 PM
FishBait, get that knife away from POTW. Unless you've flown on our squad vox, just assume you know nothing about us. Most of our mission, which we refer to as Pig mass....are normally only pigs and people hanging on our vox. This isn't because we don't like the Knights or something but we do understand the size of our squad with another 12-15 countrymen creates an unstoppable horde...one that isn't fun for either side...yea the land grabbers get a base but was the fight for it worth it???EDIT: (Have you ever seen a base with all of POTW and JG11 over it??? Awesome to see that much cohesion in an attack group but literally there ain't enough red guys to go around...we hungry!!! )
We run pig missions and Waystin posts here every Tuesday "visitors are welcome, PM a pig in game for vox channel" not many visitors show up these days and don't stay for good...we have a good time and I know for at least my part...try to make it enjoyable for everyone too.
I fail to see how anything I said was attacking the pigs, Junky, but if you or other squaddies took offense, none was intended. I always enjoy fighting alongside y'all. Nor was I attacking bustr. But I'm not going to sit back while someone essentially labels me an idiot without getting in my .02.
You yourself just admitted you don't see much interest in pig-hosted missions anymore (outside the pigs), but 'We' are all to blame for not hosting missions (which will garner ZERO interest)? That doesn't compute. Failing to engage in pointless endeavors does not make one the blame for anything. I couldn't convince people to join a mission a year ago. You think that's going to change now with a fraction of the players?
Good on the Pigs for hosting weekly missions. I never meant to undermine the effort.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FishBait on June 28, 2016, 12:10:21 PM
fishbait, what time zone are you on? we have squad knight every tuesday at 5 pst. we participate in every fso. saturday knights you will see us from 5 or 6 pst till early morning.
semp
I'm 180-degress reversed from y'all Semp. Hardly ever get the chance to play on weekends and on weekdays I work mostly at night and play during the day. But eventually I'll be on during those timeframes, so I'll hit you up :cheers
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: DmonSlyr on June 28, 2016, 12:14:56 PM
All this game needs is a few adjustments to the maps. A few new maps, an easy adjustment to the DA (furball area) where the fields are all green and there is no alt cap. 5 bases 5 miles apart for easy upping, no vulching, no ack hugging, and nothing but FFA madness. It would bring in a lot of players and create excitement. Then just a few tweaks to the MA maps. Less 25k mountains. 15 mile apart bases, funneled action such that you see on festers map, just a lil bit smaller parameters. I promise you would see a lot more people involved in the game. It has nothing to do with the players as much as it does the layout and playability of the maps. It's an easy fix.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Zoney on June 28, 2016, 12:16:29 PM
I'm 180-degress reversed from y'all Semp. Hardly ever get the chance to play on weekends and on weekdays I work mostly at night and play during the day. But eventually I'll be on during those timeframes, so I'll hit you up :cheers
Burn the Vampire !!!
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Wiley on June 28, 2016, 12:17:07 PM
I'm 180-degress reversed from y'all Semp. Hardly ever get the chance to play on weekends and on weekdays I work mostly at night and play during the day. But eventually I'll be on during those timeframes, so I'll hit you up :cheers
I feel for you man. Being on during north american daytime just flat out sucks. NA primetime is hit or miss but generally much better. Daytime it's "milkrunners ahoy" and very few of them.
Wiley.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Shuffler on June 28, 2016, 12:38:12 PM
Had some fun in AH III last night. It is what you make it.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FishBait on June 28, 2016, 12:55:28 PM
I feel for you man. Being on during north american daytime just flat out sucks. NA primetime is hit or miss but generally much better. Daytime it's "milkrunners ahoy" and very few of them.
Wiley.
Agreed. It used to be nice (to me). Just the right amount of players to make for good dogfights but not so many it became an arcade. But yeah, now it's a graveyard. My brit friends are dropping like flies.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Masherbrum on June 28, 2016, 12:59:47 PM
The sad fact is, most people aren't GOOD at it. Just because someone is decent at the game doesn't mean they can impart how to do what they do to another person. I know I'm one of them. If people have specific questions I can and usually do answer them. But when the question is "how do I get better?" I've got very little.
Wiley.
I completely understand and helped quite a few deaf players. I would literally correlate what I was doing, as well as set the table and provide the person options at each major point of engagement. So when they went back and their interpreter signed it back, they would have a good understanding. People have no clue as to how many days were spent doing this. It was very mentally draining and I still enjoyed helping them. But the sacrifice was one of after I was done? I was not hopping into the MA. But I was ok with the sacrifice per se. I was thanked by a very accomplished stick who was also deaf (I will divulge). Which made what I was doing worth it. I started out merely helping Ghosth, who was swamped and needed help. I was ignored with becoming an official trainer, but did it unofficially to try and make the game that much better.
Always considered myself average in skill. Shot down the best, shot down by newbies. Wiley, you and I have butted heads on this BBS in the past and can honestly say that I have always appreciated your honesty. No fluff, just telling it like it is and it is why some do not like me. I am the same way.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: JunkyII on June 28, 2016, 01:05:33 PM
I fail to see how anything I said was attacking the pigs, Junky, but if you or other squaddies took offense, none was intended. I always enjoy fighting alongside y'all. Nor was I attacking bustr. But I'm not going to sit back while someone essentially labels me an idiot without getting in my .02.
You yourself just admitted you don't see much interest in pig-hosted missions anymore (outside the pigs), but 'We' are all to blame for not hosting missions (which will garner ZERO interest)? That doesn't compute. Failing to engage in pointless endeavors does not make one the blame for anything. I couldn't convince people to join a mission a year ago. You think that's going to change now with a fraction of the players?
Good on the Pigs for hosting weekly missions. I never meant to undermine the effort.
Came off that way, Just saying don't judge it by the opinion of one person in the squad before hanging out with us on channel...as I've already posted I disagree with Bustr here. Missions unfortunately are a thing of the past...like you said only a few select people can up them, and they need to keep doing them for people to join, which seems unfair to them. I didn't say we don't get interest, get plenty of tag a longs in our missions...a lot of which join up (Sounds like 9 years ago...a young Junky1 following POTWs mission around until they invited me to squad :) )
I think bustr is mainly mad at the vets giving HTC a hard time, who don't put anything good into the game...or don't even play really. It's amazing that a lot of vets are in the MA talking about bad frames in Beta but haven't been in there since HTC did some more patches.....so they are complaining about something HTC and the testers (bustr is up there for most hours spent testing AH3 for sure) have already fixed....that doesn't help the game....I think that's what he is mainly getting at....some of his post confused me to be honest, but most of his posts do....I can't read Bustr, hes easier to talk to :aok
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: JunkyII on June 28, 2016, 01:23:02 PM
I also lost count of hours spent in the TA informerly training newbies, while the "experts" hid under a rock and padded their scores.
I find it hard to believe many of the top sticks throughout your time in Aces High have ignored those wanting to learn, just from my experience with a lot of the better sticks they are right away ready to tell someone what they did wrong if they ask for it. I hardly ever see anyone in the TA or DA anymore, normally stick my nose just incase something fun is going on. You know there are committed trainers when you go into the TA to find only trainers in there :)
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Masherbrum on June 28, 2016, 01:30:53 PM
Most will not be bothered by it. Sorry that you disagree. But if more stepped up then? This game would be entirely different.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FishBait on June 28, 2016, 01:32:52 PM
Always considered myself average in skill. Shot down the best, shot down by newbies. Wiley, you and I have butted heads on this BBS in the past and can honestly say that I have always appreciated your honesty. No fluff, just telling it like it is and it is why some do not like me. I am the same way.
Being good at explaining/training people quite often has little to do with your abilities in game past a certain point. Some of the best most patient trainers I've seen were quite good sticks, but not tip top shelf. Occasionally you'll see someone who's really good who's also really good at explaining it but most of the time from what I've seen, the student kind of needs to have a pretty good understanding of things to get what they're saying.
Patience and being able to explain effectively is my downfall. If the person "gets" the way I explain things, it's ok but I have trouble explaining it in an alternative way if they don't.
Any time we've interacted, at worst it was no more than differences of opinion though. Hehe, I don't consider that "butting heads", merely rubbing up against different ideas. That is going to happen on the internet. I'm also definitely a fan of directness and honesty though, and have noticed that about you as well. :salute
Wiley.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FLS on June 28, 2016, 03:48:27 PM
I still lament the loss of FFB stick vibration in lieu of the stall horn for deaf players.
I completely agree with you on this aspect and used to have a squaddie that used padlock. Maybe the third installment might have features which can help assist in these areas.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Goth on June 29, 2016, 02:05:22 PM
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: nooby52 on June 29, 2016, 04:30:18 PM
One of the best trolls I've seen in a while. With a single post tboy1972 got a lot of folks stirred up, and he hasn't had the decency to show again in 8 pages of replies. :noid
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: bustr on June 29, 2016, 04:48:34 PM
He also channeled Donald Trump with his syntax. Reminds me of one of the several extra forum accounts some old vets kept going to run blind siding trolls like this.
What is it with all of these ex players who want Hitech to fail? When AH3 goes live they are going to sneak in on 2 week accounts to play for free. Then troll everyone here in the forums to help sow discord while all the complaints are registered over bugs or how the new game plays.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Masherbrum on June 29, 2016, 06:14:45 PM
I have always tried to help the community, as my posts in here state. But expected a few sentences to sting a little. I want Dale to succeed. If you think otherwise, I suggest revisiting a comprehension class or two. Mind you, I will only speak for myself.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: bustr on June 29, 2016, 06:36:18 PM
I have always tried to help the community, as my posts in here state. But expected a few sentences to sting a little. I want Dale to succeed. If you think otherwise, I suggest revisiting a comprehension class or two. Mind you, I will only speak for myself.
So is the OP's account yours then?
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Masherbrum on June 29, 2016, 07:16:03 PM
What is it with all of these ex players who want Hitech to fail?
You left that portion open to interpretation. I have left and still try to help. That is difference between players and community. But I never wanted chit, nor asked for anything when I helped others in the 13 years I played.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: bustr on June 29, 2016, 07:53:35 PM
I have always tried to help the community, as my posts in here state. But expected a few sentences to sting a little. I want Dale to succeed. If you think otherwise, I suggest revisiting a comprehension class or two. Mind you, I will only speak for myself.
This is confusing at "face value" to why you need to defend your actions inside of a troll by another person than yourself. Why does everyone in this forum hop into other peoples posts and set themselves up to be victims aside from the responses to the OP? It's like watching Jerry Springer live at Aces High with everyone needing to tell the audience they once stole milk from kittens at the SPCA so the audience will feel their pain.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Masherbrum on June 29, 2016, 08:18:09 PM
I gave my two cents and left it at that. Wiley and FLS knew what I replied about and I left it at that. I swallowed no hook, nor did I pile on anything.
Edit: Nothing to get pissy about either. Enjoy life and pop into the TA and help out.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: nrshida on June 30, 2016, 12:33:16 AM
I had a ffb stick back in aw. it was very nice. specially when trying to bomb cv's. the ack would make you feel as if you were in a real airplane.
semp
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Lazerr on June 30, 2016, 01:36:19 AM
lol this isn't a troll :rolleyes:
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: bustr on June 30, 2016, 11:43:32 AM
Those two eyeballs look trolly....... :rolleyes:
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: DmonSlyr on June 30, 2016, 07:50:38 PM
Bustr, if I was retired and didnt have watermelon to do, Id help make a map. I simply don't have the time. All I can do it throw out ideas based on experience with game play, that I think will enhance the level of excitement people will enjoy on the maps. Thus making more people excited to play the game and get involved in the action. Like I said earlier, I'd love to see a dedicated map team so we can stop playing the same, what 8 maps, we have now. It doesn't matter if maps get rolled in 1 day, what matters is if people have fun and are involved in the fights.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FLS on June 30, 2016, 10:34:06 PM
See Rule #4
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Masherbrum on June 30, 2016, 11:48:36 PM
What is it with all of these ex players who want Hitech to fail? When AH3 goes live they are going to sneak in on 2 week accounts to play for free. Then troll everyone here in the forums to help sow discord while all the complaints are registered over bugs or how the new game plays.
Its time to come up for a breath bustr.. You've been down there too long. There is no mass number of ex players wanting the game to fail. There is no conspiracy against the game or HT.
This game failed to evolve with the gaming industry around it.. I'm not casting shadows in any direction. Some have said today's gamer doesn't care about ww2 A/C or the game is too hard. Crazy talk if you ask me. How many signed up for the new battlefield ww1 game? World of planes and all that? I'm pretty certain it's a tall number. If you guys sit and tell yourselves that those games don't require time and patience to become skilled in you're dead wrong.. People continue playing them because the games give the consumer what is desired. If folks move on from this game because it is not giving what is desired you can't really blame the player. We can point fingers and proclaim righteousness but in the end none of it matters.
I still have the same account I opened ~15years ago. I'm waiting on the next installment and still hope for more evolution than just a prettier picture. I certainly do have an agenda though. First and foremost I'd hope the community's (my side of the community of course) ideas would be better heard. I can't say that none of the ideas where heard. I can just say that the ideas I liked were not heard.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: TwinBoom on July 01, 2016, 06:18:45 AM
Personally I'd rather see more new planes. Terrain is fine now, looks great at 15k where I like to fight. :cheers:
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FLS on July 01, 2016, 08:09:17 AM
I just keep pumping my $14.99 per month into the AH coffers hoping we will all enjoy the results of AH III.
Hiya Patches !
I keep looking for the fun. Yesterday I spent the afternoon defending against some Bish..... mostly some "clowns" :D Lots of HOs, divebombing TU2 ack runners and so on. Won't mention the ganging as I was 1 of only a few defending, so my choice, but still they flew for the mission. Throwing away planes on lawndarting or just getting hammered by ack, no fight in them at all. Once they got the field shut down.... usually to the tune or a dozen or so suicides then they would it the town and grab the base to move on at another.
I just dont understand the point of avoiding all fights just to grab a base. I like taking base and did so later that night, but fighting for them is a LOT more fun, which is what we did. Sure we didn't roll 6-8 bases in an hour or so, but the 3-4 we did get were fun fights.
So far in AH3 it looks like the GV game may be tweaked a bit with better hiding, more hills and trees and buildings so that may be more fun. The HQ is better protected so it may cure that issue. I hope there are some tweaks that change up how players play the air game, leaning more towards the combat side of things instead of the "RUN AWAY!!!!!!! type of play we have now.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Changeup on July 03, 2016, 08:53:56 PM
Hiya Patches ! So far in AH3 it looks like the GV game may be tweaked a bit with better hiding, more hills and trees and buildings so that may be more fun. The HQ is better protected so it may cure that issue. I hope there are some tweaks that change up how players play the air game, leaning more towards the combat side of things instead of the "RUN AWAY!!!!!!! type of play we have now.
Not going to happen. It still remains a game of capture the flag. If the road system and river systems remain meaningless, that is they can not be used to develop strategy , there are no required bridges that must be held or destroyed to help one defend or attack the enemy.
Imagen if the road system leading to the town created chock points that could be defended by infantry and tanks, with air support. That bridges along this road system would require a new type of troop to repair or rebuild, like combat engineers. Bridges that could be attacked and destroyed by Troops or aircraft.
A resupply system that actually impacted game play with each airfield or Vehicle base having its own supply depot that was connected to the main supply system and transport trucks and C47s , resupply trains , moving supplies between depots. That each side could attack and attempt to interrupt the supply, more targets to attack, more targets to defend, more fights.
Changes to the game itself. Perhaps an association between hangers and the type of aircraft available at that airfield. Hangers that perhaps could be rebuilt or repaired by the combat engineers stationed on that field. With each hanger supporting a defined set of aircraft. Supply enough combat engineers to a base and the destroyed hangers would recover in half the time.
My fear is that after all is said and done, we will end up with a air combat simulator with pretty grass and sky with sunsets and the game will still be the same old capture the flag game play with nothing new in game play.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Tumor on July 05, 2016, 10:47:45 AM
I keep looking for the fun. Yesterday I spent the afternoon defending against some Bish..... mostly some "clowns" :D Lots of HOs, divebombing TU2 ack runners and so on. Won't mention the ganging as I was 1 of only a few defending, so my choice, but still they flew for the mission. Throwing away planes on lawndarting or just getting hammered by ack, no fight in them at all. Once they got the field shut down.... usually to the tune or a dozen or so suicides then they would it the town and grab the base to move on at another.
I just dont understand the point of avoiding all fights just to grab a base. I like taking base and did so later that night, but fighting for them is a LOT more fun, which is what we did. Sure we didn't roll 6-8 bases in an hour or so, but the 3-4 we did get were fun fights.
NONE of this is anything new. And it's because the game (HTC) always has and always will reward suicidal lameness in the game. What middle ground is there? What choice do they have? Take away the easy-mode assault by suicide and a huge chunk of the subscription base stomps off to other less than challenging pastures. I don't think you can fix lame... it's a DNA thing. :mad:
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Slate on July 05, 2016, 11:03:24 AM
Dangle a carrot, F2P ww1, When the noobs get a taste of AH they will hunger for more. Let the addiction :x begin like any good dealer. :bolt:
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Lazerr on July 05, 2016, 12:14:48 PM
H2H was a good tool to get into the game before coming to the MA to get whaled on by vets.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: LilMak on July 05, 2016, 12:34:13 PM
Problem with H2H was some if us spent years there because we were getting our fix. Think I made it a week before the withdrawals started giving me the shakes and I paid up. Think HT should consider what cable companies and dating sites do. Have random, free to all, weeks advertised to get people hooked.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Traveler on July 05, 2016, 12:46:10 PM
Dangle a carrot, F2P ww1, When the noobs get a taste of AH they will hunger for more. Let the addiction :x begin like any good dealer. :bolt:
WWI, that was a arena well worth the investment. I haven't seen anyone in the WWI arena for more than six months now. I'm sure it is being used, but that was a business decision that didn't pan out very well.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FLS on July 05, 2016, 12:54:48 PM
WWI, that was a arena well worth the investment. I haven't seen anyone in the WWI arena for more than six months now. I'm sure it is being used, but that was a business decision that didn't pan out very well.
I think bombs and targets would perk up the WW1 arena. Also using scout aircraft in reveal the location of ground targets would create historical conflicts beyond simply dogfighting.
Btw you can't bail from the WW1 aircraft. :D
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Ack-Ack on July 05, 2016, 01:08:16 PM
Not going to happen. It still remains a game of capture the flag. If the road system and river systems remain meaningless, that is they can not be used to develop strategy , there are no required bridges that must be held or destroyed to help one defend or attack the enemy.
Imagen if the road system leading to the town created chock points that could be defended by infantry and tanks, with air support. That bridges along this road system would require a new type of troop to repair or rebuild, like combat engineers. Bridges that could be attacked and destroyed by Troops or aircraft.
A resupply system that actually impacted game play with each airfield or Vehicle base having its own supply depot that was connected to the main supply system and transport trucks and C47s , resupply trains , moving supplies between depots. That each side could attack and attempt to interrupt the supply, more targets to attack, more targets to defend, more fights.
Changes to the game itself. Perhaps an association between hangers and the type of aircraft available at that airfield. Hangers that perhaps could be rebuilt or repaired by the combat engineers stationed on that field. With each hanger supporting a defined set of aircraft. Supply enough combat engineers to a base and the destroyed hangers would recover in half the time.
My fear is that after all is said and done, we will end up with a air combat simulator with pretty grass and sky with sunsets and the game will still be the same old capture the flag game play with nothing new in game play.
The road and train system are being re-worked and HiTech has mentioned about using the bridges as choke points (though not destructible) to help funnel the action of the GV war. Not sure if the new road/train system has been implemented yet, think that is planned for later down the line.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: bustr on July 05, 2016, 01:45:53 PM
Traveler install the beta, go offline and up at A1. Fly over the village with the maproom that has a river ringing it. Count the bridges which are the primary way to get at that village from the ground. There are new bridge objects in AH3 waiting for rivers. Taking part in the beta would have kept you updated on more than these whizzing matches about AH3 "what if's" if you wanted to do more than attack Hitech with any opportunity you can leverage.
You can install the beta and open the skin viewer to review all objects available to AH3 as of that patch. There have already been some in depth discussions by terrain builders and Hitech about the new bridge objects in the beta forum if you bothered to read in there. Hitech has been very supportive of their questions and fixing issues they find.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Brooke on July 06, 2016, 03:15:03 PM
WWII is the optimum Goldilocks zone of air combat.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Chilli on July 06, 2016, 03:21:09 PM
WWI, that was a arena well worth the investment. I haven't seen anyone in the WWI arena for more than six months now. I'm sure it is being used, but that was a business decision that didn't pan out very well.
Several things can attribute to low numbers, but I have to say it was indeed worth it (and I hardly ever fly there).
First, if you ever are able to fly there with more than 4-5 people it is a blast. The pilot animations, graphic details, WWI aircraft flight model and plane damage model were all advances. The team fulfilled one of the most wished for wishlist items, confirmed by a survey of then active players.
As for not panning out, only when the Main Arena is shut down or resetting will you see other arenas with significant population (excluding special events arenas). The learning curve with WWI aircraft might actually be higher than AH2 WW2 aircraft. Due to the flight characteristics, a new joystick mode needs to be setup. And there is the obvious, an unpopulated arena will most likely stay unpopulated.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Vinkman on July 06, 2016, 03:43:55 PM
I'd love to think that tweaks to game play and Graphics will solve the numbers issues and I pray it's true. But I wonder if the art of aerial combat in piston engine fighters with machine guns is something that only appeals to a group of people over a certain age.
The new generation of gamers has no idea why it would be interesting to them. The Genre is losing its base because we're all getting older, and unfortunately fewer in number.
I think we are simply a dying breed. :salute
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Brooke on July 06, 2016, 04:23:39 PM
We have to figure out how to get some of those people over here.
Spread the gospel and teach the noobs. Would love to see some form of H2H return with AH3. I know for a fact that used to work more effectively than the 2 week free trial as far as ultimately turning spectators into customers.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: LCADolby on July 06, 2016, 06:52:26 PM
Spread the gospel and teach the noobs. Would love to see some form of H2H return with AH3. I know for a fact that used to work more effectively than the 2 week free trial as far as ultimately turning spectators into customers.
I doubt we will ever see the free H2H arenas any more. HTC moved them to the secure side of the server so only those with a subscription will be able to use them. A stand alone H2H setup won't work either as Im sure HTC won't allow their software to be outside their control.
No what we have is what we are GOING to have at this point.
What they are going to need is a build up of anticipation for AH3. They will have to drive this and along these line we can help. Once they hired someone for the "Social network" side of things I thought they were moving forward. They even started up loading more pictures and videos, but have since dropped back to nothing.
They are going to need a build up of info and posts to generate more interest in THIS game over the others. We can help here by retweeting, reposting, liking and so on. No one knows when AH3 is going to go live except HTC.... even they I'm sure couldn't pin point a day if they had to. The point is they should be able to narrow it down to a season, maybe a month. Count backwards from that a few weeks and start pushing the info out on social media. Pictures, videos, and most importantly ACTION!
No more videos of sunrises, no more videos of the scratches in the canopy, ACTION! While the accomplishment of the HTC staff in building a great graphics update is awesome, people want action! Bombs hitting builds, bombs hitting GVs, planes firing on planes, stuff blowing up.
Our job, re tweet the posts, like the post and share, even if it is only with guys we know already play. Other friends of theirs will see them and it may start a conversation in different circles.
A few weeks before the release HTC should launch what ever "Ad Campaign" they plan to launch. Update their front page on the web page with some flashy art announcing the launching of AH3! Big and bold FREE! 2 weeks is ok, but Id go with 4 myself. Give these guys use to WarBlunder some time to see how much better AH is for flying. Give the guys World of Tanks a chance to see how big the battles CAN be.
In the game, there has to be more monitoring. We have too many bullies here. MODs do the best they can with the few that seem to be on these days. We can help here too. .report xxxxx Remember it, and use it. You see someone bulling a newbi, REPORT IT. Friendly banter is ok and is expected, but harassing players is out of the question. Any one remember the movie "RoadHouse"? The bar starts out as a dive and ends up..... once they get rid of the low lifes and top notch party place with a waiting line to get in. Report the lowlifes and before you know it they wont be chasing away the new customers.
You want the game to be better, to succeed as AH3? Be part of the solution, not part of the problem.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: LCADolby on July 07, 2016, 11:59:21 AM
No more videos of sunrises, no more videos of the scratches in the canopy, ACTION! While the accomplishment of the HTC staff in building a great graphics update is awesome, people want action! Bombs hitting builds, bombs hitting GVs, planes firing on planes, stuff blowing up.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Tumor on July 07, 2016, 12:28:58 PM
No... there does not. AH is already one of the most nannified games around, and you want more of these hidden HTC sycophants running around? No, they create more problems than they're solve.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Wiley on July 07, 2016, 12:42:30 PM
No... there does not. AH is already one of the most nannified games around, and you want more of these hidden HTC sycophants running around? No, they create more problems than they're solve.
I'd be ok with no channel rules if they'd give us the tools to squelch whatever we want for as long as we want. As it stands now we don't have those tools, the tools on 200 are bigger and more prolific.
"Bullying" in an online game is going to happen. Trying to moderate the way people treat each other is an exercise in futility IMO.
Wiley.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Tumor on July 07, 2016, 01:32:10 PM
I'd be ok with no channel rules if they'd give us the tools to squelch whatever we want for as long as we want. As it stands now we don't have those tools, the tools on 200 are bigger and more prolific.
"Bullying" in an online game is going to happen. Trying to moderate the way people treat each other is an exercise in futility IMO.
Wiley.
Totally agree regarding Futility.
IMO, if HTC would cough up the dough and have a paying "moderator" position.... stick a badge on them and utilize PRESENCE as opposed to the cowardly hidey crap Mods have now, they might become a useful entity in-game. As it stands, they're like a useless yet harassing version of speed-trap cops.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FLS on July 07, 2016, 02:15:22 PM
No... there does not. AH is already one of the most nannified games around, and you want more of these hidden HTC sycophants running around? No, they create more problems than they're solve.
Nannying refers to treating adults like children. Aces High expects players to act like adults.
I realize there is some confusion about what constitutes adult behavior since the word "adult" is also used to mean "not suitable for children". When you consider adulthood as mature self-control then you can see how it applies to players of all ages.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Masherbrum on July 07, 2016, 03:03:55 PM
Nannying refers to treating adults like children. Aces High expects players to act like adults.
I realize there is some confusion about what constitutes adult behavior since the word "adult" is also used to mean "not suitable for children". When you consider adulthood as mature self-control then you can see how it applies to players of all ages.
Well put FLS.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Wiley on July 07, 2016, 03:10:07 PM
Yes, but we don't know how to get more people doing that and how to do it more effectively than it is being done currently.
As I said, by everyone taking responsibility and reporting those that cant seem to act like adults. Either they will get tired of being muted over and over again and change their behavior, or they will leave.
Kids have always gotten a "by". Players use to take the time so say... "easy on the radio, we don't need to hear everything that runs through your mind" or what ever other thing they did that is getting out of line. This is how they learn and it is up us to teach them.
Adults on the other hand sometime have a bit of a problem when they are hiding behind their computer. Be it alcohol or what ever some just get out of hand and even if you ask them to settle down they get get all puffed up in indignation. We can police the arenas just as well as a mod. Use the .report command
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Brooke on July 07, 2016, 06:42:38 PM
As I said, by everyone taking responsibility and reporting those that cant seem to act like adults.
OK, but that doesn't solve how we get more people into recruiting or indicate how we get more traction on getting people over here from War Thunder, World of Warplanes, Il-2, etc.
There is a huge number of people playing those games. It seems like there should be ways of getting some of them over here, but I don't know what would be effective in that regard.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Tumor on July 07, 2016, 06:44:39 PM
Nannying refers to treating adults like children. Aces High expects players to act like adults.
I realize there is some confusion about what constitutes adult behavior since the word "adult" is also used to mean "not suitable for children". When you consider adulthood as mature self-control then you can see how it applies to players of all ages.
if we were to act as adults, we wouldnt be playing video games. specially when you consider some of us have spent a good chunk of money to play to be pilots.
semp
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Estes on July 07, 2016, 08:38:31 PM
Jeez, you guys need to relax take a break or something. At the end of the day, throw a thousand posts with suggestions about what to do or not do... (https://i.imgflip.com/172iic.jpg)
I don't think a lot of the people complaining about the numbers (or lack thereof as the case may be) realize what a niche market this is comparatively.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: The Fugitive on July 07, 2016, 09:14:00 PM
OK, but that doesn't solve how we get more people into recruiting or indicate how we get more traction on getting people over here from War Thunder, World of Warplanes, Il-2, etc.
There is a huge number of people playing those games. It seems like there should be ways of getting some of them over here, but I don't know what would be effective in that regard.
Thats where getting the word out comes in. HTC needs to step up the info about the beta, and really ramp it up just before it's release. Picture the ads you see for movies. Even a crappy movie can have a good first weekend if the hype is built up enough.
Dolby should make a few short movies in the beta and post them. 30 seconds, lots of action. Once posted everyone else should "like", "repost", and "retweet" the link for those videos. Post links over at WarThunder and World of tanks. The more info that is thrown out there the more people that will stumble onto it.
AK-AK posts info over at "FlameWarriors" which Im sure keeps the old school guys up to date. The more the word gets out there the more people that will stop in and check it out. Once they stop in, a better more friendly atmosphere will help keep them.
Jeez, you guys need to relax take a break or something. At the end of the day, throw a thousand posts with suggestions about what to do or not do...
I don't think a lot of the people complaining about the numbers (or lack thereof as the case may be) realize what a niche market this is comparatively.
Ask the thousands of players at Warthunder and World of tanks how much of a niche game these are.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Zacherof on July 07, 2016, 10:07:11 PM
FishBait, get that knife away from POTW. Unless you've flown on our squad vox, just assume you know nothing about us. Most of our mission, which we refer to as Pig mass....are normally only pigs and people hanging on our vox. This isn't because we don't like the Knights or something but we do understand the size of our squad with another 12-15 countrymen creates an unstoppable horde...one that isn't fun for either side...yea the land grabbers get a base but was the fight for it worth it???EDIT: (Have you ever seen a base with all of POTW and JG11 over it??? Awesome to see that much cohesion in an attack group but literally there ain't enough red guys to go around...we hungry!!! )
We run pig missions and Waystin posts here every Tuesday "visitors are welcome, PM a pig in game for vox channel" not many visitors show up these days and don't stay for good...we have a good time and I know for at least my part...try to make it enjoyable for everyone too.
Way dyin gets mad because I steal all the kills, but for some reason always knows where I'm at and you guys all show up like a pack of ravenous pigs in wolf clothing
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Estes on July 08, 2016, 08:26:10 AM
Thats where getting the word out comes in. HTC needs to step up the info about the beta, and really ramp it up just before it's release. Picture the ads you see for movies. Even a crappy movie can have a good first weekend if the hype is built up enough.
Dolby should make a few short movies in the beta and post them. 30 seconds, lots of action. Once posted everyone else should "like", "repost", and "retweet" the link for those videos. Post links over at WarThunder and World of tanks. The more info that is thrown out there the more people that will stumble onto it.
AK-AK posts info over at "FlameWarriors" which Im sure keeps the old school guys up to date. The more the word gets out there the more people that will stop in and check it out. Once they stop in, a better more friendly atmosphere will help keep them.
Ask the thousands of players at Warthunder and World of tanks how much of a niche game these are.
Yes, but flight sims/combat sims/mil sim are a niche market. And my point was that I think some of the guys complaining about numbers don't realize that and are picturing HTC HQ to have the man power of blizzard or something.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Wiley on July 08, 2016, 09:55:06 AM
Ask the thousands of players at Warthunder and World of tanks how much of a niche game these are.
Sure. However look at this game. Now look at War Thunder. Now look at Counterstrike/COD/Halo/generic FPS 347.
Forgetting about the fact that they're in vehicles, which game is the actual gameplay of War Thunder closer to? I'd say Counterstrike or any of the other FPS's out there.
Small groups, even number teams, 20-30 minute objectives, get a reward at the end of it.
Open world MMO PvP is most definitely a niche market, and draws orders of magnitude fewer people in to play it. The closest thing to this game out there in gameplay is actually Planetside 2, and their numbers are again orders of magnitude smaller than games like WT and the FPS's.
I wish it were otherwise, but it's plain as day that not very many people want this kind of game play.
Wiley.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FLS on July 08, 2016, 12:28:13 PM
Yes, but flight sims/combat sims/mil sim are a niche market. And my point was that I think some of the guys complaining about numbers don't realize that and are picturing HTC HQ to have the man power of blizzard or something.
HTC doesn't need the man power of Blizzard to run the game. It would be nice to have it when it comes time for the upgrades :D HTC needs to find out what drives the customers away and make adjustments. The old "nobody plays a game more than a year or so" and accept the fact that people are just going to leave isn't good enough any more. That or they need to work on attracting more people to make of for those that always leaving. I think there is a lot they can do to help players stay interested. I also think think there is a a lot more they could do to get people into the game.
Sure. However look at this game. Now look at War Thunder. Now look at Counterstrike/COD/Halo/generic FPS 347.
Forgetting about the fact that they're in vehicles, which game is the actual gameplay of War Thunder closer to? I'd say Counterstrike or any of the other FPS's out there.
Small groups, even number teams, 20-30 minute objectives, get a reward at the end of it.
Open world MMO PvP is most definitely a niche market, and draws orders of magnitude fewer people in to play it. The closest thing to this game out there in gameplay is actually Planetside 2, and their numbers are again orders of magnitude smaller than games like WT and the FPS's.
I wish it were otherwise, but it's plain as day that not very many people want this kind of game play.
Wiley.
If you want to get picky, ANY game could be called a niche game. A flight game is a flight game. While to most of us War Thunder sucks as a game it is still basically a flight game using WWII planes. The same goes for IL2, DSC and so on. A tank game is a tank game, World of tanks has nothing better than AH, and a lot less if you ask me, yet it still is a tank game. They have several thousand players while this game struggles to hit several hundred.
I personally believe there will be a good response to the release of lll. It will take time but a lot of the old players will come back and new ones will join.
I'll check out AH3 when it finally launches, but what I saw of it a few months ago was so unappealing I can't imagine wanting to play the game anymore unless it has drastically changed in the meantime.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: BaldEagl on July 09, 2016, 08:36:03 PM
No... there does not. AH is already one of the most nannified games around, and you want more of these hidden HTC sycophants running around? No, they create more problems than they're solve.
Reminds me when the MP's were running rampant in the message boards
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: USCH on July 09, 2016, 10:17:04 PM
In the context of this discussion, "we" = "people who want to think up ways to get more people into AH," of course.
Quote
Do you have a stake in HTC?
No. But I do have a stake in there being more players (as it affects my enjoyment).
Quote
If not when did it become OUR responsibility to get players into the game?
It's HT's business. If he's content to see it slowly die that's his choice.
None of it is our responsibility. You and I can do whatever we want. You can do what you want, and I can try to recruit more players into AH for my purely selfish reasons of my own enjoyment. :aok
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Hungry on July 10, 2016, 11:35:10 AM
What I don't see is that the Sales and Marketing of Aces High should be everywhere possible including this forum, the "face" should be everywhere, how many new guys check out this forum and see the turmoil, there is rarely a trace of a Sales and Marketing "pep talk" or any kind of Sales Schmooze for lack of a better phrase, instead what you see are players being chastised for not trying harder to enhance the product themselves.
If AH3 is getting anywhere near close to completion the Sales pitch should be on now. Same in any business with a new product on the horizon, the teasers should be out already. The enhancements to the game should be well advertised. This after all is a product. The steps to successfully releasing a new product are well documented,
The phrase "A wing and a prayer" couldn't be more appropriate, frankly if it was me I would have all over this forum protecting my product as I do in real life.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: guncrasher on July 10, 2016, 01:07:54 PM
hungry the pitch is already there. right now anybody can play ah3 for free. not credit card or anything else needed.
semp
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Hungry on July 10, 2016, 01:11:48 PM
hungry the pitch is already there. right now anybody can play ah3 for free. not credit card or anything else needed.
semp
Where other than the AH website? granted I may not be in your circles but I haven't seen it, what's the reach of it.
A lot more to my post than play for free, personally a budget, a round table discussion with players (off of this board) and a facilitator to moderate the discussion would be a great place to start
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FLS on July 10, 2016, 01:17:14 PM
Would you promote it before it's ready? I would wait until they start marketing AH3 before I criticized their marketing strategy.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Hungry on July 10, 2016, 01:27:20 PM
Would you promote it before it's ready? I would wait until they start marketing AH3 before I criticized their marketing strategy.
Its not a matter of promoting it before its ready although that timeline is open, teasers and plenty of them, just as we like to get in on betas and feel special so does everyone else. Get them a taste and let them play 2 / 3 regardless I think its close enough, besides how many here take great pride in saying "I started AH during the first Beta"
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FLS on July 10, 2016, 01:54:16 PM
When I tried the first AH beta I heard about it from other players.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: The Fugitive on July 10, 2016, 02:00:10 PM
This is where the social media group should be working now. Post often, add the link to the Beta, post that is free every where and any where.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Hungry on July 10, 2016, 02:00:40 PM
When I tried the first AH beta I heard about it from other players.
Most likely because you had AW at the time? There is no viable AW to AH connection anymore is there? By that I mean in AW's place where would the recommendation come from? FA is gone and WB is struggling, WOP? or DCS those guys to me want something other than AH, not all but most. Oh yea a few WW1 Sims maybe?
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Hungry on July 10, 2016, 02:04:19 PM
This is where the social media group should be working now. Post often, add the link to the Beta, post that is free every where and any where.
100% correct, every joystick manufacturer should have a post on their forums suggesting that I found out my ch gear for example works well on Aces High has anyone else tried it. the marketing research wing should know all the connections relative to AH and make sure everyone is "touched" by AH info in someway.
NVidia forum, Post fyi driver xxx works well with the new AH3 beta anyone else try it any tweaks you'd recommend, anything to stir the pot.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Max on July 10, 2016, 02:19:26 PM
It's VERY simple! We need HOP back :devil (https://s32.postimg.org/x6ohokyit/Hop_Giles.jpg) (https://postimg.org/image/lubw6sptt/)capture (https://postimage.org/app.php)
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FLS on July 10, 2016, 03:42:34 PM
Most likely because you had AW at the time? There is no viable AW to AH connection anymore is there? By that I mean in AW's place where would the recommendation come from? FA is gone and WB is struggling, WOP? or DCS those guys to me want something other than AH, not all but most. Oh yea a few WW1 Sims maybe?
I had left AW and was in Dawn Of Aces at the time, virtual pilots talk to each other about flight sims, that's why I tried DOA. I left DOA/WB because AH was better.
HTC has been successful for many years, I'm not worried.
Have you tried the beta?
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FLS on July 10, 2016, 03:49:07 PM
I had left AW and was in Dawn Of Aces at the time, virtual pilots talk to each other about flight sims, that's why I tried DOA. I left DOA/WB because AH was better.
HTC has been successful for many years, I'm not worried.
Have you tried the beta?
I started AW in 95 or 96 and came here with the mass migration when AW closed, yes Ive been in there my patches are up to date and the new vid card (a 970) is raring to go. HTC has been successful for a long time but these I think are different times overall for the multiplayer game players way more choices, on one hand you have a lot of chatter on these boards about "loss of players" then you have Bustr towing the line and shooting down anyone who dissents. I just wish HT was being more pro active. I've been through one close AW I don't want to do it again. Sometimes I even wonder what if AW could have pulled off the MV version successfully and stayed in business, how many AW folks would maybe have stayed. You might not have ever seen 600 or whatever arenas. Not sure on that cause I don't remember the timing exactly but you get the point.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Ack-Ack on July 10, 2016, 05:19:35 PM
Bringing new people in while the beta is buggy may have the opposite effect instead of what you intend.
That's the double edged sword for promoting beta access, you'll get the majority that really isn't interested in testing, they are more interested in playing the game and will complain how lousy the game is because they expected the beta to be just like a polished final release and are upset at the bugs they encounter.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: CAV on July 10, 2016, 08:48:50 PM
Quote
Sometimes I even wonder what if AW could have pulled off the MV version successfully and stayed in business, how many AW folks would maybe have stayed
I would still be there..........
Cavalry
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: jedi25 on July 10, 2016, 09:32:13 PM
What loss of members or players you all talking about..? the vets are on some well needed rest and recreation after years of air combat :devil right now. I still have my account and I am sure most still have their accounts active just waiting for AH3 and let the mayhem begins.
:salute jedi
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Taps on July 11, 2016, 12:31:10 AM
Howdy Everyone, I'm new to AH, spent a few years in AWs and I'm really glad to be here! What a concept eh! I've read every post in here and I have to say things don't seem too bad. A lot of good ideas and criticisms. I would like to offer up a good suggestion to bring in more flyers. At this time I feel totally unqualified to do so. Learning a lot from all of you.
I've flown AH2 and the beta and even with the few glitches I've noticed It appears to be pretty far along in development. At least to the point of be enjoyable for me. That being said I've invited over 10 friends to get in and give it a try. It doesn't seem to me very fruitful to spend a lot of words pointing out what's wrong with the sim right now, especially criticizing hi-tech for where they are or are not at this point. I'm fairly sure they are as focused as they need to be getting AH3 complete.
What does concern me is that I've seen one suggestion that is directed at recruiting new flyers. It's only my opinion that this should be the focus of this group. The condition of AH3 is not going to prevent new participation and by the same token it should not run off anyone. Each current member should consider what they can do to bring in new recruits. Coming here and discussing what they've found to work and what has not worked in this effort. Perhaps getting hot on social media, adding an invite in the right blogs could help. Put up a new website aimed a showing off the sim, current events and participation in very encouraging methods. Some feel this should be entirely hi-techs responsibility and there's some validity to that. If they've gotten to this point in the gaming business I'm fairly sure they are savvy enough to have a plan of promotion for AH3 that fits well.
So the question is what are each of us doing to help move things along? Pony up some ideas and we all benefit from effort.
Regards. Taps
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Brooke on July 11, 2016, 12:38:55 AM
I've invited over 10 friends to get in and give it a try.
You are my hero! :aok
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Taps on July 11, 2016, 01:08:30 PM
I have gone into other sim sites, social media sites, newsgroups and Placed AH info or scoured players contact info to recommend they take a look at AH. This may be of interest to those looking for places to recruit.....
Pinterest.com (Pinterest is a free and mobile application company that operates a photo sharing website. Registration is required for use)
Facebook.com (Facebook is a popular free social networking website that allows registered users to create profiles, upload photos and video, send messages and keep in touch with friends, family and colleagues).
Twitter.com (Twitter is an online social networking service that enables users to send and read short 140-character messages called "tweets").
More Later....
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Bruv119 on July 11, 2016, 01:14:49 PM
this taps guy is all over his social media stuff maybe he should have got that job.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Navy84 on July 11, 2016, 04:19:38 PM
I really don't like whine posts but bs like what happened in the MA today is a big reason why people leave the game. All you have is bish and rook hoardes and bomb and bail morons.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: 327thBS on July 11, 2016, 04:34:36 PM
This game is dying no denying it. I reupped my subscription a couple months ago and unless your on at prime times its like chasing ghost across the maps and its only going to get worse!(God Bless those people playing at odd times).Any ways, I think its ridiculous they don't have a quarter of when AH3 was due out ? They rarely respond to forums and give their feedback and this is a small game; just give us an idea of what direction your heading, plans moving forward ? I play plenty of games and generally the developers have a well documented road map, and are vocal when set backs occur. I understand this is a small game, but I haven't seen an effort of the staff to properly communicate where they are in the process of transitioning to AH3? Their stance on Big maps vs small maps? Solution to the trend of memberships declining? While these questions may seem small, they have a significant impact on players thoughts to continue to subscribe. I'm sure there are a hundred other questions that the player base has questions too as well.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: guncrasher on July 11, 2016, 04:48:32 PM
This game is dying no denying it. I reupped my subscription a couple months ago and unless your on at prime times its like chasing ghost across the maps and its only going to get worse!(God Bless those people playing at odd times).Any ways, I think its ridiculous they don't have a quarter of when AH3 was due out ? They rarely respond to forums and give their feedback and this is a small game; just give us an idea of what direction your heading, plans moving forward ? I play plenty of games and generally the developers have a well documented road map, and are vocal when set backs occur. I understand this is a small game, but I haven't seen an effort of the staff to properly communicate where they are in the process of transitioning to AH3? Their stance on Big maps vs small maps? Solution to the trend of memberships declining? While these questions may seem small, they have a significant impact on players thoughts to continue to subscribe. I'm sure there are a hundred other questions that the player base has questions too as well.
they have answered the same questions over and over. how many answers do people really want. one of hitech's answers has been something like "what people ask for is not what they really want".
for example the taking out the large maps from rotation. some people will say that would encourage fighting, while the truth maybe that those who dont want to fight will see a small map and log off so the players will be even less. or maybe that small maps get rolled in a matter of hours and we would have 3 or 4 maps per day with no guarantee of a fight.
so getting rid of large maps most likely would accomplish nothing.
semp
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Brooke on July 11, 2016, 04:53:08 PM
I think HTC did an on-line poll on whether or not to use the large maps, and large maps won.
Unfortunately, maybe a lot of people who want small maps were not on-line to vote because of large maps. ;)
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Zoney on July 11, 2016, 05:03:50 PM
I really don't like whine posts but bs like what happened in the MA today is a big reason why people leave the game. All you have is bish and rook hoardes and bomb and bail morons.
OK. I'll bite. What happened in the MA today?
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Tumor on July 11, 2016, 05:41:37 PM
I really don't like whine posts but bs like what happened in the MA today is a big reason why people leave the game. All you have is bish and rook hoardes and bomb and bail morons.
Really? You mean like when the Rooks were backed into a corner all last night while Bish/Knit barely fought? The bs is as old as the game... it was your turn in the bucket, you ain't gotta like it, but I'll bet you sure won't remember it when you're doing it to others.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: JunkyII on July 11, 2016, 05:44:22 PM
Really? You mean like when the Rooks were backed into a corner all last night while Bish/Knit barely fought? The bs is as old as the game... it was your turn in the bucket, you ain't gotta like it, but I'll bet you sure won't remember it when you're doing it to others.
Best nights in the game is when both sides are attacking your own...plenty of fights to go around.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Zoney on July 11, 2016, 05:46:43 PM
Best nights in the game is when both sides are attacking your own...plenty of fights to go around.
^^^ That's the absolute truth right there ^^^
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: puller on July 11, 2016, 06:19:20 PM
So...I took off work Thursday...I logged on at about 10:30 am CDT...there were 43 people logged on...I found a darbar upped a fighter and found a fight...this continued all day...I logged off around 8pm...I never had a lack of fights...let me say that again....I NEVER COULD NOT FIND A FIGHT...Do y'all understand what I'm telling you???
I have proved this time and time again...I have a post from a couple of months ago where the same thing happened...
I see you people get on here and cry and cry and cry....real f*****g tears man..."oh the game is dying there was only 50 people on and blah blah blah blah blah
Give it a rest....I mean come on!!!!!
I have found some of the best fights early in the mornings when there is hardly anyone on...
Either A. You don't know how to read a darbar. B. You don't want to find a fight. C. Your a cry bag and want to pick a furball. Or D. You don't want to find a fight.
So...I took off work Thursday...I logged on at about 10:30 am CDT...there were 43 people logged on...I found a darbar upped a fighter and found a fight...this continued all day...I logged off around 8pm...I never had a lack of fights...let me say that again....I NEVER COULD NOT FIND A FIGHT...Do y'all understand what I'm telling you???
I have proved this time and time again...I have a post from a couple of months ago where the same thing happened...
I see you people get on here and cry and cry and cry....real f*****g tears man..."oh the game is dying there was only 50 people on and blah blah blah blah blah
Give it a rest....I mean come on!!!!!
I have found some of the best fights early in the mornings when there is hardly anyone on...
Either A. You don't know how to read a darbar. B. You don't want to find a fight. C. Your a cry bag and want to pick a furball. Or D. You don't want to find a fight.
I have film of flying around chasing darbars, or joining the horde trying to take back a base that was snuck NOE by our HQ. Neither of which are even close to being called a fight.
Another thing, what do you consider a "fight"? What you call a fight may be way off from what some here are looking for.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Shuffler on July 11, 2016, 06:53:59 PM
I'll check out AH3 when it finally launches, but what I saw of it a few months ago was so unappealing I can't imagine wanting to play the game anymore unless it has drastically changed in the meantime.
Maybe you never were into WWII aircraft. AHIII looks great. In fact since I fly there most now, AHII is boring by comparison.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Shuffler on July 11, 2016, 06:55:53 PM
Really? You mean like when the Rooks were backed into a corner all last night while Bish/Knit barely fought? The bs is as old as the game... it was your turn in the bucket, you ain't gotta like it, but I'll bet you sure won't remember it when you're doing it to others.
Go bish or knit and start a fight. Easy enough to do.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Tumor on July 11, 2016, 07:13:19 PM
I wasn't arguing any lack of fights. There were plenty of fights to be had last night... not a whole lot under 20k, which was as weird as it was refreshing.
Shuffler... why if I was a Rook backed into a corner with bish/knit barely fighting, would I go bish/knit to pick a fight. Doesn't make sense. FWIW, the Knits were actually having some fun with the Rooks last night. Bish were doing the usual whack-a-mole thing.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Brooke on July 11, 2016, 07:14:25 PM
I logged on at about 10:30 am CDT...this continued all day...I logged off around 8pm...I never had a lack of fights...
In my experience, approx. 11 pm Pacific onwards, it is not like that.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: save on July 11, 2016, 07:34:13 PM
If the front lines are too big the attacking force just NOE one field and get it before anyone can defend it, on a smaller map they even have to fight to get it.
I have film of flying around chasing darbars, or joining the horde trying to take back a base that was snuck NOE by our HQ. Neither of which are even close to being called a fight.
Another thing, what do you consider a "fight"? What you call a fight may be way off from what some here are looking for.
LOL :rofl :rofl :rofl
I know what the hell a fight is fugi...its not picking' and its not runnin'
There were other guys there too that haunt these boards that can vouch for it too...
Matter of fact...I might have a film or two... I know I saved one where I won a 4 v 1...
Over the holiday weekend I was on one early morning and spent the whole day defending a base from spin and a bunch of other nits and there wasn't any numbers and had numerous fights
We know what kind of " fights" you want fugi....and I know a bunch of other guys in this game that wouldn't subscribe to your idea of "fight"
My idea of fight is surrounded by red... watching mfers go poof as they try to kill me only to get the tides turned on them...
As I said...cry all you want to about numbers... I can find a good 1 v 1 fight anytime I log on...you can take that to the bank
Or maybe you can log on and see a map you don't like and log off and come to the boards and cry about it....
I'm not at the office so I can't post another no crying thing...
Don't rage quit bro!!!!! :aok
:rofl :rofl :rofl
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: The Fugitive on July 11, 2016, 09:09:45 PM
I know what the hell a fight is fugi...its not picking' and its not runnin'
There were other guys there too that haunt these boards that can vouch for it too...
Matter of fact...I might have a film or two... I know I saved one where I won a 4 v 1...
Over the holiday weekend I was on one early morning and spent the whole day defending a base from spin and a bunch of other nits and there wasn't any numbers and had numerous fights
We know what kind of " fights" you want fugi....and I know a bunch of other guys in this game that wouldn't subscribe to your idea of "fight"
My idea of fight is surrounded by red... watching mfers go poof as they try to kill me only to get the tides turned on them...
As I said...cry all you want to about numbers... I can find a good 1 v 1 fight anytime I log on...you can take that to the bank
Or maybe you can log on and see a map you don't like and log off and come to the boards and cry about it....
I'm not at the office so I can't post another no crying thing...
Don't rage quit bro!!!!! :aok
:rofl :rofl :rofl
Ahhhh so by you saying everything is right in the world there isn't a problem and those of us pointing them out don't know what we are talking about. :rolleyes:
Is there enough room in that hole you and semp have your head buried in?
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: puller on July 11, 2016, 11:18:23 PM
Ahhhh so by you saying everything is right in the world there isn't a problem and those of us pointing them out don't know what we are talking about. :rolleyes:
Is there enough room in that hole you and semp have your head buried in?
I never said there was nothing wrong...the major thing I see...people complain about not being able to find fights...maybe they should fight each other instead of complaining that they can't find fights when apparently everybody is looking for a fight while complaining about not being able to find fights....does that make sense :rofl
Or how about everybody on the boards that can't find fights get with each other in these threads about not being able to find fights to fight each other....oh what a novel idea...people that want to fight fighting each other
But for some reason that doesn't happen :headscratch:
But these threads sure happen a lot :O
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: JunkyII on July 11, 2016, 11:31:46 PM
Bish took V44 on ndisles yesterday morning; took away one of the best/consistent tank fights the game has to offer. It may not have killed all the tank fights on the map but it did take away that center town fight...which has kept my interest for nearly 10 years (Kind of like crater center). I doubt we would ever see these fields made uncapturable in AH2 but the players could be observant toward others and not take them, especially when it is taken NOE by an overwelming force.
At the same time, I will say yesterday I spent many hours online in the center Island in a fighter, then another couple hours on the outside trying to help take fields. An entire day of fights.
But there are definitely times on certain maps where there aren't any fights....if you disagree with that, your experience is just lucky....ask any of the European players.
2PM EST...that's about the time you're sure to get a fight on any map...now those fights might be boring or lame due to excessive HOs, Gangs, ect ect ect but there is something to shoot at in some form.
I'll put it this way. End of 2006 when I first started playing from EST...The fight was RAGING whenever I got on, no matter the map. In 2009 I played from Korea, I worked during the week so I couldn't hit primetime except for the weekends. I could still log on and get a fight though, during this time I first started learning 1v1s...actually trying to do some sort of ACM...because the fights in the MA were smaller and I was getting beat 1v1 more often. From 2010 to 2012, I again played from the east coast(except the year in the stan box)....Fights were raging. 2012-2015 I played from Hawaii but I had a 1 1/2 yr break in the middle of it. This is when I first noticed a difference in the game, where there would be times I'd log on and log off almost immediately. If I got on at say 8 hawaii time during the week and a big map was up, yep I might be logging off to play another game. These days I'm back in EST, I use to be more of a "morning crew" on the weekends but like I said earlier, these days it depends on the map...so I stick with other games in the morning and Aces High in the evenings.
The game has offered me almost a decade of game play, everyone has got upset throughout their time here...Plenty of players that I dislike because of their gameplay and plenty of game mechanics I think are wrong...But I am interested to see how AH3 turns out and I'm sure there is going to be something like the old commercial on the Discover Wings channel that will bring players in just like it did for me back then.
I do hope the new members do 3 things....Beat the learning curve(through good training and a competitive spirit), find a good squad, and learn the good fight early on.
Or how about everybody on the boards that can't find fights get with each other in these threads about not being able to find fights to fight each other....oh what a novel idea...people that want to fight fighting each other
But for some reason that doesn't happen :headscratch:
I'll bite since I'm definitely one of the bigger voices for lack of fights due to certain reasons.
I post my position on 200, fly 3 sectors to a field, drop down to NOE in a TA152 and let enemy planes get on my 6 and I still can't get anyone to fight me sometimes....Tell me what should I do in that situation???
Sent from my phone....probably filled with mistakes.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FESS67 on July 12, 2016, 06:38:36 AM
Hey Puller,
I logged on tonight. 36 players on. Found a fight for about 45 minutes. Then all I experienced was high buffs and manned guns.
Please let me know when you want to wing up so you can show me all these hours filled with fights.
I have just logged off because I am bored. I play for fighter combat.
I look forward to you taking the time to educate me on where I am going wrong. Many thanks.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Tilt on July 12, 2016, 07:34:04 AM
If a provider supplies a fun experience that everyone want to enjoy then demand will increase.
Has the AHII "product" changed over the years to any great extent? I would argue no. It may have broadened the scope of the product (more rides) but the PPPP is much the same.
So what has changed to cause a drop in demand? Well the easy (obvious) answer is that the market has changed.
AHIII beyond beta will have to address the market of 2016 to 2020 and beyond if it wishes to return to growth.
This may fly in the face of the market needs of 1996-2000 that formed much of the product structure we see today. Any market adjustment may have to be radical, it may incur some risk taking.
IMO its about the game play quality, the reward the player gets for participating (and we see there are many definitions as to what that means) and the access to game play (i.e. access to the product) via multiple routes and payment options.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Tumor on July 12, 2016, 07:38:23 AM
I logged on tonight. 36 players on. Found a fight for about 45 minutes. Then all I experienced was high buffs and manned guns.
Please let me know when you want to wing up so you can show me all these hours filled with fights.
I have just logged off because I am bored. I play for fighter combat.
I look forward to you taking the time to educate me on where I am going wrong. Many thanks.
Fly high, fight buffs! :rock For fun, shadow them however far they go, only engage when they're in the bombsight. Don't do that with the 9's guy. :airplane:
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: JunkyII on July 12, 2016, 09:44:14 AM
Fly high, fight buffs! :rock For fun, shadow them however far they go, only engage when they're in the bombsight. Don't do that with the 9's guy. :airplane:
The issue here that a lot face is bomb and bailers...and also they just don't have the time to go to 30K....a set of 30K buffs above a field will take me 30-40 minutes to kill if I just noticed them above a field.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Wiley on July 12, 2016, 10:02:05 AM
The issue here that a lot face is bomb and bailers...and also they just don't have the time to go to 30K....a set of 30K buffs above a field will take me 30-40 minutes to kill if I just noticed them above a field.
Just my personal feeling on that- If you set out to hunt bombers, unless you're using a 163 at the HQ, don't wait to see them then up and climb to them. Instead, launch and get to alt in an area likely to have them. Take something that has ridiculous cruising time like a late model jug or TA152. If you can see an area that has a lot of likely enemy bomber activity, you can get on top of them and be in place to stop them before they hit.
If they're over your fields when you launch, you're too late and all you're going to do is kill them after they've dropped.
Wiley.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Lusche on July 12, 2016, 10:07:16 AM
Just my personal feeling on that- If you set out to hunt bombers, unless you're using a 163 at the HQ, don't wait to see them then up and climb to them. Instead, launch and get to alt in an area likely to have them. Take something that has ridiculous cruising time like a late model jug or TA152. If you can see an area that has a lot of likely enemy bomber activity, you can get on top of them and be in place to stop them before they hit.
That's basically a sound advice... but unfortunately with the low population and the dispersal of the central strats you can forget that for most of the time, as you might very well be ending up in the wrong spot for hours. For an high altitude patrol anti bomber patrol you'd need an area that's likely to actually have some buffs inbound in the near future. Unless you enjoy simply being 'up there'... ;)
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: JunkyII on July 12, 2016, 10:07:50 AM
Just my personal feeling on that- If you set out to hunt bombers, unless you're using a 163 at the HQ, don't wait to see them then up and climb to them. Instead, launch and get to alt in an area likely to have them. Take something that has ridiculous cruising time like a late model jug or TA152. If you can see an area that has a lot of likely enemy bomber activity, you can get on top of them and be in place to stop them before they hit.
If they're over your fields when you launch, you're too late and all you're going to do is kill them after they've dropped.
Wiley.
Don't get me wrong your absolutely right, If I'm intercepting buffs I'm going way back to get to their alt and to attack speed before I even see them. But sometimes you log on and don't have the time to go after 30K buffs is what I was getting at...I've been online and only seen strat raiders before but I was looking for a quick fight before I had to go do something else.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Wiley on July 12, 2016, 10:37:53 AM
Don't get me wrong your absolutely right, If I'm intercepting buffs I'm going way back to get to their alt and to attack speed before I even see them. But sometimes you log on and don't have the time to go after 30K buffs is what I was getting at...I've been online and only seen strat raiders before but I was looking for a quick fight before I had to go do something else.
Oh I figured. I was just pointing out how a person would want to go about it if you want to get to them before they drop. :)
Yeah. Daytime north american has very, very little fighter action. Saturdays and Sundays there are times I see literally enough bardar for 6 enemies max on both fronts. Realistically, it's generally 3 planes in the air. 20-30 people on per side, 3 enemy planes in the air. Usually stratospheric buffs. Everyone else either in a GV, ground gun, or tower.
Lusche- Very true. On the smaller maps, there's often so little going on particularly during the day North American that you can read the map and sometimes pretty much cover the strats from both fronts if you're already at alt in something that likes it up there. You spend a LOT of time in transit though.
Wiley.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Someguy63 on July 12, 2016, 06:10:07 PM
Fly high, fight buffs! :rock For fun, shadow them however far they go, only engage when they're in the bombsight. Don't do that with the 9's guy. :airplane:
What if I don't find that fun? Do you actually want people to play this game?
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Tumor on July 12, 2016, 08:53:33 PM
You earn that TOC invite yet??? Come to the next Koth, we'll find you a fight :aok
I'll try to show up. Hopefully nothing pops up that day.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: 5PointOh on July 13, 2016, 06:54:57 PM
My opinion probably isn't to valid as I left AH 2+ years ago, but for me the reasons really came down to a couple of things:
-Gameplay: it wasn't horrible and there was always something to do, but it was usually the same thing to do. Add in the good fights (for me at least) were becoming harder to come by.
-Updates: No so much graphics, eye candy is nice, but mainly the updates in content. Since leaving AH I've moved onto iRacing, while the game type is different, but the part I enjoy the most is how fast content is added. Even at 15.00 per track and car, plus my subscription I gladly pay it as I know every 13weeks there will be a new track or car added. Perhaps someday AH could look at how iRacing does laser scanning and decrease content build time.
Those are just my thoughts on why I left...might be the same as others, might not be.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Lazerr on July 13, 2016, 07:24:24 PM
Again, you haven't posted any helpful hints/tips on how HTC could bring the numbers up. What are your ideas?
Don't know if someone has already suggested this in the many previous replies in this thread (all of which I haven't read yet), but one thing I've noticed (though I admit I haven't done a conclusive search, simply anecdotal observation) is that I've never seen a review, ad or reference to Aces High in any gamer mag, website or blog. I suspect there may be one or two somewhere at most. Every time I go to look at a listing of games for which some product or item is compatible I look for Aces High on the list... nothing, nada, kaput. Does anyone in the gaming reviewing and reporting community know about Aces High? Does HiTech even have a promotion/public relations person?
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Estes on July 13, 2016, 08:33:23 PM
The thing is, the vast majority the read gaming magazines or things like that aren't into WWII flight sims. Between that and I hate to say it, but the antiquated subscription business model especially nowadays. I never had an issue with monthly subs, but I understand that some do. I don't play because I have no interest anymore, and $15 a month while not that much is still just one more thing flying out of my bank every month and if i'm not even playing - pfft why? :cheers:
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: toddbobe on July 14, 2016, 09:07:41 PM
I love this game...I love the action and the community.... however without new blood I worry that all you guys will get tired of killing me... after all its way too easy. I wish that HTC would advertise more so that we can have more people for you all to kill... besides me... The new game looks good but lets be frank, we are into the sim not the eye candy. I hope HTC has not made a mistake putting all their eggs in the AH3 basket. That being said... I will stay until the servers are turned off. Thats my $.02 worth! Todd Bobe(r)
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: JMD413 on July 14, 2016, 09:53:06 PM
Game play is far less fun than in the previous years. Sadly, I have cancelled my account for now as there really isn't any point anymore. For me, it seems like there are less fights and the maps are dead and tired. I had continued to pay my subscription until now to support the beta but even that seems dead (I never see many people on).
I hate to go as there really isn't a good alternative to AH but the game play is just not worth it anymore for me. Perhaps this "niche" game just isn't what interest other gamer's anymore. I may check it out again when the beta goes live. Sorry to go as it has been a great ride.
Big <S> to my fellow AH pilots but this just isn't the same anymore for me and I have to move on. Best of luck to all of you and HTC in your future endeavors.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: FLOOB on July 15, 2016, 01:56:10 AM
Dude's worried about losing his member. Why's everybody hating. Walk a mile in his shoes and all that.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Slade on July 15, 2016, 06:11:33 AM
Crazy thing I like to do when logging in => ACM. I like to look for and shoot down red planes. I'm silly that way.
If I find a particular squad has been clever and has strats down or performed similar stunts: I simply log off.
While I do all I can to help resupply and protect vital country assets - spending the bulk of my time in the game resupplying is not why I pay for this game.
I know some squads are particularly proud of producing this recurring scenario. I simply cant believe though that it is seen as conducive to player retention.
To put it in AH speak: customer expiration times are accelerated when this happens.
:salute
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Invictus84 on July 15, 2016, 06:34:01 AM
So what is the average Friday / Saturday Night population in the LW MA this days?
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Rich46yo on July 15, 2016, 06:52:43 AM
So what is the average Friday / Saturday Night population in the LW MA this days?
I havnt seen 200 since Ive been back. I only came back cause Im on vacation and my work hours will force me to quit after a month. I'll come back after the update "whenever that is". Hopefully things will improve.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Tilt on July 15, 2016, 08:24:53 AM
I think the most concerning element in all this is that Beta is very playable right now and apparently FREE to any one with access to this forum.
From this I assume you do not even need an active account...........
Yet its empty..........
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: oboe on July 15, 2016, 08:31:13 AM
Well, I once went in and actually found 6 other players online. All on one country, grabbing bases against 0 enemies and yelling "WTFG!" after each 'victory' :rofl
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: madrid311 on July 15, 2016, 12:43:45 PM
how many of us in the aces high community can play aces high 3 without an upgrade? I needed a new desktop upgrade to be able to play aces high 3 and it was time anyway. I couldn't even enjoy the graphics with my old desktop. i could still fly but no eye candy. So I saved my per diem and bought a new laptop for work and play 5 mo. ago as I was on location. it has a i 5 5200 nvidia geforce 940 m 2 gb dedicated vram card 8gb ddr3 l memory 1000gb hdd which I though was plenty based on what I could gleen from the forums and it made the aces high 2 game come alive in a way that I was amazed, at how much I was missing. when i got home i downloaded beta to my laptop only to find I cant play it as I guess i needed a better game card, duh. when I got my new desktop with the bells and whistles with a monster game card I am able to enjoy the game and the beta too. so what happens to the few of us left and the new soon to be interested players who need a special computer to enjoy the game. Im worried it will be even less populated. how come no one goes to the beta now as is except for a few. just wondering where this is all headed. I only started 3 years ago and I love this game. peace. GunFTR.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: guncrasher on July 15, 2016, 12:54:58 PM
madrid I didnt need an upgrade to play ah3. 99% of the people dont need an upgrade. point is we arent sure yet how to adjust the settings.
semp
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: BowHTR on July 15, 2016, 01:00:01 PM
I didn't need an upgrade either and i have a pretty low end card.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Estes on July 15, 2016, 01:32:44 PM
Quote
(snip) 99% of the people dont need an upgrade.
I wouldn't throw around statistics without being able to back them up. The group on the board is a bad representation of the population of the AH crowd. Niche within a niche thing. Having said that, just from reading around on here I get the opposite impression.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Ack-Ack on July 15, 2016, 01:48:24 PM
how many of us in the aces high community can play aces high 3 without an upgrade? I needed a new desktop upgrade to be able to play aces high 3 and it was time anyway. I couldn't even enjoy the graphics with my old desktop. i could still fly but no eye candy. So I saved my per diem and bought a new laptop for work and play 5 mo. ago as I was on location. it has a i 5 5200 nvidia geforce 940 m 2 gb dedicated vram card 8gb ddr3 l memory 1000gb hdd which I though was plenty based on what I could gleen from the forums and it made the aces high 2 game come alive in a way that I was amazed, at how much I was missing. when i got home i downloaded beta to my laptop only to find I cant play it as I guess i needed a better game card, duh. when I got my new desktop with the bells and whistles with a monster game card I am able to enjoy the game and the beta too. so what happens to the few of us left and the new soon to be interested players who need a special computer to enjoy the game. Im worried it will be even less populated. how come no one goes to the beta now as is except for a few. just wondering where this is all headed. I only started 3 years ago and I love this game. peace. GunFTR.
You should be able to run the game wth the Nividia 940m but you'll have to lower most of the graphic options as the 940 will not run the game with all the bells and whistles.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: puller on July 15, 2016, 02:26:13 PM
I didn't need an upgrade either and i have a pretty low end card.
I have a NVidia HD6540 1GB on a '05 model hp computer that the power supply fan is locked up on and I have a desk fan blowing into the case and I can run the Beta...
The amount of gloom and doom on this board is becoming oppressive :bhead
If you build it they will come...I heard that somewhere...
I can log on at any time of the day or night and come into a good fight...I probably can find fights because I go the base with the biggest enemy darbar...I also fly slow planes or if I fly a fast one I get it slow fast so I can turnfight which usually leads to my death...but planes are free so wth...
Before FSO last Friday there where over 200 people in the MA and 100 in the SEA waiting on FSO...
The game isn't gonna be fun if you don't want it to be...it's really about the attitude you have logging into it or while you are playing...
I get kinda pissed myself when I get picked by rocky or rapier when I'm fighting 4 or 5 others but you don't see me running to the boards crying about it....and I don't rage quit...
This thread is the biggest bunch of lameassery I have seen on this board in quite awhile...I think I said a couple of pages back that it is a novel idea if the cats who can't find a fight and post on here they can't find a fight should get together and fight each other...but hell that's asking too much...
I had fugi all bent out of shape saying I could find a fight with only 40 something people logged on...
I guess I'm an idiot...or a lameass myself...because if I come up on a base where I know someone is down there and they don't want to fight me...I'll shoot their gun out if they are in it...I'll deack the base, I'll come back and kill there wirble or whatever gv they decide to roll...I will kill them in any way I can in whatever they are in...I get my player vs. player fix anytime I log into this game...
And if I know there is a hoard of fighters somewhere doing something...either low or high...you can bet your bottom dollar that I'm on my way...and usually on my way to my death...but wth planes are free...
So please...lets keep the gloom and doom and despair up...keep trying to get in the heads of those that read this board and lurk and are not vocal about their displeasure that just need to read one post that expresses they way they feel that pushes them over the edge to quit...
Because I know that Hitech himself will have to turn the lights out on me before I go anywhere...and I've got a couple of squaddies that will be there with me too...hell I guess we will just fight each other...we have fun doing that too
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Estes on July 15, 2016, 03:06:19 PM
Ive logged in to the beta a handful of times at different times, and flew around and what not, which was about all I could do with 3-10 players on. I didn't need to upgrade but I didn't suspect that I would need to. Can you run the new version on a mobile vid card, or a computer from 05/onboard video? Maybe, maybe not. But, big difference between running it and running it well.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Invictus84 on July 15, 2016, 03:47:08 PM
I havnt seen 200 since Ive been back. I only came back cause Im on vacation and my work hours will force me to quit after a month. I'll come back after the update "whenever that is". Hopefully things will improve.
So are we talking 150ish? If so, that seems like not many players for maps as large as those sported by AH. The CLoD or BoS/BoM maps are smaller with the larger servers usually have between 50-90 people on peak hours, so the concentration of players is much higher per sq km than in AH. Let's just say I usually don't have a problem finding a fight most days.
Still, I'll probably give AHIII a spin when it comes out. I hope it works out. :salute
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Rich46yo on July 15, 2016, 04:17:42 PM
So are we talking 150ish? If so, that seems like not many players for maps as large as those sported by AH. The CLoD or BoS/BoM maps are smaller with the larger servers usually have between 50-90 people on peak hours, so the concentration of players is much higher per sq km than in AH. Let's just say I usually don't have a problem finding a fight most days.
Still, I'll probably give AHIII a spin when it comes out. I hope it works out. :salute
Well the game is still fun, its always been a well designed game, but Im one of the guys who remember 600 on at one time on TTs and just huge land and air furballs that went on all night. So when you have 150 on a big map at any one time how many are actually flying, how many are tanking, how many are in the tower?
The answer is not many are around to fight. I just checked and saw 79 on at 1600 hrs CST. By now we used to have 150 to 200 on each of two maps. But Im just repeating whats known, lets hope for better days ahead.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Gman on July 15, 2016, 06:37:25 PM
That's exactly how I feel too, just hopeful that the future will bring back the Titanic Tuesday numbers.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: The Fugitive on July 15, 2016, 10:02:03 PM
For you fellow dogfighter types...I mean, how many opponents do you really want at any given time? You don't need 600 people to have fun.
- oldman (...or perhaps you do, for some reason...?)
600 pertains to the population of the map. At the moment we have up to 200 people on maps with more bases than that.
How many times do we hear on country channel...'let's try to sneak xxx' SNEAK, as in not fight for.....that is a problem in my opinion. It points to people wanting results from actively avoiding fights.
And to Puller - you have posted again that you can find endless fights with few people in game. Back that up. Log in with me and show me how to find those fights. The fact is during my prime time they typically do not exist. That is not a lack of effort on my part, there are simply not enough people in game at that time who want to go at it in fighter planes. I am more than willing for you to prove me wrong and I will post it very publically. Accept the challenge and educate me.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: The Fugitive on July 16, 2016, 11:22:38 AM
For you fellow dogfighter types...I mean, how many opponents do you really want at any given time? You don't need 600 people to have fun.
- oldman (...or perhaps you do, for some reason...?)
I think that is the biggest issue. With 200 people those that want to fight are a small percentage and hard to find these days. Going to 600 triples the number of those that want to fight making it easier to find them.
600 pertains to the population of the map. At the moment we have up to 200 people on maps with more bases than that.
How many times do we hear on country channel...'let's try to sneak xxx' SNEAK, as in not fight for.....that is a problem in my opinion. It points to people wanting results from actively avoiding fights.
And to Puller - you have posted again that you can find endless fights with few people in game. Back that up. Log in with me and show me how to find those fights. The fact is during my prime time they typically do not exist. That is not a lack of effort on my part, there are simply not enough people in game at that time who want to go at it in fighter planes. I am more than willing for you to prove me wrong and I will post it very publically. Accept the challenge and educate me.
Well puller gave us a partial list of his type of fights....
I guess I'm an idiot...or a lameass myself...because if I come up on a base where I know someone is down there and they don't want to fight me...I'll shoot their gun out if they are in it...I'll deack the base, I'll come back and kill there wirble or whatever gv they decide to roll...I will kill them in any way I can in whatever they are in...I get my player vs. player fix anytime I log into this game...
So I guess he considers fighting guns and bombing GVs fighting.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Lusche on July 16, 2016, 11:36:10 AM
For you fellow dogfighter types...I mean, how many opponents do you really want at any given time? You don't need 600 people to have fun.
- oldman (...or perhaps you do, for some reason...?)
Actually, I do...
Well, doesn't has to be 600. But I very much enjoy a complex, highly dynamic combat environment driven by battles. The more and more diverse they are, the better. The amount and intensity (and not to forget persistence!) depends both on absolute numbers as well as player density over a given area. A gameplay that's being reduced to a series of duels or (at best) to a few small scale dogfights is getting boring quickly for me.
Note that I started to use the term 'battle' instead of 'fight' some time ago, because for different players the term 'looking for a fight' has very different meanings and they are often talking past each other in thread like this.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Elfie on July 16, 2016, 12:32:31 PM
As a bit of a realist, unless there are some big changes in game play (some Im sure I wont like) this game is going to wallow along only for a short time after the AH3 update.
You post that like your proud of that number. Just a couple of weeks ago there were over 300 on a Saturday night.
Pretty graphics may bring in new players IF they run the ads MAX is so optimistic about, but what is there that is going to entice them to stay?
Bullys sending PMs? Large learning curve so that they can barely compete? Runners and bailers who enjoy AVOIDING combat? Lack of radar for hours on end? Huge maps to spread out fronts? Puffy ack that can kill a maneuvering fighter but cant hit a SET of buffs. Being part of a horde or dying to one is your main choice of flights?
I haven't been able to spend a lot of time in the Beta tho I do load each update and check to see if the basics work on my computer (updates, loads, starts, roll a plane or two check FR ) but the biggest thing I see right now is the update points to tanking more than anything else. Of course your cant make "air" look all that much better. I just hope it doesn't turn into Aces Low with any new player that come in.
Im sure the VR support HTC is adding will be a big seller with some people, but is that market all that big to support all the time involved in adding and tweaking it? How long has this delayed the release of AH3?
Lots of questions but very few answers. A nice "round table" setup with HTC would be cool for getting answers, but this would delay the release more :D Ah well, all we can do is to continue to support HTC by paying our subscriptions and hope for the best.
Dale needs to approach Steam and see what kind of a deal he can make. The exposure Steam brings could breath life back into this game. Life this game desperately needs.
300 on a Saturday night? I remember two main arenas with one at full capacity (850 or so players?) plus the other one half full.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Shuffler on July 16, 2016, 02:04:20 PM
how many of us in the aces high community can play aces high 3 without an upgrade? I needed a new desktop upgrade to be able to play aces high 3 and it was time anyway. I couldn't even enjoy the graphics with my old desktop. i could still fly but no eye candy. So I saved my per diem and bought a new laptop for work and play 5 mo. ago as I was on location. it has a i 5 5200 nvidia geforce 940 m 2 gb dedicated vram card 8gb ddr3 l memory 1000gb hdd which I though was plenty based on what I could gleen from the forums and it made the aces high 2 game come alive in a way that I was amazed, at how much I was missing. when i got home i downloaded beta to my laptop only to find I cant play it as I guess i needed a better game card, duh. when I got my new desktop with the bells and whistles with a monster game card I am able to enjoy the game and the beta too. so what happens to the few of us left and the new soon to be interested players who need a special computer to enjoy the game. Im worried it will be even less populated. how come no one goes to the beta now as is except for a few. just wondering where this is all headed. I only started 3 years ago and I love this game. peace. GunFTR.
The laptop you bought is hardly a special computer. It is outmoded already. Hope it was cheap. Some may need a new video card for the new game, It leans on the video chip and memory more and on the cpu much less.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Shuffler on July 16, 2016, 02:05:16 PM
For you fellow dogfighter types...I mean, how many opponents do you really want at any given time? You don't need 600 people to have fun.
- oldman (...or perhaps you do, for some reason...?)
We sure have a great time on Monday nights in AVA.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: bustr on July 16, 2016, 02:20:07 PM
This last FSO we RAF Hurri and Spit pilots were out numbered 3 to 1. There were some epic confrontations from 30k right down onto the deck in defense of a strategic location. And that last big furball before everyone had to land was worth the admission price. There is always that last furball where the fighters hang out until the last minute going at it.
POTW realized we could get in two squad nights a week by joining FOS. So far Friday nights have not been disappointing. And the HOing and run crowd stays in the MA. Most of the fights end up fought by wingman pairs but, with the skill caliber in the FSO you need a wingman to compete.
FSO at least once a week accounts for a large number of skilled subscribers.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: jtdragon on July 17, 2016, 08:04:23 PM
I also see a lot less # of people on and the loss of players who have been here for years. One thing that no one has said anything about is that there are games out there now that draw people from here that were not around 5years ago. HT is to small to but out something like world of tank/warship and others. With me it's down to how much time I have to play, in some of the others if I have 30 minute I fight a couple of battles where here I'm just getting into the fight and have to leave. I find myself only playing a hour or 2 a week compared to 20+ a few years ago. Been with AH for 13 years but don't think I'll be around much longer.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: DmonSlyr on July 18, 2016, 06:10:19 AM
I also see a lot less # of people on and the loss of players who have been here for years. One thing that no one has said anything about is that there are games out there now that draw people from here that were not around 5years ago. HT is to small to but out something like world of tank/warship and others. With me it's down to how much time I have to play, in some of the others if I have 30 minute I fight a couple of battles where here I'm just getting into the fight and have to leave. I find myself only playing a hour or 2 a week compared to 20+ a few years ago. Been with AH for 13 years but don't think I'll be around much longer.
Yeah, that's why I would like to see a FFA arena on the DA map. The way it's set up now is still slow and creates too much advantage for players entering the fights. I've mentioned examples of a few changes to the map that would make it really fun easy to play if you only have a short amount of time to play. I think a FFA area with 5 green bases 5 K apart with no alt advantage would do the trick. This way players could roll and instantly be in the action. Just a thought I've been thinking on.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: shift8 on July 18, 2016, 03:25:06 PM
I too hope this game gets some new life. We desperately need more players or this is going to die.
However I hope HTC digs in like concrete when it comes to keeping the gameplay the same, I would hate for the game to be changed by the class of player that exists on the other sims. There is a new breed of moron out there, just roam the war thunder forums for two seconds. You will either get AIDS from what you read in threads, or you will throw up form all the lolicons in the avatars.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Hungry on July 18, 2016, 03:43:22 PM
I too hope this game gets some new life. We desperately need more players or this is going to die.
However I hope HTC digs in like concrete when it comes to keeping the gameplay the same, I would hate for the game to be changed by the class of player that exists on the other sims. There is a new breed of moron out there, just roam the war thunder forums for two seconds. You will either get AIDS from what you read in threads, or you will throw up form all the lolicons in the avatars.
A lot of the recent questions seem to revolve around whether or not the current style of gameplay is the correct gameplay for the longevity of the game, almost as stay the same and die or change and continue
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: The Fugitive on July 18, 2016, 03:56:02 PM
A lot of the recent questions seem to revolve around whether or not the current style of gameplay is the correct gameplay for the longevity of the game, almost as stay the same and die or change and continue
For a game that has been on line and operating for over 10 years I think they have a pretty good game. The problem is not with the game, but how people seem to go out of there way to "game the game" by cutting corners and not really play in the true spirit of the game. Im think HTC didn't build the game so that players can avoid interacting as much as possible.
I think the only things that are needed are small tweaks to stay ahead of those that look to cut corners and avoid player interaction.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Hungry on July 18, 2016, 04:03:44 PM
For a game that has been on line and operating for over 10 years I think they have a pretty good game. The problem is not with the game, but how people seem to go out of there way to "game the game" by cutting corners and not really play in the true spirit of the game. Im think HTC didn't build the game so that players can avoid interacting as much as possible.
I think the only things that are needed are small tweaks to stay ahead of those that look to cut corners and avoid player interaction.
I know what you're saying and I'll be back in the fall for sure (still pays the monthly) but if that's how people treat it and the player base is ? declining, then the gameplay still needs to change????
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Vudak on July 18, 2016, 04:04:32 PM
...Im think HTC didn't build the game so that players can avoid interacting as much as possible.
I don't think they meant to, but I think the way the sandbox is set up, the game is kind of built right now to encourage people to avoid interaction. I think the best way to make this game fun again is just to make sure that base takers and base defenders are reasonably likely to run into each other most of the time.
1. Enormous maps despite low populations 2. Radar underlap and ease of destruction (at least locally) which makes it fairly easy to avoid detection 3. Country switch times that don't allow people to self-balance (and really, what can a "spy" possibly do in this game aside from tell people where you are and what you're up to and allow there to be a confrontation). 4. Maps that encourage whack-a-mole style gameplay rather than epic fights over critical areas. Most fields are vanilla and a dime a dozen. There are very few maps that have decisive areas that attackers are willing to throw everything in to take, and defenders are willing to throw everything in to defend.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Hungry on July 18, 2016, 04:09:05 PM
I don't think they meant to, but I think the way the sandbox is set up, the game is kind of built right now to encourage people to avoid interaction. I think the best way to make this game fun again is just to make sure that base takers and base defenders are reasonably likely to run into each other most of the time.
1. Enormous maps despite low populations 2. Radar underlap and ease of destruction (at least locally) which makes it fairly easy to avoid detection 3. Country switch times that don't allow people to self-balance (and really, what can a "spy" possibly do in this game aside from tell people where you are and what you're up to and allow there to be a confrontation). 4. Maps that encourage whack-a-mole style gameplay rather than epic fights over critical areas. Most fields are vanilla and a dime a dozen. There are very few maps that have decisive areas that attackers are willing to throw everything in to take, and defenders are willing to throw everything in to defend.
Maybe regardless of the map size the game just needs a bigger "prize" for people to fight over, obviously winning the map (the War) just doesn't cut it anymore
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Brooke on July 18, 2016, 04:12:39 PM
3. Country switch times that don't allow people to self-balance (and really, what can a "spy" possibly do in this game aside from tell people where you are and what you're up to and allow there to be a confrontation).
Country switch has been discussed a lot in other topics. The conclusion was that HTC tried allowing it without restriction and found that it increased imbalance (i.e., the opposite of what we all want).
However, to some folks, the best idea seemed to be to allow country switching at any time to a country with fewer players.
As far as I know, that hasn't been tried, and it seems like it would be guaranteed to decrease imbalance.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Hungry on July 18, 2016, 04:17:26 PM
Country switch has been discussed a lot in other topics. The conclusion was that HTC tried allowing it without restriction and found that it increased imbalance (i.e., the opposite of what we all want).
However, to some folks, the best idea seemed to be to allow country switching at any time to a country with fewer players.
As far as I know, that hasn't been tried, and it seems like it would be guaranteed to decrease imbalance.
As long as the switch doesn't just cause a new imbalance, which causes a new imbalance, which causes a new imbalance
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Vudak on July 18, 2016, 04:23:12 PM
Country switch has been discussed a lot in other topics. The conclusion was that HTC tried allowing it without restriction and found that it increased imbalance (i.e., the opposite of what we all want).
However, to some folks, the best idea seemed to be to allow country switching at any time to a country with fewer players.
As far as I know, that hasn't been tried, and it seems like it would be guaranteed to decrease imbalance.
I was under the impression the reason the time has been tinkered with is because people who can't stomach combat would scream to high holy hell about spies ruining their NOE raids and sinking carriers they were trying to hide. I'm not sure I'm buying the imbalance argument when there's barely any of the old guard left who'd actually switch to a lower country to take on the odds either, but maybe I'm underestimating the number of people who would switch?
Regardless, the only country that needs to be switched to is the low #s one so that be a fine thing to try.
But placing this aside (it was kind of an earmark anyway), I do think the way the sandbox is set up favors those who want to avoid combat rather than those who want to find it.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Brooke on July 18, 2016, 04:39:12 PM
I would really like to be able to switch to the lower-number country whenever I wanted.
What keeps me from switching these days is switching to the lower-number country only to have it fluctuate and then be the higher-number country, and I'm stuck. So, I only switch when things get horrendously lopsided.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Hungry on July 18, 2016, 04:45:48 PM
I would really like to be able to switch to the lower-number country whenever I wanted.
What keeps me from switching these days is switching to the lower-number country only to have it fluctuate and then be the higher-number country, and I'm stuck. So, I only switch when things get horrendously lopsided.
And if you weren't "stuck" and again could switch to the lower side maybe not you but certainly it would be abused by some
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: The Fugitive on July 18, 2016, 05:15:56 PM
I don't think they meant to, but I think the way the sandbox is set up, the game is kind of built right now to encourage people to avoid interaction. I think the best way to make this game fun again is just to make sure that base takers and base defenders are reasonably likely to run into each other most of the time.
1. Enormous maps despite low populations
Agreed, the big maps must go FOR NOW. Once the numbers climb back up :pray bring them back in.
Quote
2. Radar underlap and ease of destruction (at least locally) which makes it fairly easy to avoid detection
I wish dar towers were a bit tougher to take out as well. However, as lond as bar dar reads low enough to the ground so NOEs don't get a free ride Im ok with it as it is.
Quote
3. Country switch times that don't allow people to self-balance (and really, what can a "spy" possibly do in this game aside from tell people where you are and what you're up to and allow there to be a confrontation).
The ENY swings are the reason for the longer switch time, not spying. Short times allowed quick large swings messing with ENY. http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,361462.msg4811379.html#msg4811379
Quote
4. Maps that encourage whack-a-mole style gameplay rather than epic fights over critical areas. Most fields are vanilla and a dime a dozen. There are very few maps that have decisive areas that attackers are willing to throw everything in to take, and defenders are willing to throw everything in to defend.
Bring back the zones. It made some bases more valuable than others and so those were fought foe more. The only problem with that is it take a map rebuild to fix I think.
The other things could be fixed/tested in AH2 now.
Nice to see you back again Vudak <S>
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Vudak on July 18, 2016, 05:35:43 PM
Hi Fugi,
I'll be flying for another month or two before I get burnt out again I'm sure :D It has nothing to do with graphics, btw.
Since you bring up ENY... Just a thought because I only started this game in 2004 and numbers were pretty healthy by then. This was when ENY restrictions were first coming out. I remember flying for several months without them.
I'm just going to throw this out there for consideration - is every single change that we now take for granted really necessary, useful, or conducive to good game play with player #s a fraction of what they once were? Every game has a bell curve of players.. It starts with 0 and it eventually unfortunately goes back there. In the meanwhile, #s reach points where certain changes are necessary. Towards the top of the curve, you had the split arenas.
Some things have changed with the curve and others seem to just stick around regardless.
I guess what I'm saying is that data and debate from 2014 doesn't necessarily mean anything in 2016 if you have less players now. Maybe we should look to what the arenas looked like when similar numbers were around (and the game was rising)?
Or maybe it was awful and those changes were years behind when they were needed - I don't know, I wasn't here.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: The Fugitive on July 18, 2016, 05:59:42 PM
The clientele was different back then. Far more players looking to "fight WWII". Today it is just another game that just happens to use WWII equipment. The relevance is no longer important.
In the old days we were all WWII pilots fighting for our country against the nasty Bish, Rooks, Knights. Missions were planned and organized, people were held to there assignments and players trained to get good to be able to achieve those assignment with out letting their teammates down.
Now its who/how to grab bases the quickest way as possible to reset the map. There is nothing behind the mission other than getting the base and moving on to the next one.
I the old days we could bomb and bail, but you didn't do that because you were suppose to bring that plane home. You didn't go for the HO because you could lose that fight in a single pass and you were suppose to shoot that guy down and bring your plane home. You didn't plant you plane next to the bomb you dropped on your jabo runs because you were expected to cover your squad/team mates runs and you were suppose to bring that plane home.
Now, it is much quicker to crash the plane with the bombs as there is no penalty and you can get in twice the runs and so twice the bombs. Flatten everything and then run in 5 goons/M3s because nobody can cover them any way.
Different time, different player, same game.
I think the tweaks to the game cant move backwards to what we had before as that no longer is valid. I do think however that the game tweaks must progress with the way players look to get around things in the game. I cant say that I know Hitech's mind, but I cant believe that what we have today is what he had in mind when he built the " best WW2 and WW1 combat experience online! " as it says on the main web page.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Rich46yo on July 18, 2016, 08:21:27 PM
No squeekers. In a nutshell no squeekers.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Oldman731 on July 18, 2016, 09:29:26 PM
The clientele was different back then. Far more players looking to "fight WWII". Today it is just another game that just happens to use WWII equipment. The relevance is no longer important.
Agreed.
- oldman
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Guppy35 on July 18, 2016, 09:47:22 PM
I would really like to be able to switch to the lower-number country whenever I wanted.
What keeps me from switching these days is switching to the lower-number country only to have it fluctuate and then be the higher-number country, and I'm stuck. So, I only switch when things get horrendously lopsided.
Wouldn't you think there would be a way to allow folks the option to switch to a lower number country? At the same time not allow switching to a higher number country? I'd think odds would be the guys who want to fight would switch to balance things out.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Vudak on July 18, 2016, 09:52:03 PM
Wouldn't you think there would be a way to allow folks the option to switch to a lower number country? At the same time not allow switching to a higher number country? I'd think odds would be the guys who want to fight would switch to balance things out.
Wasn't switching sides to balance game play part of the way ENY was "sold" back in the day, anyway?
Option A: Fly a different plane Option B: Switch countries Option C: Log
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Invictus84 on July 19, 2016, 07:09:51 PM
- Niche game. - Dated graphics. - 90s user interface ("What the heck is a dot command?"). - Little to no promotion ("I don't see it in the Stream store.") - Legacy subscriber model. - Legacy distribution model. ("I can't get it off Stream? You mean I have to download and install it myself?!?!") - Entrenched user community resistant to change.
Sounds like a wonderful recipe to attract new subscribers.
Welcome to irrelevance.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Brooke on July 19, 2016, 07:11:16 PM
I am recruiting my two 6-year-old daughters in the game! The new generation of squeakers is on its way! :aok
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Tumor on July 19, 2016, 11:37:46 PM
- Niche game. - Dated graphics. - 90s user interface ("What the heck is a dot command?"). - Little to no promotion ("I don't see it in the Stream store.") - Legacy subscriber model. - Legacy distribution model. ("I can't get it off Stream? You mean I have to download and install it myself?!?!") - Entrenched user community resistant to change.
Sounds like a wonderful recipe to attract new subscribers.
Welcome to irrelevance.
Well, these are all valid points. But, the game is still a "good" game. We have a certain amount of goofy stuff that goes on, but not a whole lot. To bring in modern gamer types, HTC has to increase the allowable buffoonery exponentially. I saw some new Tank based game being advertised awhile back, had a cool scene of a small tank driving off and elevated position and making a mid-air broadside kill shot on an enemy. Buffoonery looks really cool, it's attractive, cool, and stupid... so, we can have a cool WW2 based combat simulator/game with relatively low numbers (which by comparison, I'd say HTC in it's best days didn't have the base the more popular stuff does), OR we can have another Doober Convention that's really nothing more than a control-complicated FPS. I mean, lets look at the bright side.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Estes on July 19, 2016, 11:55:09 PM
Just a little too late, the big boot of the future has caught up to the game.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Vudak on July 20, 2016, 05:12:02 AM
I have no idea how many dormant people are keeping their subscriptions up out there without ever playing, but it sure seems like they're the reason this game is still around at this point. I wouldn't be surprised if the credit cards are getting leaned on over at HTC right about now given the numbers you see in the arenas.
Hopefully, everyone's investment in AH3 pays off, player numbers increase, HTC is a massive success, and order is restored to the universe...
Regardless, I think we all need to think about how we will all treat the new folks coming in... we have one shot at this.
Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: LCADolby on July 20, 2016, 05:28:03 AM
I know of at least 3 people currently keeping subbed but not flying.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Vudak on July 20, 2016, 05:43:02 AM
I'm usually one of them too. I'm just hoping enough like what they find in AH3 to keep doing it (or better yet start playing).
Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Oldman731 on July 20, 2016, 07:27:37 AM
- Dated graphics. - 90s user interface ("What the heck is a dot command?").
LOL you've obviously never heard of Dayz/Minecraft/Roblox and so on.
Some of the most popular games right now use graphics they look like they were dragged out of the 90s, and even my 4 year old knows command line input for minecraft stuff.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Tumor on July 20, 2016, 11:47:24 PM
LOL you've obviously never heard of Dayz/Minecraft/Roblox and so on.
Some of the most popular games right now use graphics they look like they were dragged out of the 90s, and even my 4 year old knows command line input for minecraft stuff.
True, but Mindcraft doesn't have competition from similar games with better graphics. Regardless of what you feel about War Thunder or the fact that the IL2 and DCS Sims are not massive multilayer games, they ARE competitors to AH. As for console commands, yes it's true many other games have console commands, but only the advanced users need use them. It could be argued that some elements of AH require dot commands, but I grant that in most cases their use isn't required for core gameplay.
At the end of the day, the issue is simple: AH is fun but has dated graphics, a steep learning curve and is somewhat inaccessible for most mid-2010 gamers. Those elements detract from its appeal. It's a shame, as the game itself is quite fun with well populated servers.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: JunkyII on July 21, 2016, 03:26:11 PM
As a bit of a realist, unless there are some big changes in game play (some Im sure I wont like) this game is going to wallow along only for a short time after the AH3 update.
You post that like your proud of that number. Just a couple of weeks ago there were over 300 on a Saturday night.
Pretty graphics may bring in new players IF they run the ads MAX is so optimistic about, but what is there that is going to entice them to stay?
Bullys sending PMs? Large learning curve so that they can barely compete? Runners and bailers who enjoy AVOIDING combat? Lack of radar for hours on end? Huge maps to spread out fronts? Puffy ack that can kill a maneuvering fighter but cant hit a SET of buffs. Being part of a horde or dying to one is your main choice of flights?
I haven't been able to spend a lot of time in the Beta tho I do load each update and check to see if the basics work on my computer (updates, loads, starts, roll a plane or two check FR ) but the biggest thing I see right now is the update points to tanking more than anything else. Of course your cant make "air" look all that much better. I just hope it doesn't turn into Aces Low with any new player that come in.
Im sure the VR support HTC is adding will be a big seller with some people, but is that market all that big to support all the time involved in adding and tweaking it? How long has this delayed the release of AH3?
Lots of questions but very few answers. A nice "round table" setup with HTC would be cool for getting answers, but this would delay the release more :D Ah well, all we can do is to continue to support HTC by paying our subscriptions and hope for the best.
THIS right here says a lot of what I have been thinking. I used to love this game. I remember a great time when Fuzz24 PMed me after Magoo and I nailed him and two others. "Man I knew I was in trouble when I saw you guys in formation and then you dropped your tanks together." He came Rook and was a Fourthman for awhile before life pulled him away.
Now... I just get frustrated when I log in. I am honestly about to go as well. Not sure my machine will run the new update, not sure I want to spend 15 bucks which is honestly a lot for me right now. A community that is nasty to each other drives me away. I came back because of pals I knew on here for years. A pal like HEELER who was a contrary old man, yes. But that man called me at least once a month while I was off the game in grad school... When I was going through some of the darker moments of my civilian life... And honestly I thought of him mostly when I came back.
Now people are like tough crap you don't like things then leave. Folks, at some point HT has to pull the plug - think about the money he does NOT get anymore after going from x to y number of subscribers. We can fix some of that just by not being jerks to each other.
Today I logged in and a member PMed me to tell me about honest to God harassment. Like USC type harassment. now that I look at that I realize I am in professor mode, sorry - federal law as in clinky clink with some anti-bullying laws that are being considered and interesting ways prosecutors are using some old stuff. We don't need that sort of crap, it drives folks off.
Police your community. Be helpful to new folks. Even the *cringe* squeekers that talk to much. We have one right now that sometimes I want to throat punch, but I have yet to say anything to him. He's learning. We all did, and for those of us that were taken under someone's wing like Zip and then mostly HEELER did for me.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Estes on July 21, 2016, 05:16:16 PM
let's not forget that dayz also charged for the early access alpha and it's still sitting there for (i'd have to get on steam to be precise), but as long if not longer than the AH Beta. The ironic thing is, there is way more people still playing that than there has ever been the beta here. :confused:
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: JunkyII on July 21, 2016, 05:17:35 PM
let's not forget that dayz also charged for the early access alpha and it's still sitting there for (i'd have to get on steam to be precise), but as long if not longer than the AH Beta. The ironic thing is, there is way more people still playing that than there has ever been the beta here. :confused:
H1Z1 has thousands playing it.....still in Beta :aok
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Zoney on July 21, 2016, 05:45:04 PM
nevermind :bolt:
Edited because for just a moment I forgot what I truly believe in, shown in my signature.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Lusche on July 21, 2016, 05:50:51 PM
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Zoney on July 21, 2016, 05:53:22 PM
Thank you.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Lusche on July 21, 2016, 05:58:14 PM
Now edit the last one too and all will be fine again ;)
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: shotgunneeley on July 21, 2016, 09:03:38 PM
You know, I looked into Battleground Europe last year for the first time. During my first couple of weeks reviewing it, I would visit the forums to try and learn stuff. I saw these kinds of posts and it was a major turnoff to even try the game. It is one thing to post wishes and constructive criticism, but all of this negative talk about low numbers and poor game play quality sure doesn't go towards drawing a crowd imho. While it certainly looked interesting, I didn't give it much of a chance with one of the reasons being the energy sucking atmosphere of the community.
I feel like getting up some real missions to jump start battles would go a long way. I know I'm one to talk because I am not one to have a plan. This is a game very much run by leaders in the community and it will take more to step up in order to It is going to take more to step up and foster a competitve spirit to be attractive to new players.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: save on July 22, 2016, 06:25:19 PM
WW2online have a very good ground war, the air-war is not up to AH, but again the ground war is much better than Aces High in my opinion.
Ground troops, towed guns better tank simulator, and a command structure AH currently missing in arenas.
And ww2ionline have the best icon system n any game i've seen.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Changeup on July 24, 2016, 08:03:28 AM
AH3 is being held up for inclusion-coding of a VR device?
Holy hell. Again, why am I not shocked. Most people cant afford to upgrade their computers much less add a VR device.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: The Fugitive on July 24, 2016, 10:51:21 AM
This is turning into "Combat Tour" all over again. Combat tour was an ambitious idea but the coading was taking a very long time due to the small number of coaders working on it. It was eventually shelved and update to the game begain again.
Tho the video is no longer hosted, it shows that the AH3 update has been in the works since early 2014. While we have no "numbers" of subscribers that AH has, nor do those always reflect how many players play in the mains ( a lot of players only play in FSO, or Scenarios) a dirty check can be made of ranking in tour 170 vs last tour completed. A rank in the "captures field" were there were no captures gives you a number for all of those who placed "last" in captures for that tour. Going by that number there is last than 50% of players getting captures.
So that means either a lot more people are capturing base and so being tied for last is moving up the number, or that the number of people playing has dropped. Going by Lusche recent posting of captures...
I don't think the number is really going up for the number of captures, so that leads me to believe that the numbers of players has dropped by almost half in 2 years. In the year leading up to the "shelving" of Combat tour the numbers stayed the same, but those numbers were 50% higher population than we had at the beginning of AH3 work. We have lost more than 2/3 of the population in the main arenas in the past 8 years.
I'm sure there is a lot more involved as to the "why" we have lost so many players, but I think the lack of HTC presence in the arenas certainly is one of them. I cant picture what this game has become as what Hitech and Pyro thought of as as good game to go into business with.
My CO has decided to cancel his account and move on. It just isn't fun for him any more. Squad nights use to be some mission to start some action that turned into fun for a lot of players from either side of the fight. Now missions turn into either circling a base waiting for the "enemy" to come out of the ack or 88's, an undefended base where NO ONE ups, or a group that does defend but need to start the defense by flying in the stratosphere.
The main idea of the game, fighting/combat has been lost to the new gamers that look at "winning the war" the quickest easiest way possible. Last night prime time US (10PM eastern) there were last than 200 players on line with about a quarter of those sitting in the tower. 40 or so players per team on a large map. Heck those numbers barely make a horde.
One team gets ganged, Rooks were pushing the Bish and they did put up a bit of a defense, but they were also fighting the Knights who were trying to get back all the bases the Bish had NOEd earlier along the shore. Funny how when ever we have a map with water up the Bish seem to own most of the shore line? NOEs are easier to run across water don't cha know :devil
So of course Bish were crying about how the Rook "horde" was singling them out, and that the Rook/Knight alliance was strong. It was the only fight going. I ran a buff run and not a single player came up after me. Landed 32K in damage with a set of B24s, oh what fun! Fully in dar the whole time.
We are losing players everyday. HTC better do something or they will open AH3 to the last dozen or so of us that will stick it out as we have stuck it out through the years. Sure it will be pretty, but we still wont be able to find a fight.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: caldera on July 24, 2016, 11:18:41 AM
Quote
it shows that the AH3 update has been in the works since early 2014.
AH3 is being held up for inclusion-coding of a VR device?
Holy hell. Again, why am I not shocked. Most people cant afford to upgrade their computers much less add a VR device.
While I lament the long development time as well, I'm convinced this is an absolute necessity. VR is the up and coming thing and here to stay. Prices are insanely high at the moment, but there's still an amazing (IMHO) number of early adopters, especially in the sim community. And prices will drop, no doubt about it. Much better to integrate it now while the engine is still in the coding phase than trying to somehow attach it later.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Easyscor on July 24, 2016, 12:11:26 PM
What Lusche said, but we're all anxious for it to go live.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: The Fugitive on July 24, 2016, 12:14:35 PM
I believe that VR is important as well, however, to the exclusion of the rest of the game? No, not really. They could have pushed AH3 out and added the VR afterwards, or they could spend some time addressing what many believe are issues in the current game. Whether they make adjustments or not, addressing the "issues" publicly could go a ways in helping "keep the peace" as it were WHILE they continue work on AH3.
The seeming "neglect" to the present game just doesn't look good.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: JOACH1M on July 24, 2016, 01:10:39 PM
What's vr
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Lusche on July 24, 2016, 01:17:15 PM
virtual reality. Oculus Rift and such
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Changeup on July 24, 2016, 03:34:48 PM
While I lament the long development time as well, I'm convinced this is an absolute necessity. VR is the up and coming thing and here to stay. Prices are insanely high at the moment, but there's still an amazing (IMHO) number of early adopters, especially in the sim community. And prices will drop, no doubt about it. Much better to integrate it now while the engine is still in the coding phase than trying to somehow attach it later.
While I appreciate you alibiing for HTC, he could have gotten AH3 out the door while paralleling development of VR coding...just like adding aircraft. Because the current cost of VR is so clearly out of reach for a high % of the player base, it wasn't wise and it simply wasn't necessary. I'm sure we'll hear something along the lines of "we needed to do it now because of the new graphics engine because doing it later would mean a complete re-do...blah blah. " So predictable.
And, had 3 been released with what surely would have been a marketing thrust of some kind, he likely would have had that parallel VR coding paid for by new subs and the likely subs of vets he absolutely would have kept. Not all...but most.
Just because its a game doesn't mean the following statement isn't true although some here will argue that in the face of lost logic, MBA programs all over the world, AND serious business leaders who are responsible for increasing shareholder equity every single day of their professional lives:
"It takes 5 time more capital to attract and retain new customers than it does to keep existing customers"
Existing customers aren't always happy but neither are new customers and to watch someone argue that statement is tantamount to admitting they aren't a business person at all. Maybe they don't want to be. Ok. Then they'll start over at business a lot of times in their life unnecessarily and a very high financial cost.
Sorry I went Bustr. :bolt:
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: TwinBoom on July 24, 2016, 04:11:24 PM
i for one would just like more aircraft, to hell with terrain. just my opinion. if i cared about terrain i wouldn't be wanting to fly aircraft simple. terrain we have no is sufficient and easy on guys older machines.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: hitech on July 24, 2016, 06:24:15 PM
While I appreciate you alibiing for HTC, he could have gotten AH3 out the door while paralleling development of VR coding...just like adding aircraft. Because the current cost of VR is so clearly out of reach for a high % of the player base, it wasn't wise and it simply wasn't necessary. I'm sure we'll hear something along the lines of "we needed to do it now because of the new graphics engine because doing it later would mean a complete re-do...blah blah. " So predictable.
And, had 3 been released with what surely would have been a marketing thrust of some kind, he likely would have had that parallel VR coding paid for by new subs and the likely subs of vets he absolutely would have kept. Not all...but most.
Just because its a game doesn't mean the following statement isn't true although some here will argue that in the face of lost logic, MBA programs all over the world, AND serious business leaders who are responsible for increasing shareholder equity every single day of their professional lives:
"It takes 5 time more capital to attract and retain new customers than it does to keep existing customers"
Existing customers aren't always happy but neither are new customers and to watch someone argue that statement is tantamount to admitting they aren't a business person at all. Maybe they don't want to be. Ok. Then they'll start over at business a lot of times in their life unnecessarily and a very high financial cost.
Sorry I went Bustr. :bolt:
Your analytical ability of the software and entertainment industry shows how much of a clueless bloviated dolt you really are.
HiTech
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Paladin3 on July 24, 2016, 06:29:22 PM
i for one would just like more aircraft, to hell with terrain. just my opinion. if i cared about terrain i wouldn't be wanting to fly aircraft simple. terrain we have no is sufficient and easy on guys older machines.
While it may be sufficient for you, it's not sufficient in the long term for the game to survive. AH needs what is coming in the beta, otherwise AH will continue to wither on the vine.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Invictus84 on July 24, 2016, 07:37:01 PM
While I appreciate you alibiing for HTC, he could have gotten AH3 out the door while paralleling development of VR coding...just like adding aircraft. Because the current cost of VR is so clearly out of reach for a high % of the player base, it wasn't wise and it simply wasn't necessary. I'm sure we'll hear something along the lines of "we needed to do it now because of the new graphics engine because doing it later would mean a complete re-do...blah blah. " So predictable.
I think HTC's decision to include VR support is sound. Most of the competing products include or will soon have VR support.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Estes on July 24, 2016, 07:40:46 PM
I made the exact same point as changeup in some other thread along the same lines a couple days back that I can't remember now, and just like with my post I see they are missing fugitives and changeups point heh.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Paladin3 on July 24, 2016, 07:46:36 PM
That VR is good but roll the product and add it later?
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Estes on July 24, 2016, 08:41:38 PM
Quote from: Estes on July 17, 2016, 01:12:12 PM Heres my concern, the alpha/beta has been out what? A year now? And other than vague descriptions about destructible bridges and such, all we have to go from is better graphics which if the numbers in the beta and reading the boards is any indicator - not many seem to be able to run, or at least run it with it looking any different from what it currently does. I don't know how many are still here that remember the whole combat tour thing, but that's my biggest concern is getting Deja-Vu over again.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Masherbrum on July 24, 2016, 09:36:21 PM
Your analytical ability of the software and entertainment industry shows how much of a clueless bloviated dolt you really are.
HiTech
I think "bloviated buffoon" would have been funnier. Just sayin
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Vudak on July 25, 2016, 08:05:58 AM
Nvm.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Triton28 on July 25, 2016, 08:44:24 AM
If we're being honest about analysis of the gaming industry and whatnot, HTC missed the starting gun on creating a new version by 2 - 3 years. Doesn't make much sense to be a proudly small development team and start late, but here we are. From my observation that lack of responsiveness was due to a combination of overconfidece, distraction, and general disdain for any customer that wasn't stroking the ego of the developer.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Zardoz on July 25, 2016, 11:42:21 AM
Your analytical ability of the software and entertainment industry shows how much of a clueless bloviated dolt you really are.
HiTech
You tell 'em buddy! :salute
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Paladin3 on July 25, 2016, 12:08:15 PM
It is unprofessional, rude and disrespectful, not to mention seems to me to be conduct in violation of rule 4. The OP may be in error but that is not good PR. As far as analytical ability I have a post graduate degree in social sciences so I'm pretty sure that as I make my point I at least do not have to do so by resorting to name calling.
I am disappointed that the company is that willing to be abrasive to people having spirited debate and that the community is that willing to abuse one of their own. This is not the Aces I left a year ago, and it isn't in game either.
Why are we losing members? I think HT is onto something with the graphics. It needs an update and we all are fairly agreed on that point. But when I talk to people who come back it is less to fly a cartoon airplane than the sense of community. That is anecdotal of course, but it seems to be the big thing people say.
Maybe folks should say their peace and not be targeted for it. Agree to disagree, and do so without lashing out. This is a forum after all. We aren't always going to agree with others, and can do it without being rude, and thus reducing the impact of our point.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Zardoz on July 25, 2016, 12:17:15 PM
Quote
While I appreciate you alibiing for HTC, he could have gotten AH3 out the door while paralleling development of VR coding...just like adding aircraft. Because the current cost of VR is so clearly out of reach for a high % of the player base, it wasn't wise and it simply wasn't necessary. I'm sure we'll hear something along the lines of "we needed to do it now because of the new graphics engine because doing it later would mean a complete re-do...blah blah. " So predictable.
How do you expect him to react to something like this? I would have used stronger language.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: hitech on July 25, 2016, 12:51:23 PM
It is unprofessional, rude and disrespectful, not to mention seems to me to be conduct in violation of rule 4. The OP may be in error but that is not good PR. As far as analytical ability I have a post graduate degree in social sciences so I'm pretty sure that as I make my point I at least do not have to do so by resorting to name calling.
I am disappointed that the company is that willing to be abrasive to people having spirited debate and that the community is that willing to abuse one of their own. This is not the Aces I left a year ago, and it isn't in game either.
Why are we losing members? I think HT is onto something with the graphics. It needs an update and we all are fairly agreed on that point. But when I talk to people who come back it is less to fly a cartoon airplane than the sense of community. That is anecdotal of course, but it seems to be the big thing people say.
Maybe folks should say their peace and not be targeted for it. Agree to disagree, and do so without lashing out. This is a forum after all. We aren't always going to agree with others, and can do it without being rude, and thus reducing the impact of our point.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Paladin stating an opinion of Aces High, or game play or what needs to change in a game is all normal discussion. Trying to tell me I could have first shipped AH3 and then added VR to it has nothing to do with the "Game" and every thing to do with telling me I don't know how to manage software production (I have only been doing it for over 30 years). It's an attempt at doing nothing but smearing HTC. Changeup has absolutely no idea of what it takes /took to integrate VR into a game. He has no knowledge or basis to even make a guess.
I very rarely jump on players until they cross a line of respect. I have been working on AH3 for 2 1/2 years. No one wants to get it out the door more than me. To state that it is unwise to make a design change that absolutely is nothing like plane integration (I had to rewrite the virtual frame work to work on both DX9 and DX11 to implant VR) is simply talking about issues that the poster has no knowledge of. To "bla bla bla" at my previous statement with out any knowledge of how dx9 and dx11 even integrate shows a complete lack of respect.
The poster has no knowledge of what I have done over the past 20 years to attempt to make a customers life longer. Making a claim that keeping a current customer playing the same computer game forever is cheaper then finding new ones is simply not looking at how real people change interests over time.
I have seen posts like the one I quoted many many times over the years. They all are based in the same issue. The player played for a long time and simply is not having as much fun as they used to. They fail to realize that a lot of the fun they were having was discovering new things and over coming the challenges that Aces High gave them. The fact that they are no longer discovering new things is what is causing them to no longer enjoy the game.
Most people simply leave when they reach this point. A few don't see that they have reach that point and then want to blame me and HTC and other players for their lack of fun.
This is the point at which no amount of effort I make will keep them around enjoying the game. They even complain and criticize my efforts to bring them something new.
HiTech
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Zardoz on July 25, 2016, 01:06:46 PM
Paladin stating an opinion of Aces High, or game play or what needs to change in a game is all normal discussion. Trying to tell me I could have first shipped AH3 and then added VR to it has nothing to do with the "Game" and every thing to do with telling me I don't know how to manage software production (I have only been doing it for over 30 years). It's an attempt at doing nothing but smearing HTC. Changeup has absolutely no idea of what it takes /took to integrate VR into a game. He has no knowledge or basis to even make a guess.
I very rarely jump on players until they cross a line of respect. I have been working on AH3 for 2 1/2 years. No one wants to get it out the door more than me. To state that it is unwise to make a design change that absolutely is nothing like plane integration (I had to rewrite the virtual frame work to work on both DX9 and DX11 to implant VR) is simply talking about issues that the poster has no knowledge of. To "bla bla bla" at my previous statement with out any knowledge of how dx9 and dx11 even integrate shows a complete lack of respect.
The poster has no knowledge of what I have done over the past 20 years to attempt to make a customers life longer. Making a claim that keeping a current customer playing the same computer game forever is cheaper then finding new ones is simply not looking at how real people change interests over time.
I have seen posts like the one I quoted many many times over the years. They all are based in the same issue. The player played for a long time and simply is not having as much fun as they used to. They fail to realize that a lot of the fun they were having was discovering new things and over coming the challenges that Aces High gave them. The fact that they are no longer discovering new things is what is causing them to no longer enjoy the game.
Most people simply leave when they reach this point. A few don't see that they have reach that point and then want to blame me and HTC and other players for their lack of fun.
This is the point at which no amount of effort I make will keep them around enjoying the game. They even complain and criticize my efforts to bring them something new.
HiTech
:salute
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Hungry on July 25, 2016, 01:33:00 PM
Hitech
With all due respect we as players in an effort to "help" do get it wrong, but might I suggest that the forums here wouldn't get to the point above if there were a different style of moderation. Don't get me wrong Skuzzy does a great job but his guidelines appear to be Rules Violations and Technical Support. Some of these long drawn out peeing contests could be resolved before they ever get to this point by a simple interaction from your staff. Too many times the players are left to pure conjecture and anecdotal information. See the Control a Destroyer thread an example where two words from someone on your staff could have changed / ended / clarified the whole conversation before it got to the point it did.
Respectfully
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Lazerr on July 25, 2016, 01:57:57 PM
Paladin stating an opinion of Aces High, or game play or what needs to change in a game is all normal discussion. Trying to tell me I could have first shipped AH3 and then added VR to it has nothing to do with the "Game" and every thing to do with telling me I don't know how to manage software production (I have only been doing it for over 30 years). It's an attempt at doing nothing but smearing HTC. Changeup has absolutely no idea of what it takes /took to integrate VR into a game. He has no knowledge or basis to even make a guess.
I very rarely jump on players until they cross a line of respect. I have been working on AH3 for 2 1/2 years. No one wants to get it out the door more than me. To state that it is unwise to make a design change that absolutely is nothing like plane integration (I had to rewrite the virtual frame work to work on both DX9 and DX11 to implant VR) is simply talking about issues that the poster has no knowledge of. To "bla bla bla" at my previous statement with out any knowledge of how dx9 and dx11 even integrate shows a complete lack of respect.
The poster has no knowledge of what I have done over the past 20 years to attempt to make a customers life longer. Making a claim that keeping a current customer playing the same computer game forever is cheaper then finding new ones is simply not looking at how real people change interests over time.
I have seen posts like the one I quoted many many times over the years. They all are based in the same issue. The player played for a long time and simply is not having as much fun as they used to. They fail to realize that a lot of the fun they were having was discovering new things and over coming the challenges that Aces High gave them. The fact that they are no longer discovering new things is what is causing them to no longer enjoy the game.
Most people simply leave when they reach this point. A few don't see that they have reach that point and then want to blame me and HTC and other players for their lack of fun.
This is the point at which no amount of effort I make will keep them around enjoying the game. They even complain and criticize my efforts to bring them something new.
HiTech
I dont get bored with this game for 1 second when there are fights going on. Huge maps and the resupply the way it is really put a damper on that.
Thanks for your hard work overall though.. the new game looks great. I wish you would look into what Ive mentioned a few times about the functionality of mouse control. I think Im one of the few around here that have used it since day 1.
:cheers:
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: hitech on July 25, 2016, 01:59:14 PM
With all due respect we as players in an effort to "help" do get it wrong, but might I suggest that the forums here wouldn't get to the point above if there were a different style of moderation. Don't get me wrong Skuzzy does a great job but his guidelines appear to be Rules Violations and Technical Support. Some of these long drawn out peeing contests could be resolved before they ever get to this point by a simple interaction from your staff. Too many times the players are left to pure conjecture and anecdotal information. See the Control a Destroyer thread an example where two words from someone on your staff could have changed / ended / clarified the whole conversation before it got to the point it did.
Respectfully
I really really wish this were the case. In my experience it's not.
Case in point, my response in this thread just caused you to bring up another issue to complain (i use the word very very lightly) / suggest about.
HiTech
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Paladin3 on July 25, 2016, 02:06:30 PM
"Paladin stating an opinion of Aces High, or game play or what needs to change in a game is all normal discussion. Trying to tell me I could have first shipped AH3 and then added VR to it has nothing to do with the "Game" and every thing to do with telling me I don't know how to manage software production (I have only been doing it for over 30 years). It's an attempt at doing nothing but smearing HTC. Changeup has absolutely no idea of what it takes /took to integrate VR into a game. He has no knowledge or basis to even make a guess."
HT - thanks for the reply! Hate to take you away from 1s and 0s or however it is done, but I do appreciate the time you took to address my concern.
"I very rarely jump on players until they cross a line of respect. I have been working on AH3 for 2 1/2 years. No one wants to get it out the door more than me."
I bet about getting it out the door. Might I suggest though that we have enough issues loosing folks that I ask for a moderate approach. I ask that because while I was not the one offending, I was really taken aback by that tone. Somewhere someone posted something about not joining a different game because of the things they saw on the forum and it was worded in a way to make me think that the poster thought that we had a black eye ourselves in that respect. I would agree. I imagine you are frustrated. To my understanding you guys have a small company and this seems like a large project. I can appreciate that, even if I don't do coding. Projects lasting years can really grate on anyone.
I am aware of my ignorance. Some folks aren't. I may not understand, for instance because I made a post in another thread that I thought it would be wiser to add in VR later. That may not be doable the way you have worked things out.
I am frustrated. The community is frustrated. You, I imagine, are frustrated. I am sorry for that, and I am sorry I have lost my temper a few times myself. Nothing is more frustrating than some of the oddities in a online gaming scenario that just makes a player question what the hades just happened.
"I have seen posts like the one I quoted many many times over the years. They all are based in the same issue. The player played for a long time and simply is not having as much fun as they used to. They fail to realize that a lot of the fun they were having was discovering new things and over coming the challenges that Aces High gave them. The fact that they are no longer discovering new things is what is causing them to no longer enjoy the game.
Most people simply leave when they reach this point. A few don't see that they have reach that point and then want to blame me and HTC and other players for their lack of fun.
This is the point at which no amount of effort I make will keep them around enjoying the game. They even complain and criticize my efforts to bring them something new."
I think I understand what you are saying here, and I am interested to see your take on the issue at hand about where folks are going. Many people leave and come back. I have thought about it myself. I enjoy a lot of the fella's in here in some weird way though as a community.
Hold on there. Or hang on there. I imagine you get a lot of flak. I've fired a bit myself I know. I do ask though that the folks that I pay money to bite their tongue a bit. Take me out behind the woodshed if you must. But what was gained? Instead, your post here was very enlightening. I would have bought that myself.
Forgive me, I want to see you succeed because I would love to come back in here in a time and see 1000 players or more. I'd love to be winging with three or more other guys and going and doing our thing. So many folks have gone (for various reasons, not all voluntary to be sure) that the community suffers.
I'll try to work harder on biting my tongue. Lord knows I am horrible at that.
Again, thanks for the reply, and I apologize for taking so many words to get my point across (professional flaw of a professor I think).
:salute Good luck.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Hungry on July 25, 2016, 02:14:32 PM
I really really wish this were the case. In my experience it's not.
Case in point, my response in this thread just caused you to bring up another issue to complain (i use the word very very lightly) / suggest about.
HiTech
Only as an example, sorry for the confusion, by that I mean you had players chewing on each other over a point perhaps you or your staff were the only ones qualified to answer, player discord
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: JunkyII on July 25, 2016, 02:17:00 PM
I dont get bored with this game for 1 second when there are fights going on. Huge maps and the resupply the way it is really put a damper on that.
Side switch time during the day could also help with that but I'd be ok with no big maps and nerfed fields supps from M3s. Game has so much in it but those few game mechanics really do stop combat.....
Oh and Hitech can we get uncaturable tank town fields so we can insure constant action in those areas at least???
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: TheBug on July 25, 2016, 02:19:32 PM
Side switch time during the day could also help with that but I'd be ok with no big maps and nerfed fields supps from M3s. Game has so much in it but those few game mechanics really do stop combat.....
Oh and Hitech can we get uncaturable tank town fields so we can insure constant action in those areas at least???
I believe you just need to come to terms with the fact that you are just bored with the game and need to quit so your endless M3 posts will stop.
:)
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: JunkyII on July 25, 2016, 02:27:03 PM
I believe you just need to come to terms with the fact that you are just bored with the game and need to quit so your endless M3 posts will stop.
:)
Ive been playing all day!!! Ndisles can hold my attention for a long time because it's small and keeps action compact, m3 resupply is easier to counter, and the center fight almost always excellent...except when some takes one of those center v bases like the bish did this morning....barely saw any tank fight in center when yesterday there was about 10-15 tanks going at it in the center....shouldn't anything that takes away from combat, be considered bad for the game??? That's my opinion and I'll keep voicing it because I'm an arse :aok
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: hitech on July 25, 2016, 02:28:29 PM
Paladin: I don't disagree with what your wrote, nore with you basic premises.
But there is a miss conception that we are loosing players at a faster rate then we used to. That is a completely falls assumption. We are a sink with an inflow and out flow. In fact all our business models from day 1 have 2 primary variables,The number of new customers per month. and Customer life span.
Guess which one I'm most concerned about?
HiTech
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: bustr on July 25, 2016, 02:31:52 PM
I wish most of you guys had been doing testing since August 2014 versus all of your attempts to tell each other who , what, why and how Hitech has gotten it wrong. I'm ready to take up knitting and try out for the USA Olympic knitting team at this point. I had to keep playing AH2 after I spent all this time in proto-AH3 even when it was just a tadpole and all of the bases and strats were 1000ft tall Bock Beer bottles sitting on dust. I was praying beta3 was go live.
At least watching those of you who are playing in the beta now made it worth walking and driving through the town so many times when I wanted to quit out of boredom. You missed an exciting 2 year game of getting the next patch for what, about 120 patches now, to see what Hitech had cooked up or, what would be broken to report back.
The "open alpha" was a surprise, and more of you could have joined us to watch Hitech at work. Some did and Hitech allowed the good and really rotten personal posts to generate speculating how he has gone wrong yet again.
I still cannot figure out what he personally did to any of you. At least I think this time AH3 may be close. I really hope so, then you will have something more fundamental about the game itself to harangue him with.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: TheBug on July 25, 2016, 02:38:26 PM
I hear ya, just teasing. I voiced my opinion with my wallet, it's the only way to get any traction. <S> Good luck. I do hope things improve more than graphics and realistic star positions.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: JunkyII on July 25, 2016, 02:40:37 PM
Paladin: I don't disagree with what your wrote, nore with you basic premises.
But there is a miss conception that we are loosing players at a faster rate then we used to. That is a completely falls assumption. We are a sink with an inflow and out flow. In fact all our business models from day 1 have 2 primary variables,The number of new customers per month. and Customer life span.
Guess which one I'm most concerned about?
HiTech
I do like this action I seen in the comments section here https://youtu.be/Wqp_e9ve904
You can see there is definitely still interest in the game by people outside of the community....looking forward to seeing what you guys do advertising wise after AH3 release.
I hear ya, just teasing. I voiced my opinion with my wallet, it's the only way to get any traction. <S> Good luck. I do hope things improve more than graphics and realistic star positions.
I know you were but some think I'm just trying to get people to play my way when actually I'm just hoping they engage in combat....Notice I don't ever have any problems with JG11...because I know you guys fight :aok
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Paladin3 on July 25, 2016, 02:55:29 PM
Paladin: I don't disagree with what your wrote, nore with you basic premises.
But there is a miss conception that we are loosing players at a faster rate then we used to. That is a completely falls assumption. We are a sink with an inflow and out flow. In fact all our business models from day 1 have 2 primary variables,The number of new customers per month. and Customer life span.
Guess which one I'm most concerned about?
HiTech
I would hope both honestly, for reward to product loyalty.
If I'm reading that right you are saying we are loosing the same amount as always (a range I imagine) but that we aren't attracting new players to keep up with the standard rate of attrition? Thus we have shrunk?
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: hitech on July 25, 2016, 03:10:30 PM
I would hope both honestly, for reward to product loyalty.
If I'm reading that right you are saying we are loosing the same amount as always (a range I imagine) but that we aren't attracting new players to keep up with the standard rate of attrition? Thus we have shrunk?
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Correct. I should have said "Currently most concerned about."
HiTech
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Vudak on July 25, 2016, 04:35:01 PM
I have seen posts like the one I quoted many many times over the years. They all are based in the same issue. The player played for a long time and simply is not having as much fun as they used to. They fail to realize that a lot of the fun they were having was discovering new things and over coming the challenges that Aces High gave them. The fact that they are no longer discovering new things is what is causing them to no longer enjoy the game.
You have a point here, HiTech. I think a lot of the reason I don't have as much fun in this game is because I'm at or near a plateau. Even so, and with respect, this sandbox is not set up to help the higher skilled players continue to find the challenges that are out there – each other – at least not without leaving the MA to go to KoTH, Midwar Madness, or the DA. So, basically, they get siloed in these little compartments that lack all the variety of the MA.
It can be very difficult to find someone who is willing to interact with you in the MA. It’s a lot like fishing a drop shop – you have to go through a ton of bluegills before you ever catch a bass. While you can’t be held accountable for human nature, you do make the rules for the sandbox, and they aren’t helping things.
-You maintain enormous maps as part of your rotation despite very low numbers (really, bases outnumber players sometimes - not fun).
-You maintain a very long country switch time (basically if I don’t wake up and log on before I head to work to switch my countries, I’m going to spend ½ of my available play time as part of a horde). I understand 1 hour isn’t happening. Would you consider 2 or 3? Is it so wrong for me to want to be able to switch sides during an evening play session?
-Radar is very limited and easily damaged which makes it difficult to find cons. This is nice from a historical perspective/bounce perspective, but very frustrating from the perspective of someone who has a short time to play.
-You do not celebrate people who try to interact with each other on your home page. The only difficult tasks that are celebrated are those who score well, which often leads people to not interact. This is all well and good – it is difficult to achieve #1 – but it would be great to see you mention who wins KOTH, or what side won a scenario or FSO or squad duel or race. It’d also likely drive more subscribers as the place would look lively, and one of the best things AH has over its competitors (the numerous and varied special events) would be at center stage.
-The war mechanism, at present, encourages the path of least resistance. Why bother doing anything other than NOE? I'm looking forward to seeing if this changes in AH3.
I do respect you for working with us every day and hope this post doesn't offend you.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Shuffler on July 25, 2016, 04:43:08 PM
If we're being honest about analysis of the gaming industry and whatnot, HTC missed the starting gun on creating a new version by 2 - 3 years. Doesn't make much sense to be a proudly small development team and start late, but here we are. From my observation that lack of responsiveness was due to a combination of overconfidece, distraction, and general disdain for any customer that wasn't stroking the ego of the developer.
Please post the website of your game so that we may try it out. With such obvious knowledge of the gaming industry you must be on the forefront of game design and marketing. I can't wait to check it out.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Estes on July 25, 2016, 04:44:42 PM
Please post the website of your game so that we may try it out. With such obvious knowledge of the gaming industry you must be on the forefront of game design and marketing. I can't wait to check it out.
I'm sure he would link it, but it's probably on one of those "anti-social sites" you don't use. :aok
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Shuffler on July 25, 2016, 04:47:23 PM
You have a point here, HiTech. I think a lot of the reason I don't have as much fun in this game is because I'm at or near a plateau. Even so, and with respect, this sandbox is not set up to help the higher skilled players continue to find the challenges that are out there – each other – at least not without leaving the MA to go to KoTH, Midwar Madness, or the DA. So, basically, they get siloed in these little compartments that lack all the variety of the MA.
It can be very difficult to find someone who is willing to interact with you in the MA. It’s a lot like fishing a drop shop – you have to go through a ton of bluegills before you ever catch a bass. While you can’t be held accountable for human nature, you do make the rules for the sandbox, and they aren’t helping things.
-You maintain enormous maps as part of your rotation despite very low numbers (really, bases outnumber players sometimes - not fun).
-You maintain a very long country switch time (basically if I don’t wake up and log on before I head to work to switch my countries, I’m going to spend ½ of my available play time as part of a horde). I understand 1 hour isn’t happening. Would you consider 2 or 3? Is it so wrong for me to want to be able to switch sides during an evening play session?
-Radar is very limited and easily damaged which makes it difficult to find cons. This is nice from a historical perspective/bounce perspective, but very frustrating from the perspective of someone who has a short time to play.
-You do not celebrate people who try to interact with each other on your home page. The only difficult tasks that are celebrated are those who score well, which often leads people to not interact. This is all well and good – it is difficult to achieve #1 – but it would be great to see you mention who wins KOTH, or what side won a scenario or FSO or squad duel or race. It’d also likely drive more subscribers as the place would look lively, and one of the best things AH has over its competitors (the numerous and varied special events) would be at center stage.
-The war mechanism, at present, encourages the path of least resistance. Why bother doing anything other than NOE? I'm looking forward to seeing if this changes in AH3.
I do respect you for working with us every day and hope this post doesn't offend you.
:aok
I like the part about radars.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Masherbrum on July 25, 2016, 08:57:59 PM
It is unprofessional, rude and disrespectful, not to mention seems to me to be conduct in violation of rule 4. The OP may be in error but that is not good PR. As far as analytical ability I have a post graduate degree in social sciences so I'm pretty sure that as I make my point I at least do not have to do so by resorting to name calling.
I am disappointed that the company is that willing to be abrasive to people having spirited debate and that the community is that willing to abuse one of their own. This is not the Aces I left a year ago, and it isn't in game either.
Why are we losing members? I think HT is onto something with the graphics. It needs an update and we all are fairly agreed on that point. But when I talk to people who come back it is less to fly a cartoon airplane than the sense of community. That is anecdotal of course, but it seems to be the big thing people say.
Maybe folks should say their peace and not be targeted for it. Agree to disagree, and do so without lashing out. This is a forum after all. We aren't always going to agree with others, and can do it without being rude, and thus reducing the impact of our point.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Paladin, you were more rude than Dale was. Even I knew what his response would be. If he ships it out now to appease the masses, some of you will piss and moan for months on; "Why was this rushed?" Putting him against the firing squad. But the majority of his player base, understand what he is doing and needs to do to get this right.
With all due respect we as players in an effort to "help" do get it wrong, but might I suggest that the forums here wouldn't get to the point above if there were a different style of moderation. Don't get me wrong Skuzzy does a great job but his guidelines appear to be Rules Violations and Technical Support. Some of these long drawn out peeing contests could be resolved before they ever get to this point by a simple interaction from your staff. Too many times the players are left to pure conjecture and anecdotal information. See the Control a Destroyer thread an example where two words from someone on your staff could have changed / ended / clarified the whole conversation before it got to the point it did.
Respectfully
I like the sly "Hey Dale, this part over here is broken. Drop what you're doing there real quick and fix it, while dragging out the release just a little bit longer and potentially lose even more players."
Some of these posts to Dale should be a wake up call. Instead, most will shift the spotlight to something else rather than to try and be part of the solution.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: nrshida on July 26, 2016, 01:03:33 AM
I think Vudak expressed this best from a long-term player's perspective: it's the plateaus which cause disillusionment. At the same same time there's an awful lot of vets who still enjoy playing or even pop back from time to time.
But there is a miss conception that we are loosing players at a faster rate then we used to. That is a completely falls assumption. We are a sink with an inflow and out flow. In fact all our business models from day 1 have 2 primary variables,The number of new customers per month. and Customer life span.
Guess which one I'm most concerned about?
HiTech
Regarding the attention to which group you are more concerned with. Clearly new players are vital and needed for the continuation of AH and of course we all recognize and want that. I propose however you ought not underestimate the importance of the second group: the long-term players, because in addition to having helped support your business for an extensive amount of time they also act as ambasaors for the game. Not polite, welcoming, accomodating ambasadors but as beacons of what is capable when you push these excellently flight-modelled simulated aeroplanes to and beyond their limits and the limits of the accepted convention of ACM.
Sure they only pay one subscription per month but they might engage (or contribute to the engagement of) a dozen subscribers who aren't as skilled but aspiring to be so. Speaking for myself it was certainly this minority that kept my interest engaged because I wanted to get as good as them and they showed it was possible. They aren't proportional to one subscription's worth of business perhaps as would outwardly appear.
Regarding criticism, well I hesistate to say this and perhaps it's informative that I feel that way but you do seem rather reactive to criticism. I know that your handling of some of the members of that facton over the 12-hour rule for instance was considered unreasonable, confrontational, unsympathetic and draconian. I know for a fact that the way that incident was handled drove several top sticks away from the game when you could have equally said: 'okay, players with a subscription longer than 2 years can swap countries every hour', say. A small and trivial concession on HTC's part. Instead people were suspended or PNGed from the forum for essentially disagreeing with you and especially disagreeing with you in a certain way.
The point is regarding criticism / suggestions the danger is that one becomes convinced that they've heard it all before and are right. In the education system I am involved with receiving critical feedback is a required stage and designed to prevent this. You might not be aware or unable to integrate how players experience this or that. Sure you know your business well, one can hardly have survived for so long otherwise (I also love the sink analogy. Perfect), however the community of players, especially the long-term level-headed ones that have contributed quite a lot do have important things to say or suggest from time to time. Taking advantage of that and listening where appropriate would allow you to have your cake and eat it, so to speak.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Vudak on July 26, 2016, 05:26:40 AM
Not for nothing but last night I had the perfect storm and had a blast:
1. It was a small map (Baltic) 2. I was on the right country to start (Knight) which allowed me to switch to Rook later as numbers swung - I always had stuff to shoot at 3. Radar was up in the Gulf of Finland region so I could find people quickly
I basically spent the night fighting Anti-Horde. They got me more than I got them, but it's not about winning (despite what so, so many people on this forum mistakenly think) - it's about being challenged and finding/fighting your friends. I like those guys - they fight.
This game is still freaking brilliant when it works, but a lot of things have to fall in line for that to happen. From my perspective, a lot of things you, HiTech, can control.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Slade on July 26, 2016, 08:12:54 AM
Just keep ample red guys to shoot down and I'm playing this game for life. It really is that simple for me.
HiTech have modeled these planes incredibly. As a software developer myself I find the quality of the product superb.
Thanks :salute
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Triton28 on July 26, 2016, 08:17:41 AM
Please post the website of your game so that we may try it out. With such obvious knowledge of the gaming industry you must be on the forefront of game design and marketing. I can't wait to check it out.
lol... What's obvious is you want to disagree with me but can't really figure out how to type it out.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Hungry on July 26, 2016, 08:18:16 AM
I like the sly "Hey Dale, this part over here is broken. Drop what you're doing there real quick and fix it, while dragging out the release just a little bit longer and potentially lose even more players."
Some of these posts to Dale should be a wake up call. Instead, most will shift the spotlight to something else rather than to try and be part of the solution.
You sir are 100% wrong, please re read what I said,
Some of these long drawn out peeing contests could be resolved before they ever get to this point by a simple interaction from your staff. Too many times the players are left to pure conjecture and anecdotal information. See the Control a Destroyer thread an example where two words from someone on your staff could have changed / ended / clarified the whole conversation before it got to the point it did.
Only as an example, sorry for the confusion, by that I mean you had players chewing on each other over a point perhaps you or your staff were the only ones qualified to answer, player discord
Good now that wasn't so hard was it
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: puller on July 26, 2016, 08:18:44 AM
I basically spent the night fighting Anti-Horde. They got me more than I got them, but it's not about winning (despite what so, so many people on this forum mistakenly think) - it's about being challenged and finding/fighting your friends. I like those guys - they fight.
:salute
We had good fights all evening...
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: hitech on July 26, 2016, 09:10:18 AM
You sir are 100% wrong, please re read what I said,
Some of these long drawn out peeing contests could be resolved before they ever get to this point by a simple interaction from your staff. Too many times the players are left to pure conjecture and anecdotal information. See the Control a Destroyer thread an example where two words from someone on your staff could have changed / ended / clarified the whole conversation before it got to the point it did.
Only as an example, sorry for the confusion, by that I mean you had players chewing on each other over a point perhaps you or your staff were the only ones qualified to answer, player discord
Good now that wasn't so hard was it
Hungry please read my previous post to you again, you are proving my point, a response from me just cause you to start arguing/ trying to convince me to act differently. I gave you an answer to you request of responding to posts. But now your arguing with me vs other players.
So the basic answer to your request is NO,I will not typically reply to wishes like the destroyer thread. My responding to a thread like that would not change peoples minds. The argument would continue, they would also be also telling me how I don't understand there idea. Tell I am not seeing things clearly. ....
HiTech
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Hungry on July 26, 2016, 09:18:01 AM
Hungry please read my previous post to you again, you are proving my point, a response from me just cause you to start arguing/ trying to convince me to act differently. I gave you an answer to you request of responding to posts. But now your arguing with me vs other players.
So the basic answer to your request is NO,I will not typically reply to wishes like the destroyer thread. My responding to a thread like that would not change peoples minds. The argument would continue, they would also be also telling me how I don't understand there idea. Tell I am not seeing things clearly. ....
HiTech
Sorry the second half of this response was much clearer than the previous, I only meant that I am not trying to distract you to work on something else.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Masherbrum on July 26, 2016, 10:27:42 AM
You sir are 100% wrong, please re read what I said,
Some of these long drawn out peeing contests could be resolved before they ever get to this point by a simple interaction from your staff. Too many times the players are left to pure conjecture and anecdotal information. See the Control a Destroyer thread an example where two words from someone on your staff could have changed / ended / clarified the whole conversation before it got to the point it did.
Only as an example, sorry for the confusion, by that I mean you had players chewing on each other over a point perhaps you or your staff were the only ones qualified to answer, player discord
Good now that wasn't so hard was it
My comprehension skills are just fine. But thank you for your concern.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: The Fugitive on July 26, 2016, 11:00:26 AM
Hungry please read my previous post to you again, you are proving my point, a response from me just cause you to start arguing/ trying to convince me to act differently. I gave you an answer to you request of responding to posts. But now your arguing with me vs other players.
So the basic answer to your request is NO,I will not typically reply to wishes like the destroyer thread. My responding to a thread like that would not change peoples minds. The argument would continue, they would also be also telling me how I don't understand there idea. Tell I am not seeing things clearly. ....
HiTech
Personally, using the "control a destroyer " thread as an example, I would like to see a clear answer like "We at HTC have, at this time, no plans to change how any of the naval operations work in the game."
It gives a clear answer. It shows HTC is aware and does respond to ideas. Will it shut every one up? No, but many will bookmark that responce and use it as an answer when and if the question pops up.
I does show good will, whIch never comes easy but is worth much.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: hitech on July 26, 2016, 11:14:22 AM
Personally, using the "control a destroyer " thread as an example, I would like to see a clear answer like "We at HTC have, at this time, no plans to change how any of the naval operations work in the game."
It gives a clear answer. It shows HTC is aware and does respond to ideas. Will it shut every one up? No, but many will bookmark that responce and use it as an answer when and if the question pops up.
I does show good will, whIch never comes easy but is worth much.
Quote
you are proving my point, a response from me just cause you to start arguing/ trying to convince me to act differently
HiTech
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Hungry on July 26, 2016, 11:47:37 AM
I think Vudak expressed this best from a long-term player's perspective: it's the plateaus which cause disillusionment. At the same same time there's an awful lot of vets who still enjoy playing or even pop back from time to time.
Regarding the attention to which group you are more concerned with. Clearly new players are vital and needed for the continuation of AH and of course we all recognize and want that. I propose however you ought not underestimate the importance of the second group: the long-term players, because in addition to having helped support your business for an extensive amount of time they also act as ambasaors for the game. Not polite, welcoming, accomodating ambasadors but as beacons of what is capable when you push these excellently flight-modelled simulated aeroplanes to and beyond their limits and the limits of the accepted convention of ACM.
Sure they only pay one subscription per month but they might engage (or contribute to the engagement of) a dozen subscribers who aren't as skilled but aspiring to be so. Speaking for myself it was certainly this minority that kept my interest engaged because I wanted to get as good as them and they showed it was possible. They aren't proportional to one subscription's worth of business perhaps as would outwardly appear.
Regarding criticism, well I hesistate to say this and perhaps it's informative that I feel that way but you do seem rather reactive to criticism. I know that your handling of some of the members of that facton over the 12-hour rule for instance was considered unreasonable, confrontational, unsympathetic and draconian. I know for a fact that the way that incident was handled drove several top sticks away from the game when you could have equally said: 'okay, players with a subscription longer than 2 years can swap countries every hour', say. A small and trivial concession on HTC's part. Instead people were suspended or PNGed from the forum for essentially disagreeing with you and especially disagreeing with you in a certain way.
The point is regarding criticism / suggestions the danger is that one becomes convinced that they've heard it all before and are right. In the education system I am involved with receiving critical feedback is a required stage and designed to prevent this. You might not be aware or unable to integrate how players experience this or that. Sure you know your business well, one can hardly have survived for so long otherwise (I also love the sink analogy. Perfect), however the community of players, especially the long-term level-headed ones that have contributed quite a lot do have important things to say or suggest from time to time. Taking advantage of that and listening where appropriate would allow you to have your cake and eat it, so to speak.
I like Cake :aok HTC lets us have cake! :D
In all seriousness, well thought out and well put.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Wiley on July 26, 2016, 01:17:19 PM
Isn't the spirit of the Wish List in its entirety an attempt to get you to act differently?
Respectfully, Hungry, it's more like a suggestion box than a "post your wish and open a direct dialog with Hitech about it" forum.
They monitor the wishlist pretty closely. If they like an idea and it's feasible, they implement it. If not, they don't. What people on either side of whatever discussion arises in there have to say is nearly irrelevant unless it improves the original idea. A player saying "that won't work" doesn't mean a thing if HT thinks it will. Similarly, a player gainsaying for an idea isn't going to make much difference if HT doesn't like it.
It's about that simple.
Wiley.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Paladin3 on July 26, 2016, 02:02:29 PM
Paladin, you were more rude than Dale was. Even I knew what his response would be. If he ships it out now to appease the masses, some of you will piss and moan for months on; "Why was this rushed?" Putting him against the firing squad. But the majority of his player base, understand what he is doing and needs to do to get this right.
I do not see it. I was shocked. Brutally shocked to see that kind of behavior from the owner of a company we pay money to. Was the post wrong? In error I mean? I have no idea, but I'll take HT's word that it is since he took a moment to explain things. I still feel that the tone was completely wrong and that the owner of a company should not stoop to name calling in a forum. It shows bad form to those thinking of coming into AH, and it sours some of those who don't like to be on the end of such behavior.
No one should be disrespected, but it is harder when it is the one that is supposed to remain neutral so that they can moderate discussion right?
So I disagree with you sir. My comment was a WTH moment. I did not call anyone names. I can disagree without doing so, and explain my position and I believe I have. I also am not the owner / representative here. Should I be held to a lesser standard? No, as I said in my post to HT. I will aspire to do better. I apologize to you HT if you took offense to my post, if that was not clear before. It was really a finger version of a verbal woah.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Masherbrum on July 26, 2016, 02:24:39 PM
I do not see it. I was shocked. Brutally shocked to see that kind of behavior from the owner of a company we pay money to. Was the post wrong? In error I mean? I have no idea, but I'll take HT's word that it is since he took a moment to explain things. I still feel that the tone was completely wrong and that the owner of a company should not stoop to name calling in a forum. It shows bad form to those thinking of coming into AH, and it sours some of those who don't like to be on the end of such behavior.
No one should be disrespected, but it is harder when it is the one that is supposed to remain neutral so that they can moderate discussion right?
So I disagree with you sir. My comment was a WTH moment. I did not call anyone names. I can disagree without doing so, and explain my position and I believe I have. I also am not the owner / representative here. Should I be held to a lesser standard? No, as I said in my post to HT. I will aspire to do better. I apologize to you HT if you took offense to my post, if that was not clear before. It was really a finger version of a verbal woah.
Changeup was PNG'd, so this discussion is moot.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: TheBug on July 26, 2016, 02:26:26 PM
edited:no longer relevant
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: amp on July 26, 2016, 02:50:40 PM
The topic made me feel sad... :frown:
So....
I re-subscribed and am happy again! :banana:
Now, if only I could get my good name back. :aok
:salute :cheers:
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Bear76 on July 26, 2016, 02:55:28 PM
I like turtles :aok
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Rolex on July 26, 2016, 04:29:59 PM
I'm in the VR business, building hardware, firmware, algorithms and software. Our systems are used by the producers of Game of Thrones, by NASA and we're number one in our industry with game developers worldwide.
Game developers tell us similar themes - getting new players to commit (yes, it's a commitment) to a game these days requires an "experience." That's what younger people want.
VR provides that experience. There aren't many new hardware advances these days. VR is not easy to implement, and HTC doesn't have rooms full of developers. I can't imagine how hard it is to do and create a new engine at the same time. Even harder with customers (who have no idea what the challenges are) throwing darts at them while they're working on it.
But, it's important for any game now.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Lusche on July 26, 2016, 04:31:40 PM
No, that's because I can't afford that stuff :ahand
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: DmonSlyr on July 26, 2016, 05:29:31 PM
Man, I just lost a 5 kill sortie from a puff ack at 12K diving at 460 MPH straight down, 8K away from the enemy CV while I was over my own CV. I just go Poof. Like a F u Cing sniper shot my my pilot from the boat 12K high. "You have been killed" What a joke. Then I watch bomber fly right through and take no damage.
I get 10 minutes to play today and my sortie gets instantly ruined.
I mean come on. This crap has got to be fixed. It's just such BS.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Masherbrum on July 26, 2016, 05:30:01 PM
:rofl
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Rolex on July 26, 2016, 06:02:28 PM
Sorry to hear that, Lusche, but that's a lifestyle choice your family has made. ;)
Oculus Rift is $599.
Hey, we have no idea what platform they're using. They could be doing something radical like porting a VR version to Android so the hardware would be inexpensive. We ported a Windows Unity-based 3D program to Android far easier than we thought we could. I doubt they're doing that, but you never know...
There aren't too many successful business models based on prospective customers being in poverty.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Paladin3 on July 26, 2016, 06:29:22 PM
Was he png'd over that post?
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: pembquist on July 26, 2016, 06:47:44 PM
If not being able to justify shelling out 600 bucks for breakfast goggles is considered poverty than I need to move to a poorer country, or at least one where the mass affluent are less out of touch with the circumstance of most people. Oops! Politics leakage ABORT ABORT!
Oh! And Damn You Auto Complete!
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Gman on July 26, 2016, 06:52:56 PM
I think the OSVR units coming will make VR affordable. For 3 or 400$, the price of a mid range/decent video card, it'll make entry into VR a reality for a lot of gamers. It IS expensive now, I spent $2175 for a Vive and Rift CDN, that's retail on the dot after shipping/tax for new units. However with the Razer OSVR and other options coming, that will equal the Rift in performance according to early reports - as Rolex said, it DOES provide a crazy immersive experience compared to monitor gaming. We have had 4 of the best gaming monitors you can buy this year, 34" and 2 27" ROG Swift Asus and a 4k 28" Acer, all Gsync. I NEVER thought you would drag me away from my lcd panels for gaming, especially for flight sims. I'm hooked on VR, for DCS I'll never go back, and once AH/HTC comes up with a way to make quick head movements to the rear for tracking enemy planes in fights faster than how VR is now (HT has already suggested ideas I believe he is working on for this very reason), I'll never go back for AH/Beta either.
Until you actually try it, and get that feeling of speed on the deck, of altitude looking out of your cockpit up at high alt, and the feeling looking around inside the cockpit - you just can't tell, especially from YT videos, what you're missing.
I understand the frustrations of waiting for AH3, but what I took away from what HT said, regarding dx9/dx11/VR/etc, that if he doesn't work on implementing VR into the new product NOW, it'll be FAR harder and slower slugging to do it LATER. That's just an assumption, but that's the gist of what I read between the lines. For average long term player, it seems like balancing pushing AH3 out faster vs inclusion of VR. Since VR IS the future, and not just IMO but in pretty much every gaming mag/site/etc out there, I think HTC is placing their chips at least partially with VR being able to attract new players into the new game.
I've commented enough over the years vis a vis HTC forum/PR policy and repeating and rehashing one player's opinions isn't going to make any difference, so I'll stand pat on that for once. I do think that VR will be at very least important, and in all likelihood critical to the future success of AH3. Unfortunately that likely = more time until AH3 launches. Unfortunately that likely = more time until AH3 launches. It's not really HTC's fault that VR came out near the latter part of their development cycle, and I'll wager the first time they used it in their shop and got it working in the air or in another flying demo, it was a pretty obvious decision that it was something that needed to be included with AH3.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Rich46yo on July 26, 2016, 06:58:38 PM
WW2online have a very good ground war, the air-war is not up to AH, but again the ground war is much better than Aces High in my opinion.
Ground troops, towed guns better tank simulator, and a command structure AH currently missing in arenas.
And ww2ionline have the best icon system n any game i've seen.
Does anyone still play that game? Boy in its day it was a great game but i thought the numbers were zilch, plus the poor decisions they make like not allowing non-members into the forums so they can see the state of the game or even learn about it.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Gman on July 26, 2016, 06:59:18 PM
WW2online is pretty dead.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: hitech on July 26, 2016, 07:00:06 PM
Boy it was The Bomb in its heyday. Between this game and WWll OL I wasnt getting much sleep. :lol
It was fun when it first came out, despite the bugs like Bf110s taking off like helicopters for flying down the road on the deck in a Ju87 and flipping trucks and tanks over with your landing gear. Unfortunately the Rats never got the air war component part of the game right but the ground war was sure fun.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Bruv119 on July 29, 2016, 03:01:22 PM
Man, I just lost a 5 kill sortie from a puff ack at 12K diving at 460 MPH straight down, 8K away from the enemy CV while I was over my own CV. I just go Poof. Like a F u Cing sniper shot my my pilot from the boat 12K high. "You have been killed" What a joke. Then I watch bomber fly right through and take no damage.
I get 10 minutes to play today and my sortie gets instantly ruined.
I mean come on. This crap has got to be fixed. It's just such BS.
Yuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuup.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Vraciu on July 29, 2016, 08:04:18 PM
Man, I just lost a 5 kill sortie from a puff ack at 12K diving at 460 MPH straight down, 8K away from the enemy CV while I was over my own CV. I just go Poof. Like a F u Cing sniper shot my my pilot from the boat 12K high. "You have been killed" What a joke. Then I watch bomber fly right through and take no damage.
I get 10 minutes to play today and my sortie gets instantly ruined.
I mean come on. This crap has got to be fixed. It's just such BS.
Could not agree more. Has happened to me more times than I can count. Usually I get oiled on the first ping. Kinda ridiculous.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Vraciu on July 29, 2016, 08:05:59 PM
Man, I just lost a 5 kill sortie from a puff ack at 12K diving at 460 MPH straight down, 8K away from the enemy CV while I was over my own CV. I just go Poof. Like a F u Cing sniper shot my my pilot from the boat 12K high. "You have been killed" What a joke. Then I watch bomber fly right through and take no damage.
I get 10 minutes to play today and my sortie gets instantly ruined.
I mean come on. This crap has got to be fixed. It's just such BS.
Yea 1st ping hit knocked my wing off the other night....was maneuvering all over....starting to think it doesn't matter how much you move your plane.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Rich46yo on July 29, 2016, 09:45:12 PM
No the air combat was "better" but it had its pluses. The view system was much different and you had to work to get what few airplanes were available. I remember some very lifelike air and land battles. I mean big and there was quite a bit of strategy involved. You cant beat the airplanes available in AH tho.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: nrshida on July 30, 2016, 02:00:32 AM
Yea 1st ping hit knocked my wing off the other night....was maneuvering all over....starting to think it doesn't matter how much you move your plane.
I also hold the opinion the ship ack is far too accurate. If you look at real footage on YouTube there's no comparison. Someone ought to start a logical and evidenced petition perhaps.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Max on July 30, 2016, 08:16:57 AM
No the air combat was "better" but it had its pluses. The view system was much different and you had to work to get what few airplanes were available. I remember some very lifelike air and land battles. I mean big and there was quite a bit of strategy involved. You cant beat the airplanes available in AH tho.
MUCH much better. But still.. there's always that feel of "not quite right" with the Air aspect. Years ago, when I saw a bunch of 109s constantly popping their landing gear in/out, I decided to keep my flying to AH where it's good, and my ground game there... where it's light-years ahead of AH.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Vraciu on July 30, 2016, 03:39:53 PM
Even when jinking like someone from THUD RIDGE you get hammered...
Don't know if it's just a rumor but the argument against nerfing Puffy is "you just need to manuever more and instead of straight and level flight while in puffy ack"...thinking more and more that it's a rumor and it doesn't really matter at all what you do while in it...manuevering will make it harder for 5 inchers but the auto puffy is the best at this game after trees.....
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Vraciu on July 30, 2016, 04:53:31 PM
Don't know if it's just a rumor but the argument against nerfing Puffy is "you just need to manuever more and instead of straight and level flight while in puffy ack"...thinking more and more that it's a rumor and it doesn't really matter at all what you do while in it...manuevering will make it harder for 5 inchers but the auto puffy is the best at this game after trees.....
+1
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: The Fugitive on July 30, 2016, 09:58:20 PM
Don't know if it's just a rumor but the argument against nerfing Puffy is "you just need to manuever more and instead of straight and level flight while in puffy ack"...thinking more and more that it's a rumor and it doesn't really matter at all what you do while in it...manuevering will make it harder for 5 inchers but the auto puffy is the best at this game after trees.....
I very rarely get hit by puffy when in a fighter NOT attacking the CV. Predictable will get you killed. If your zoom climbing after a target, your dead, but if your turning and burning at 5K with 3 it isn't puffy you have to worry about.
It does seem that is you fly over in a perk plane you can kiss that baby goodbye.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Vraciu on July 30, 2016, 10:05:09 PM
I very rarely get hit by puffy when in a fighter NOT attacking the CV. Predictable will get you killed. If your zoom climbing after a target, your dead, but if your turning and burning at 5K with 3 it isn't puffy you have to worry about.
It does seem that is you fly over in a perk plane you can kiss that baby goodbye.
Try flying in a Pony then. Maybe it is just a Pony thing.
I have been at 25K with a CV barely in vis range and PING. Oiled. Or PING. PK.
Tonight I was diving away from the CV (never went anywhere near it in terms of "attack") at 450+ turning, climbing, diving, etc.. Ping. Oiled. Ping. PW.
Total bull hockey.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Shuffler on July 30, 2016, 11:04:18 PM
Try flying in a Pony then. Maybe it is just a Pony thing.
I have been at 25K with a CV barely in vis range and PING. Oiled. Or PING. PK.
Tonight I was diving away from the CV (never went anywhere near it in terms of "attack") at 450+ turning, climbing, diving, etc.. Ping. Oiled. Ping. PW.
Total bull hockey.
I shot you.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Estes on July 30, 2016, 11:43:38 PM
I shot the sheriff.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: guncrasher on July 31, 2016, 12:20:43 AM
how about the deputy?
semp
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Max on July 31, 2016, 07:23:12 AM
He did NOT shoot the deputy!
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: pipz on July 31, 2016, 08:07:36 AM
Try flying in a Pony then. Maybe it is just a Pony thing.
I have been at 25K with a CV barely in vis range and PING. Oiled. Or PING. PK.
Tonight I was diving away from the CV (never went anywhere near it in terms of "attack") at 450+ turning, climbing, diving, etc.. Ping. Oiled. Ping. PW.
Total bull hockey.
You'll get further making your case to a brick wall. Just saying.
Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: rvflyer on July 31, 2016, 04:40:34 PM
Oh yeah, I get so scared when the radars go down. :x :x Anyone that has played the game for any length of time does not need a radar to play and attack and figure out where the red guys are.
Oh yeah, I get so scared when the radars go down. :x :x Anyone that has played the game for any length of time does not need a radar to play and attack and figure out where the red guys are.
When there's numbers, I agree with you, but when you're trying to find 1 to 2 cons in a sector (and they're the only ones on a front) it's just another thing that gets in the way of an interaction.
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Title: Re: loss of members
Post by: Vraciu on July 31, 2016, 05:41:01 PM