Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: caldera on June 01, 2012, 12:33:11 PM
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Surely, this has been brought up before (and yes, I am calling you Shirley :)) but some of the ENY ratings seem more than a little off.
109K-4 - 20 ENY
Ki-84 - 20 ENY
Umm, ok. :huh
These two are monster planes that should probably be 10-12 ENY.
110G-2 - 10 ENY
Mosquito VI - 30 ENY
Umm, ok. Wait... what?! :huh
For comparison sake, the I-16 is 35 ENY and the P-40N is identical to the Mossie at 30 ENY. :headscratch:
The 110 and Mossie should both be about 20 ENY.
And there you have it. Talk amongst yourselves.
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Look at the usage of each.
Now, as much as I hate to say it, the Mossie should be lowered. That 30 is a legacy of the old 338mph Mosquito. The Bf110G-2's low 12 ENY is a legacy of its all base smash and grab days. However, the Bf110G-2 still sees twice the usage of the Mossie and so should have a lower ENY. Perhaps 25 for the Mossie and 15 for the Bf110G-2.
The Bf109K-4 and Ki-84 both have relatively low usage, particularly when compared to the P-51D.
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Going by extreme over-usage, can we have the P-51D ENY at -5? :D
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In
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My list:
109G2 - 25.0
109G6 - 20.0
109G14 - 15.0
109K4 - 10.0
Bf110G2 - 20.0
F6F-5 - 20.0
Ki-84 - 15.0
Fw-190D - 10.0
Mosquito - 25.0
Yak-T - 30.0
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I'd not object to the P-51D being lowered to 2 at this point.
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:headscratch: :headscratch: :headscratch: Nope! :headscratch: :headscratch: :headscratch:
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I'd not object to the P-51D being lowered to 2 at this point.
Or leave it at 5 and perk any ordnance it might carry. Or have the ENY restrictions kick in sooner.
I know this is a tangent not intended in the original post (or a "whole nuther", as some would say), but what the hell*:
Late War Tour 148 - Top Fighters/kills in:
1. P-51D - 23,260 kills
2. Spit XVI - 12,280
3. La-7 - 9305
The P-51D actually had 1675 more kills than the Spit XVI and La-7 combined. This is not unusual for the plane in question. Do some checking of your own and see for yourselves.
In
I was of course, kidding about the -5 ENY. Do you not agree that it is overused? Feel free to post a more substantial opinion.
* Blame it on Karnak. He started it. :angel:
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I'd not object to the P-51D being lowered to 2 at this point.
This quickly made chart could give a hint on what happened to fighter usage in the last years:
(http://img267.imageshack.us/img267/645/clipboard02pl.jpg)
It's important to keep in mind that the P-51 kill share is almost completely (~90%) made up of kills by the P-51D alone, while the Spitfire kills are distributed over all models with the dreaded Spit 16 having only about 46% of them.
The Pony is the most widely used fighter by a huge margin, with a good K/D to boot. And more important... has anyone seen Spitfire raids taking down large fields or sinking CVs in a few moments?
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This chart may even better highlight the D-Pony's current standing:
(http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/2787/clipboard02eh.jpg)
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Going by extreme over-usage, can we have the P-51D ENY at -5? :D
shoot you can have it at zero and it still wont stop people from flying it. at least not me.
semp
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shoot you can have it at zero and it still wont stop people from flying it. at least not me.
semp
Sure it will. I see the ENY limited at 2 and 3 pretty frequently. It just doesn't hit 5 very often.
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Lusche,
Where does the K4 fit into that chart?
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K4 = K/D 1.48 and usage 2.81%
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Going by extreme over-usage, can we have the P-51D ENY at -5? :D
dont be giving torquila any ideas now..but still +1
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The best perk farmers in game have the best eny/value ratio. Everyone knows which are the best perk farming rides.
Taking this idea further... the M-jug is just as fast as the D-pony (even better at alt), has more guns and ammo, turns much better, also has a very long range yet its eny8... sometimes i just cant get it.
Btw Titan, the g6 should be eny20 like a spit9??? wow
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Taking this idea further... the M-jug is just as fast as the D-pony (even better at alt), has more guns and ammo, turns much better, also has a very long range yet its eny8... sometimes i just cant get it.
The Mjug has no ords, which is part of the ENY determination as well, see 110. ENY is not only about air to air combat perk gain, but also a balancing tool via ENY limiter. Pyro had stated back when the M was introduced, that if they had given it the ability to carry ords, the ENY would have been lower.
BTW... when I put ENY and factual K/D into relation, the actually (in contrast to theoretically) most effective perk farmers seems to be the entire 109 line (well, minus the E-4)...
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The best perk farmers in game have the best eny/value ratio. Everyone knows which are the best perk farming rides.
Taking this idea further... the M-jug is just as fast as the D-pony (even better at alt), has more guns and ammo, turns much better, also has a very long range yet its eny8... sometimes i just cant get it.
Btw Titan, the g6 should be eny20 like a spit9??? wow
I don't know Deb..G6 isnt a crap plane (you know that better than anyone), so I don't know why its ENY is so close to the P39 and P40s. 20.0 just feels right. Reduce the Spit9 to 15.0?
Here's how I think of ENY values
40.0 - EW planes only
30 - Midwar planes
20 - MW and LW planes that can contend with lower ENY planes
10 - LW planes that are good but not excellent fighters
5 - top of the tippity top, flown right, it will outfly everything.
Now this is a very large generalization but you get the idea. Now I know the G6 is a MW plane, but it can compete with some LW planes and outflies almost everything in MW. Hence, why I don't think it should be 30 but 20 instead.
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My own take on the 109 line would be
E4 40
F4 30
G2 25
G6 25
G14 20
K4 15
But in the end, that would hardly have any significant impact on usage, much less on gameplay balance. With differences that small, and at these ENY regions, effects are more theoretically than practical.
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Where would you put the Mosquito Mk VI in your perk farming hierarchy?
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Where would you put the Mosquito Mk VI in your perk farming hierarchy?
Clearly in the better half of it. But then it's just a very rough estimate by multiplying actual arena K/D with ENY to get a P(erk)E(effectiveness) value. For comparison, Spit 16 had a PE of 6, the Mossie 6 one of 27 and the 109s between 29 (F4) and 36 (G6)
What really is the 'best' perk farmer for each individual player can vary alot from this, as it also depends a lot on fighting style, skill level and familiarity.
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One issue I had was the P-47D40 vs. the 15ENY F6F. At 20 ENY the -40 has more speed, more ords, more guns, more bullets, better views, better roll, better toughness and better endurance. Dive is comparable and climb goes to the jug at light weights and higher alts. The F6F gives you better turn and CV capability. Advantage D-40.
- I don't think that ENY should be based strictly on performance, it should factor in ord, and versatility; with that factored in the 15ENY Hellcat (and alot of other ENY choices) appears reasonable.
- Agree the 109 family is excellent for perk/value ratio. Not sure how much ENY factors into usage but it seems the 109 needs to be a high ENY ride to get any kind of real MA representation. I'd definitely put the G2 and G6 at 25 ENY if not lower.
- The 51D is simply the best overall non-perked multi-role fighter in the game. I'd like to see less 51s in general. A 2-3 perky cost would allow alot of guys to fly the Pony indefinitely. That said, to adjust ENY simply because there's "too many of them" probably isn't a good enough argument. Oh well.
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Sure it will. I see the ENY limited at 2 and 3 pretty frequently. It just doesn't hit 5 very often.
more like talking about eny to get perks. I dont really care if I get perks/points or not in this game. I have more than enough to last me for another 10 years and I really dont use them. I fly the ponyd because i like to have fun with it. nothing like out turning a plane that shouldn't be out turned but the other guy just got a bit too confident :).
semp
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more like talking about eny to get perks. I dont really care if I get perks/points or not in this game. I have more than enough to last me for another 10 years and I really dont use them. I fly the ponyd because i like to have fun with it. nothing like out turning a plane that shouldn't be out turned but the other guy just got a bit too confident :).
semp
:lol
please :rolleyes:
P 51's are for those that want to run away and "stay alive" which it does very well..... :rofl....even the numbers show the game is clearly in over abundance with.
all my time here I have seen maybe 3 guys that actually fight in the 51 semp you aint one of them.
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:lol
please :rolleyes:
P 51's are for those that want to run away and "stay alive" which it does very well..... :rofl....even the numbers show the game is clearly in over abundance with.
all my time here I have seen maybe 3 guys that actually fight in the 51 semp you aint one of them.
funny if I wanted to "stay alive" I wouldnt die as often as I do. as for running away I can say the same for the p47, fw190, 262's and about a good portion of the plane set.
semp
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more like talking about eny to get perks. I dont really care if I get perks/points or not in this game. I have more than enough to last me for another 10 years and I really dont use them. I fly the ponyd because i like to have fun with it. nothing like out turning a plane that shouldn't be out turned but the other guy just got a bit too confident :).
semp
Changing the ENY on something like the P-51D, Spitfire Mk XVI or La-7 isn't intended as a "You'll earn less perks" measure. Nobody with any brains flies any of those to earn perks. It is a "ENY limiting will impact you more often and force you either out of that ride or to change sides" measure.
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Do away with the ENY. 1 point for a kill, 1/2 point for an assist regardless of the plane/vehicle. Make perked rides the same cost for everyone regardless of country or population. After all... no country IRL grounded their best birds because the enemy was out-numbered or out-classed. Just my 2 cents worth.
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Do away with the ENY. 1 point for a kill, 1/2 point for an assist regardless of the plane/vehicle. Make perked rides the same cost for everyone regardless of country or population. After all... no country IRL grounded their best birds because the enemy was out-numbered or out-classed. Just my 2 cents worth.
This is a game and not a war. ENY was introduced for good reasons, because the community refused to police itself and then because rewards for being on the outnumbered side failed to affect side balance. ENY needs to be more aggressively applied if anything.
As to the 1 point for a kill in anything of anything, that doesn't at all reflect the challenge of the kill. You'd reward an La-7 for the easy kill of an I-16 the same as you'd reward the I-16 for the hard kill of an La-7. That would remove a lot of the incentive to use anything other than the best fighters.
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This is a game and not a war. ENY was introduced for good reasons, because the community refused to police itself and then because rewards for being on the outnumbered side failed to affect side balance. ENY needs to be more aggressively applied if anything.
As to the 1 point for a kill in anything of anything, that doesn't at all reflect the challenge of the kill. You'd reward an La-7 for the easy kill of an I-16 the same as you'd reward the I-16 for the hard kill of an La-7. That would remove a lot of the incentive to use anything other than the best fighters.
^^QFT.^^ Variety is the spice of AH. The ENY system is a fabulous concept, just could use some more aggressive scaling IMHO.
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funny if I wanted to "stay alive" I wouldnt die as often as I do. as for running away I can say the same for the p47, fw190, 262's and about a good portion of the plane set.
semp
I would say why that is, but it is against the rules. :aok
anytime you feel froggie.... you can show me how awesome the 51 is. :rofl
like I said maybe 3 guys really fly the 51 that actually fight in it..... EVERYONE else flies it because it is one of the best runners/Pick planes in game.....
I am revering to the "Fighters" like pand (who is anything but a fighter) :rolleyes: not the ground war, I pay no attention to that...
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This is a game and not a war. ENY was introduced for good reasons, because the community refused to police itself and then because rewards for being on the outnumbered side failed to affect side balance. ENY needs to be more aggressively applied if anything.
As to the 1 point for a kill in anything of anything, that doesn't at all reflect the challenge of the kill. You'd reward an La-7 for the easy kill of an I-16 the same as you'd reward the I-16 for the hard kill of an La-7. That would remove a lot of the incentive to use anything other than the best fighters.
Challenge of the kill??? LOL! Acording to a lot of players, the HO is the most used manuever and is done by people with no skill. Besides that, I don't pay $15 a month to "police" myself OR be "policed". It's a game.... and ENY sucks.
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It's a game....
And games have rules to make them work. ENY is such a rule. And you can be glad AH is already very light on the 'rules' side.
I for one would complain about a much steeper ENY scaling...
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Challenge of the kill??? LOL! Acording to a lot of players, the HO is the most used manuever and is done by people with no skill. Besides that, I don't pay $15 a month to "police" myself OR be "policed". It's a game.... and ENY sucks.
Yes, a lot of people say the HO is the most common, and it may be the most common, but it is not more common than all the others combined by any means.
An above average guy in the La-7 vs an above average guy in the I-16, the fight is harder for the I-16 and killing the La-7 is more of a challenge. To claim otherwise would be silly. If you take out any recognition of that you remove much of the incentive to fly the I-16 when the La-7 is better for K/D and K/T/
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Yes, a lot of people say the HO is the most common, and it may be the most common, but it is not more common than all the others combined by any means.
An above average guy in the La-7 vs an above average guy in the I-16, the fight is harder for the I-16 and killing the La-7 is more of a challenge. To claim otherwise would be silly. If you take out any recognition of that you remove much of the incentive to fly the I-16 when the La-7 is better for K/D and K/T/
True. But this would be a 1V1 situation and probably best fought in the DA. In the MA. it's a whole different game. ENY sucks.
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True. But this would be a 1V1 situation and probably best fought in the DA. In the MA. it's a whole different game. ENY sucks.
Instead of trying to get rid of ENY in the Main Arena, why not fly Furball Lake in the DA yourself? No ENY there and nothing but uber planes for the most part.
In other words, Poof! - wish granted. :)
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I would say why that is, but it is against the rules. :aok
anytime you feel froggie.... you can show me how awesome the 51 is. :rofl
like I said maybe 3 guys really fly the 51 that actually fight in it..... EVERYONE else flies it because it is one of the best runners/Pick planes in game.....
I am revering to the "Fighters" like pand (who is anything but a fighter) :rolleyes: not the ground war, I pay no attention to that...
easy for you to say that when you are 10k above everybody else. of course you call that "fighting the horde" but when everybody else does it then they pick. sweetheart you pick and horde just like everybody else but your ego wont let you admit it.
semp
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Instead of trying to get rid of ENY in the Main Arena, why not fly Furball Lake in the DA yourself? No ENY there and nothing but uber planes for the most part.
In other words, Poof! - wish granted. :)
Sorry Bro. I thought you also were looking for a change in the ENY. You want to see it changed/modified and I do too. You want the numbers rearranged and I would like to see them reduced to 0. Kinda like screwin' a goat... 1 inch or 4 inches, you're still screwin' a goat.
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True. But this would be a 1V1 situation and probably best fought in the DA. In the MA. it's a whole different game. ENY sucks.
Twelve I-16s vs twelve La-7s would be an even steeper challenge for the I-16s, so no, this is not a 1v1 thing only.
Based on your posts it seems ENY regularly impacts you so I am guessing that you use things like the P-51D, La-7 and Spitfire Mk XVI. It is easy to sit there using those and say the guy in the P-40C, I-16 or Spitfire Mk I shouldn't get any more reward and claim that the performance differences don't really matter outside of a 1v1 when you are the guy in the low ENY fighter.
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Twelve I-16s vs twelve La-7s would be an even steeper challenge for the I-16s, so no, this is not a 1v1 thing only.
Based on your posts it seems ENY regularly impacts you so I am guessing that you use things like the P-51D, La-7 and Spitfire Mk XVI. It is easy to sit there using those and say the guy in the P-40C, I-16 or Spitfire Mk I shouldn't get any more reward and claim that the performance differences don't really matter outside of a 1v1 when you are the guy in the low ENY fighter.
Check my stats. I just feel ENY does little for the majority of people. Like the red and blue MAs, it needs to go away. This is just my opinion. You don't have to like it.
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easy for you to say that when you are 10k above everybody else. of course you call that "fighting the horde" but when everybody else does it then they pick. sweetheart you pick and horde just like everybody else but your ego wont let you admit it.
semp
LOL!! I think about the only time you'll find INK 10k over anyone is if he went AFK and forgot to come back!
Sorry Bro. I thought you also were looking for a change in the ENY. You want to see it changed/modified and I do too. You want the numbers rearranged and I would like to see them reduced to 0. Kinda like screwin' a goat... 1 inch or 4 inches, you're still screwin' a goat.
You don't seem to fly hotrods, why does ENY bother you?
If ENY was removed the team with the bigger horde would still have the hotrods to fly. I don't see a problem with trying to hobble them a bit by forcing them into more challenging rides. I'd be happier if it was even more pronounced. The people are forced into inferior rides the more they learn the better the game is for everyone.
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LOL!! I think about the only time you'll find INK 10k over anyone is if he went AFK and forgot to come back!
You don't seem to fly hotrods, why does ENY bother you?
If ENY was removed the team with the bigger horde would still have the hotrods to fly. I don't see a problem with trying to hobble them a bit by forcing them into more challenging rides. I'd be happier if it was even more pronounced. The people are forced into inferior rides the more they learn the better the game is for everyone.
Hi Fugi! Just saying... let everyone ride what they wish. Why force someone to play by another's ideas of what fair is. The current ENY is kinda outta whack so just try no ENY for 3 months. I bet nobody would complain then. Especially like the dual MA setup we had for awhile. :x
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:lol
please :rolleyes:
P 51's are for those that want to run away and "stay alive" which it does very well..... :rofl....even the numbers show the game is clearly in over abundance with.
all my time here I have seen maybe 3 guys that actually fight in the 51 semp you aint one of them.
Im not one of those three who are the best but I damn sure will turn the pony. Just like anyother plane I fly.
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Hi Fugi! Just saying... let everyone ride what they wish. Why force someone to play by another's ideas of what fair is. The current ENY is kinda outta whack so just try no ENY for 3 months. I bet nobody would complain then. Especially like the dual MA setup we had for awhile. :x
Because no controls over population imbalance was causing a serious problem to the game. I am not sure if your forum registration date of 2007 represents your subscription date, but take it from somebody who was there that massive population imbalances were a serious and detrimental problem. HTC could see significant numbers of people logging off as the balance got worse and made the game nearly unplayable for the outnumbered side.
They first tried to get the community to fix itself by using the carrot of greater perk rewards for kills obtained while on the outnumbered side, but that had essentially no effect. Only then did they introduce the punitive ENY restrictions to take away popular aircraft from the side that is too large in population and that did help.
As to the better kill rewards for making a kill in an I-16 compared with an La-7, what does that matter? The La-7 guy can still fly whatever he wants and the I-16 guy gets a bonus for flying a harder airplane.
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Hi Fugi! Just saying... let everyone ride what they wish. Why force someone to play by another's ideas of what fair is. The current ENY is kinda outta whack so just try no ENY for 3 months. I bet nobody would complain then. Especially like the dual MA setup we had for awhile. :x
I understand why these things are needed. I've see so much "crap" in this game that if these restrictions were not in this game would have been dead and buried many years ago. everyone likes to win and so nobody likes to lose. If ENY wasn't in place you would see one team end up with the majority of players crushing the other two teams as players would seek the team that "always wins" and with out the ENY restriction just run over the others. This would lead to people either quiting in frustration, or joining the winning team until there was only one team in essence and then they would quit because they were bored.
ENY ups the challenge when your team has better numbers, thats it. As for adjusting the numbers..... who knows whats best. HTC has a secret formula they use and it is locked away in the same type of safe the Colonel's recipe is in. Does it need adjusting? To me, I'd like to see it kick in harder, but that would kill those players in the Euro time zones due to their lower numbers. Maybe an adjustment like they made for the 2 arena system were they closed down the arenas and opened a single for that time. Tie a timer into the ENY percentage numbers so that once the numbers pick up it kicks in faster.
I fly the pony a lot. It's a plane that I like, and I like turning in it to surprise opponents. If ENY stops me from flying it, no big deal, I switch to another planes. HTC went through a lot of trouble to make a crap load of planes, I feel I should use as many as I can. :P Then again I'm not stuck in a mold where I need the crutch of a certain plane. I think players should be forced out of their "comfort zones" as much as possible. When things become "easy" they also become "boring" if you can challenge your self by stepping out of your comfort zones then maybe the game should force you just for its own good health. Bored players leave, challenged and interested players don't.
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I fly the P-51-D a lot to pork ords because it can run fast and most times I am alone. I am mission oriented and there for the ords not to pad your dog fight score. The 51 fits the bill for that. I would fly it even if it was perked some. As for the 109K-4 and its usage. Seams like every third plane I see in the air is a K-4 and was surprised to see the usage chart as low as it was. I still think the K models ENY is too high and should be around 15.
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Sorry Bro. I thought you also were looking for a change in the ENY. You want to see it changed/modified and I do too. You want the numbers rearranged and I would like to see them reduced to 0. Kinda like screwin' a goat... 1 inch or 4 inches, you're still screwin' a goat.
You want to eliminate ENY, while I want it to actually work as it's (seemingly) designed. Currently, ENY doesn't affect your plane choice until your country has a massive numbers advantage. It seems that up until that magic threshold, there is no ENY limitation whatsoever. I think the threshold should be moved downward to when one country has 125% of the numbers of another, ENY kicks in at 5 and goes up from there. Of course, this change needs the ability to switch sides restored to actually work. High numbers force high ENY/players switch sides to fly their high end rides/sides now balanced (more or less)/ta-da!
If you get your wish and ENY were eliminated, there would be almost nothing but the best planes - all the time. No ENY means 1 perk for every kill, whether it is a Spit I or Spit XVI. Most people (whether they admit it or not) do care about these things and will have no game incentive to branch out to other planes. This would kill variety in the air to the extent that it would be all 51s/Tempests/C-Hogs/SpitXVIs/262s all the time. It would be Furball Lake redux, with base taking thrown in. HTC could just remove most of the plane set from the hangar at that point.
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I want to fly in the MA with nuthin but tempies. It will be like a giant furball lake. Yeah.
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I understand all that. But since I've been playing (from Nov 2000 to now), the numbers really never reflect actual players in the air. How many times has your ENY rose and upon checking the clipboard you find only 38% are "In Flight". Until idle players (the ones sitting in the tower while they BBQ and other such things) can be controled, do away with the ENY. It sure wouldn't hurt to try it at least once.
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I understand all that. But since I've been playing (from Nov 2000 to now), the numbers really never reflect actual players in the air. How many times has your ENY rose and upon checking the clipboard you find only 38% are "In Flight". Until idle players (the ones sitting in the tower while they BBQ and other such things) can be controled, do away with the ENY. It sure wouldn't hurt to try it at least once.
Statistically, that affects all sides equally. There may be spikes now and then, most often due to a mission about to launch I'd guess, but overall it should be a fairly even effect.
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LOL!! I think about the only time you'll find INK 10k over anyone is if he went AFK and forgot to come back!
you are wrong on this one fugitive. he's a great player, one of the best in my opinion, have seen him take on 4 v 1 and kill all of us. I dont doubt his skill at all. but he does like to go above everybody else. it isnt about skill or manhood or anything like that. we all pick given the chance. and we all run but the more skill you have the more you call it "extending". and I am not accusing ink of anything.
there isnt one guy that plays aces high that hasnt picked, ho'd, rammed, run, you name it. and if you think of anybody who hasnt, remember the old joke. 90% of all men admit playing with themselves the other 10% lie about it.
semp
semp
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K4 = K/D 1.48 and usage 2.81%
I'm surprised that the K4 usage is only 2.81%
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I'm surprised that the K4 usage is only 2.81%
That's rank #12 out of 66 fighters in Late War, just between the P-38L and the Ki-84. Upper middle class in terms of popularity, so to speak ;)
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That's rank #12 out of 66 fighters in Late War, just between the P-38L and the Ki-84. Upper middle class in terms of popularity, so to speak ;)
Thanks for the info sir. :cheers:
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Wait... here's the overview of Usage alone:
(http://img839.imageshack.us/img839/5659/clipboard02ci.jpg)
But keep in mind it's including all kind of kills and deaths. For air-to-air kills & deaths alone the chart should look a bit different. But then, air to air combat has an ever declining importance in this game ;)
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My list:
109G2 - 25.0
109G6 - 20.0
109G14 - 15.0
109K4 - 10.0
Bf110G2 - 20.0
F6F-5 - 20.0
Ki-84 - 15.0
Fw-190D - 10.0
Mosquito - 25.0
Yak-T - 30.0
Sorry, but as long as the k-4 only has 65 rounds & relatively light use 20 is appropriate. Mossie 20 is good.
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K4 should be around 15 imo.
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Im not one of those three who are the best but I damn sure will turn the pony. Just like anyother plane I fly.
I know :D
you are wrong on this one fugitive. he's a great player, one of the best in my opinion, have seen him take on 4 v 1 and kill all of us. I dont doubt his skill at all. but he does like to go above everybody else. it isnt about skill or manhood or anything like that. we all pick given the chance. and we all run but the more skill you have the more you call it "extending". and I am not accusing ink of anything.
there isnt one guy that plays aces high that hasnt picked, ho'd, rammed, run, you name it. and if you think of anybody who hasnt, remember the old joke. 90% of all men admit playing with themselves the other 10% lie about it.
semp
semp
I appreciate your words but
you are wrong...... I have NEVER run from a fight no matter the odds.....NEVER.....in the 7 years I have been here I have never run from anyone or any amount of numbers...... NOT ONE TIME :aok
hell man I remember getting pissed at some friendlies that jumped in on my 3vs1 I was having....
if I am out of ammo ya I will leave and that's generally the only time I will leave....even if there is blood ever where I have stayed and fought...not always but I have...those are the only 2 reasons I try to RTB well that and low fuel, although even then I have stayed and fought till I ran out of fuel....or died from blood loss.
so no not everyone runs, there is not ONE person who can say they saw me run.....well they can say it all they want, but they are lying through their teeth.... guaranteed they wont be able to come up with proof.
as far as the other things you mentioned...yup I have HOed usually its getting sick of avoiding some tard in a BnZ plane extending away 4 K just to come back and pick me, damn right I will give him a face full...fighting a crap load of nme I will also take the shots that present themselves....Zero's and 262's I also HO
ramming well durr its a dogfight it happens
Vulching.....in 7 years maybe 10 times....
yes I do get some ALT now a days(certainly not 10K above :rolleyes:) because of huge gangs of tards yet there is always someone higher then me :lol......I don't mind fighting 4-5 guys but damn when I am already fighting that many and 4+ more jump in it gets quite pathetic.
and no I don't gang.... have I killed nme with friendlies around yup.... but you will never see me jump on a nme con that is already fighting a couple, if they are running from numbers and try to attack me.... ya I will turn my guns on them, they should have left me alone and worried about the guys behind them.
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Sorry, but as long as the k-4 only has 65 rounds & relatively light use 20 is appropriate. Mossie 20 is good.
Why should the much less used, much less capable Mosquito VI have the same ENY as the Bf109K-4? That seems like you have a bit of an agenda there.
It is possible that 20 is the appropriate marker for the Mosquito Mk VI, but if it is then 20 is not the correct marker for the Bf109K-4.
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Sorry, but as long as the k-4 only has 65 rounds & relatively light use 20 is appropriate. Mossie 20 is good.
You only need one or two rounds max for a kill with the tater. Light use? I see them all the time, not as much as the P51, but it's up there (as shown by the charts). It's fast, it climbs like a monster, and it's a one hit kill wonder (most of the time anyways :noid). Hell, I love the frigging thing, but even I think 20 ENY is a bit too much. Show me a 20 ENY plane that can compete with it. I bet you you won't. P38J maybe, Ki-84 maybe. Though with those two planes, it's more of a case of pilot skill than the plane itself.
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Just a reminder: ENY is not only about the air-to-air capability... ;)
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Just a reminder: ENY is not only about the air-to-air capability... ;)
No, it isn't and the Bf109K-4 is bad at it.
That said, the Mosquito Mk VI isn't all that hot at it either or it would get a lot more use. Time to target is better in the Mossie VI than it is in the P-51D, particularly if there is any climbing involved, but its loadout just doesn't do as much damage.
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I have always wondered why all configurations of a plane have the same ENY. Why would the P51D with the 4 gun package and no ords have the same ENY has one fully loaded? If the ENY changed with the configuration of the plane, it would provide more options than just eliminating a plane completely. For example, maybe the P51D looses the 1000 lb bomb with a ENY of 1, 500 lb bomb at 5, etc, etc. Those number are just for illustration.
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I have always wondered why all configurations of a plane have the same ENY. Why would the P51D with the 4 gun package and no ords have the same ENY has one fully loaded? If the ENY changed with the configuration of the plane, it would provide more options than just eliminating a plane completely. For example, maybe the P51D looses the 1000 lb bomb with a ENY of 1, 500 lb bomb at 5, etc, etc. Those number are just for illustration.
HTC once stated they were planning a perk system based on loadouts/configurations... but that was many years ago. Heaven and HT know why it didn't happen yet :headscratch:
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eny is fine. .. if anything, it would be nice to see it strengthened and made more dynamic. But really, if you want perks, fly a 205, if you don't care, then fly the 51s and Doras an go to 20k and run after 2 pass' - your 15 bucks to suck.
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You only need one or two rounds max for a kill with the tater. Light use? I see them all the time, not as much as the P51, but it's up there (as shown by the charts). It's fast, it climbs like a monster, and it's a one hit kill wonder (most of the time anyways :noid). Hell, I love the frigging thing, but even I think 20 ENY is a bit too much. Show me a 20 ENY plane that can compete with it. I bet you you won't. P38J maybe, Ki-84 maybe. Though with those two planes, it's more of a case of pilot skill than the plane itself.
KI84 is too much for the K4 even with a great K4 stick..... :aok
Ki84 is in the top 3 fighters ingame.
P38 is not in that list, not even close.
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KI84 is too much for the K4 even with a great K4 stick..... :aok
Ki84 is in the top 3 fighters ingame.
P38 is not in that list, not even close.
shhhhhhh :bolt:
in all honesty, other then a few miles per hour in top speed, the spit 16 is stronger - but the KI is lighter and can power up a climb better (spit seems to lose e faster). It is super fragile, prone to pilot wounds, and does not take man handling well at all. And it has that awful front view. But yah, it is one of the top 3 along with a Corsair (U4 is the best prop plane hands down) and the Spits.
If the opponent does not want to tangle though, the K4 can power away pretty easily - of all the late war speed monsters, the K4 has the most leeway to engage an 84, twist and turn and play the vert game, and if the jig is up, hit wep and blast away. No other plane other then the LA7 can do that. I suppose the point is - a KI really can't press an advantage against a careful pilot while a K4 can run basically anything down. That is huge.
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shhhhhhh :bolt:
in all honesty, other then a few miles per hour in top speed, the spit 16 is stronger - but the KI is lighter and can power up a climb better (spit seems to lose e faster). It is super fragile, prone to pilot wounds, and does not take man handling well at all. And it has that awful front view. But yah, it is one of the top 3 along with a Corsair (U4 is the best prop plane hands down) and the Spits.
If the opponent does not want to tangle though, the K4 can power away pretty easily - of all the late war speed monsters, the K4 has the most leeway to engage an 84, twist and turn and play the vert game, and if the jig is up, hit wep and blast away. No other plane other then the LA7 can do that. I suppose the point is - a KI really can't press an advantage against a careful pilot while a K4 can run basically anything down. That is huge.
I agree for the most part.....Ki84.... I would take over the U4 any day..... :D
believe it or not I think the Hurri2C is also in the top fighters, the only reason I stopped flying that is its too easy to get away from, at least the Ki has a better top end and climbs like a banshee...but for straight up fighting the Hurri2c is one of the deadliest planes in game.
if we ever get the 4 20mm KI.... I will never fly anything else.....and boy will the gang tards hate me even more then they already do :t
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It is super fragile, prone to pilot wounds, and does not take man handling well at all. And it has that awful front view.
It's far from super fragile. The 84 will take quite a beating.
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It's far from super fragile. The 84 will take quite a beating.
I saw that he said that.... but was thinking he was talking about the 16....had to have been...like you say the KI is an extremely tough bird...even now a days after flying it as much as I have, I am surprised at how much she can Take.
she is anything but fragile.
I remember after killing 4 in a 5vs1 (the 5th ran away shot up,) I landed at my field and went into F3 view to check out the damage.... I had holes on every part of that plane..... missing more then a couple parts..blood everywhere....was quite impressed with my beautiful wonderful girl.
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Maybe he was talking about the Spixteen.
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In
Fail.
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Fail.
Someone said a bad word to his pony, huh? :lol
Btw Ink, the ki84 is excellent in your style: stay and knife fight. Awesome flaps, great roll rate at medium to very low speeds, excellent climb and aceleration up to 10k, good guns, decent ammo load, can take some beating, acceptable speed at low alts (spixes cant run away muhhaha : ) Also there arent red-white-green stripes on tis tail so some poor souls in turny aircraft wont try to escape like a rabbit... hehe A bit more than a year ago we had this aircraft for FSO with the KN, against F4Us and bombers... even tho if it wasnt a complete disaster, it was a fail compared to other FSOs, this plane was completely outclassed by the corsairs at 24-30k. The problem was the slow speed, the climb rate and the poor instanteous turn rate. As the frame developed and the skirmish moved to lower alts, we found some success.
My point is, its a great aircraft and is competitive with anything under 10k, but above that it isnt as powerful at all.
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Someone said a bad word to his pony, huh? :lol
Btw Ink, the ki84 is excellent in your style: stay and knife fight. Awesome flaps, great roll rate at medium to very low speeds, excellent climb and aceleration up to 10k, good guns, decent ammo load, can take some beating, acceptable speed at low alts (spixes cant run away muhhaha : ) Also there arent red-white-green stripes on tis tail so some poor souls in turny aircraft wont try to escape like a rabbit... hehe A bit more than a year ago we had this aircraft for FSO with the KN, against F4Us and bombers... even tho if it wasnt a complete, it was a fail compared to other FSOs, this plane was completely outclassed by the corsairs at 24-30k. The problem was the slow speed, the climb rate and the poor instanteous turn rate. As the frame developed and the skirmish moved to lower alts, we found some success.
My point is, its a great aircraft and is competitive with anything under 10k, but above that it isnt as powerful at all.
I forget to add..."at typical MA ALTS" I would say it is great up to 20K certainly above 10K
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KI84 is too much for the K4 even with a great K4 stick..... :aok
Ki84 is in the top 3 fighters ingame.
P38 is not in that list, not even close.
And that's why said it's pilot skill more than anything in a K4 vs Ki84 matchup. I've killed my share of Ki84s in a K4 and you've killed your fair share of K4s in a Ki84. At 10K+, all the K4 has to do is point it nose up and the Ki84 is done for. Under 5K, the Ki84 *should* beat the K4.
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At 10K+, all the K4 has to do is point it nose up and the Ki84 is done for.
I disagree here. The ki has an awesome climbrate and it depeds on the E state both planes are given.
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KI84 is too much for the K4 even with a great K4 stick..... :aok
Ki84 is in the top 3 fighters ingame.
P38 is not in that list, not even close.
And that's why said it's pilot skill more than anything in a K4 vs Ki84 matchup. I've killed my share of Ki84s in a K4 and you've killed your fair share of K4s in a Ki84. At 10K+, all the K4 has to do is point it nose up and the Ki84 is done for. Under 5K, the Ki84 *should* beat the K4.
And I disagree, maybe it's because there are more P38s pilots and I keep running into them, but more often than not, I'll find myself with a 38 who knows what he's doing. It's no top 3, but I definitely think it's top 10.
1. F4U-4
2. Spit16
3. Ki-84
4. 109K4
5. Spit8
6. P38J
7. 109F4
8. La-7
9. F4U1A
10. N1K
That's my list anyways. In a 1 v 1 situation.
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I disagree here. The ki has an awesome climbrate and it depeds on the E state both planes are given.
According to the AH stats, K4 @ 10K is 4,500f/m, Ki84 is 3,000f/m.
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And that's why said it's pilot skill more than anything in a K4 vs Ki84 matchup. I've killed my share of Ki84s in a K4 and you've killed your fair share of K4s in a Ki84. At 10K+, all the K4 has to do is point it nose up and the Ki84 is done for. Under 5K, the Ki84 *should* beat the K4.
And I disagree, maybe it's because there are more P38s pilots and I keep running into them, but more often than not, I'll find myself with a 38 who knows what he's doing. It's no top 3, but I definitely think it's top 10.
1. F4U-4
2. Spit16
3. Ki-84
4. 109K4
5. Spit8
6. P38J
7. 109F4
8. La-7
9. F4U1A
10. N1K
That's my list anyways. In a 1 v 1 situation.
it always comes down to pilot skill in any match up....a noob is not gonna be able to kill a vet fighter no matter what planes they are in...I am talking 1vs1... equal E at the start of the fight.
a noob killing a vet fighting 3 or more guys is not really him beating the vet.
I am talking a Vet that actually fights.... not the guys that have been around for years that land 8-9 kills in their 51's and 190's that are ganging every sortie or vulching.....and think they are good....they could be here 10 years and a guy that has been here a year that actually has fought for that year will whip the guy that has been here 10 years....in a equal 1vs1 fight.
what it says on paper means squat.....
if you are dieing to the 38 in 1vs1 then you need to learn how to fight. :aok
even with the very best in the 38 they are easy to kill 1vs1
oh....at typical MA ALTS :D
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:) who said I died in a fight with a 38? I said they'd know what they're doing.
As for pilot skill being the deciding factor in a matchup, I disagree. I'm pretty sure even a 2 week noob knows how to run when they're in trouble. Pick any 5.0 ENY plane and put it against a P40C or Spit1. Even when the vet gets on the noob's 6, the noob will just run, rinse and repeat until the vet gets hit by a bullet. That's not pilot skill winning, that's the plane winning.
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:) who said I died in a fight with a 38? I said they'd know what they're doing.
As for pilot skill being the deciding factor in a matchup, I disagree. I'm pretty sure even a 2 week noob knows how to run when they're in trouble. Pick any 5.0 ENY plane and put it against a P40C or Spit1. Even when the vet gets on the noob's 6, the noob will just run, rinse and repeat until the vet gets hit by a bullet. That's not pilot skill winning, that's the plane winning.
:bhead
you completely missed what I am saying....could be I am not great with words.....
yes it always comes down to pilot skill.....the only time the plane is the deciding factor is when the pilots skill levels are very close to each other.
the further the skill level from each other the less the plane matters....
the closer the skill level of pilots the more the planes matter....
a noob FIGHTING a vet...will not win..... I don't care if he is in a LA7 and the vet in a a6m2 or spit 1....if the noob is actually trying to fight...running away is NOT fighting....
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As for pilot skill being the deciding factor in a matchup, I disagree. I'm pretty sure even a 2 week noob knows how to run when they're in trouble.
No, they do not always know, and that's why they are still noobs. They do not notice the trouble they are in in the first place, or if they do, they do not realize that slamming the throttle forward and nosing down could save them from that enemy plane on their six. A noob does turn where he should dash away, he will try to run away when he should turn.
Using the own plane's strengths to exploit the enemy's plane weaknesses (while taking the tactcial situation into account) does require a certain minimum skill level, even when this strength is the easiest one to apply: Speed.
Even late war monster rplanes are being shot down quite frequently by "lesser" rides...
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I am talking a Vet that actually fights.... not the guys that have been around for years that land 8-9 kills in their 51's and 190's that are ganging every sortie or vulching.....and think they are good....they could be here 10 years and a guy that has been here a year that actually has fought for that year will whip the guy that has been here 10 years....in a equal 1vs1 fight.
This is 90% of those who think they are a vet player, kind of funny most of these trash talkers are always in some 5 eny aircraft (or dora9). While there are a handful 10% that are good period, the real test is not learning to win every 1vs1 - because in the main arena it never is going to happen.
You need GOOD SA, better Aim - and some common knowledge of ACM, I could split my time between the DA and Main Arena, but problem with facing only ONE person is it comes down to only one or two moves, whoever has the fastest trigger wins - in the Main Arena you can't focus on one target or you get blown out of the sky.
I jokingly take up higher ENY aircraft, but there's a reason for it - they tend to attract higher attention and you really have to be on your game to survive. More then likely you will die, prime example is yesterday I was zipping around in a P-40C at 10k - Co-alt I managed to Zap a Dora9 and La7, then I ran into two P51's trying
to boom and zoom me for a good 10 minutes - I was lucky Nshida was around otherwise I'd been double teamed, I lost a good 6-7k trying to avoid them when a simple HurriC comes to kill me.
There is no special moves to get someone off your 6, either you keep em locked up and wait for a mistake, or you get killed - more then likely you won't win in this situation, but it does keep your SA higher, and without the blazing guns you need to have aim to score critical hits.
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aww pilot skill vs plane... they both count. Mathematically and simplifyed, (pilot skill)*(plane abilities)=(how dangerous the pilot-plane combo is)
The p38's climb rate isnt as awesome, i got a couple rope-a-dopey ones by retracting the flaps and using the Gustav's better climbing, even tho they jumped me with E. Also, while their turn rate is better than the 109G, the turn radius isnt. Make them scissor and they die. I got all the respect to the 38 pilots who are mixing it up instead of the usual BnZ/rope-a-dope method.
Also, "pointing the k4's nose up and they are done" is a low move in my dictionary. I preferred to try to beat the pilot even tho he was in a better turning aircraft, that gave me more fun and satistfaction, but thats just me.
Butcher, i can agree with those statements except one... there ARE some moves to remove someone from your six, even if he is in a better turning aircraft. ;)
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the further the skill level from each other the less the plane matters....
the closer the skill level of pilots the more the planes matter....
I always have a picture of a see saw in mind. The two player's 'weight' is their respective skill level, the length of the lever is the planes capability. When my lever arm is very short, I have to weigh much more than the player on the opposite side to 'win'...
Player A skill x plane capability vs Player B skill x plane capability.
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I am revering to the "Fighters" like pand (who is anything but a fighter) :rolleyes: not the ground war, I pay no attention to that...
Pand, who flies the P-51B over the P-51D the vast majority of the time?
You can throw your little tantrums over who runs (i.e., doesn't get suckered into the kind of fight you need them in to win) all you want, but slinging mud at Pand just because he's a more skilled pilot is beneath you.
You are all more than welcome to sit around and have your little prettied up Pony-D whine-n-jerk, but Pand is not only a damn good guy in real life he's poured hours of his own time into resources for the squad as well as the community. When it comes to flying in-game, he "runs" for the following reasons:
1. Pilot Wounded
2. RTB Fuel
3. RTB Ammo
4. Squad Responsibilities (i.e., he runs DD fighter wing, sometimes that takes precedence)
5. Squadmate in trouble - If, in a furball, any of the DD FS guys see/hear another one of us in trouble (and I know, because I usually am), they will disengage to help.
The Devil Dogs (and specifically the Fighter Squadron boys) adhere to a firm set of rules, not the least of which is that the majority of kills should be attained in either the P-51B or P51-D. This rule set includes attempting to get your equipment back to base in one piece. Pand has landed his Bravo with half a wing probably as many time as I have landed with both of them.
If you are implying that Pand is a one trick Pony (pun intention murky), feel free to check his FSO stats... I assure you he dominates in whatever he flies.
:salute
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I always have a picture of a see saw in mind. The two player's 'weight' is their respective skill level, the length of the lever is the planes capability. When my lever arm is very short, I have to weigh much more than the player on the opposite side to 'win'...
Player A skill x plane capability vs Player B skill x plane capability.
if you weigh a ton and your opposition weighs a pound it don't matter how long of a lever arm he has you will win 99.9% of the time.
good analogy BTW :aok
This is 90% of those who think they are a vet player, kind of funny most of these trash talkers are always in some 5 eny aircraft (or dora9). While there are a handful 10% that are good period, the real test is not learning to win every 1vs1 - because in the main arena it never is going to happen.
You need GOOD SA, better Aim - and some common knowledge of ACM, I could split my time between the DA and Main Arena, but problem with facing only ONE person is it comes down to only one or two moves, whoever has the fastest trigger wins - in the Main Arena you can't focus on one target or you get blown out of the sky.
I jokingly take up higher ENY aircraft, but there's a reason for it - they tend to attract higher attention and you really have to be on your game to survive. More then likely you will die, prime example is yesterday I was zipping around in a P-40C at 10k - Co-alt I managed to Zap a Dora9 and La7, then I ran into two P51's trying
to boom and zoom me for a good 10 minutes - I was lucky Nshida was around otherwise I'd been double teamed, I lost a good 6-7k trying to avoid them when a simple HurriC comes to kill me.
There is no special moves to get someone off your 6, either you keep em locked up and wait for a mistake, or you get killed - more then likely you won't win in this situation, but it does keep your SA higher, and without the blazing guns you need to have aim to score critical hits.
yup I would say 90% of the MA are just guys that don't really have that urge to be the best they can be and are ok with flying around in a gang and vulching and thinking they are good when they kill someone 4 vs1 or land 9 vulch/gang kills....or maybe they just want to have fun and attacking one con with 5 friends is fun for them :rofl :rofl :rofl
give me 20 minutes with them 1vs1 in a controlled DA fight ( I say 20 minutes to kick their butt over and over) they will quickly realize they are not so good. :D
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Pand, who flies the P-51B over the P-51D the vast majority of the time?
You can throw your little tantrums over who runs (i.e., doesn't get suckered into the kind of fight you need them in to win) all you want, but slinging mud at Pand just because he's a more skilled pilot is beneath you.
You are all more than welcome to sit around and have your little prettied up Pony-D whine-n-jerk, but Pand is not only a damn good guy in real life he's poured hours of his own time into resources for the squad as well as the community. When it comes to flying in-game, he "runs" for the following reasons:
1. Pilot Wounded
2. RTB Fuel
3. RTB Ammo
4. Squad Responsibilities (i.e., he runs DD fighter wing, sometimes that takes precedence)
5. Squadmate in trouble - If, in a furball, any of the DD FS guys see/hear another one of us in trouble (and I know, because I usually am), they will disengage to help.
The Devil Dogs (and specifically the Fighter Squadron boys) adhere to a firm set of rules, not the least of which is that the majority of kills should be attained in either the P-51B or P51-D. This rule set includes attempting to get your equipment back to base in one piece. Pand has landed his Bravo with half a wing probably as many time as I have landed with both of them.
If you are implying that Pand is a one trick Pony (pun intention murky), feel free to check his FSO stats... I assure you he dominates in whatever he flies.
:salute
:rofl
I don't care how "cool" of a guy he is in the real world, I don't know him.... I can only judge him from what I see ingame, and from what I see he is the exact opposite of me...he runs at the first sign of losing advantage and comes back to pick when the guy he was just fighting is engaged with others....whatever.... however..... he wants to play is up to him, but I call it the way I see it and don't care about who's feelings I hurt.
I will be more then happy to take him to the DA and stomp a mud hole in his arse.... show him he is not a good fighter at all :aok
does that hurt your feelings???
to bad...truth hurt...... change your reality.
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Mr Tunnel-rat,
squad stuff is fun, but i wouldnt judge anyone based on their "squaddie-saving" skills.
I suggest to fight Ink in the DA. He prefers to stay and fight instead of running to pick. Even tho he isnt amongst the very best dogfighters, You will be surprised how quickly he will vax your butt. Both in 1v1 or 5v5.
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Mr Tunnel-rat,
squad stuff is fun, but i wouldnt judge anyone based on their "squaddie-saving" skills.
I suggest to fight Ink in the DA. He prefers to stay and fight instead of running to pick. Even tho he isnt amongst the very best dogfighters, You will be surprised how quickly he will vax your butt. Both in 1v1 or 5v5.
Give him my aim and he will wax just about 90% of the MA on first pass.
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Mr Tunnel-rat,
squad stuff is fun, but i wouldnt judge anyone based on their "squaddie-saving" skills.
I suggest to fight Ink in the DA. He prefers to stay and fight instead of running to pick. Even tho he isnt amongst the very best dogfighters, You will be surprised how quickly he will vax your butt. Both in 1v1 or 5v5.
I am an absolutely terrible fighter pilot... at my peak, 10 years ago, I was, on a good day, mediocre.
I am glad Jetsom is as good as he is, I just think it is both comical and sad that he would sit and denigrate someones person based upon his inability to take them down.
Just because you (Debrody) and Jetsom wouldn't judge anyone based on their "squaddie-saving" skills doesn't mean it isn't important to some. I come at this from a different perspective (being that I was in the Marines, you leave no one behind, etc). At the end of the day it IS just a game, but I am not going to remember how bad bellybutton you or any other ace gamer is/was. I will remember squad/countrymates who put the TEAM above the ME, and enemies who showed skill AND class. Pounding your chest about how awesome you are when outnumbered while crying about getting picked in the same breath is juvenile at best.
I am not about to apologize for Pand, who has been racking up both record kills and record hate for more than a decade in AH.
On the other hand, I am not going to just sit by while you "awesome fighter jocks" take a dump on someone because you simply can't take them in the MA. You can squawk about the DA all you want... my advice? Stay there. That will save you from being forced to cry about your inability to take down a P-51B in your Ki-84.
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It isnt about "a" p51b against "a" ki84. Its "5" p51bs against "a" ki84. Or "a" 109. Whatever.
Anyway, there are some folks i/we (Ink and me) do respect and some i dont. Pand isnt one one of the respected ones and im sure he doesnt respect me either. I wont paste my opinion here about the "we got numbers, we pwnz" skills, if you think its awesome, let it be. As for the number of the gotten kills... honestly i can piss on it. Someone can win when he holds all the cards but runs like the wind when he doesnt...
After all, the best way to cut this pointless lamentation is a squad duel, with your terms. Ink can prove himself if needed... can you?
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It isnt about "a" p51b against "a" ki84. Its "5" p51bs against "a" ki84. Or "a" 109. Whatever.
No, actually, it's a thread about ENY. A guy who almost always flies a 15 ENY plane specifically called out a guy who almost always flies a 20 ENY plane, by name. I simply pointed out the absurdity.
RARRRGH! SQUAD DUEL!!!
As I said before, I am not a fighter pilot. If you want to fight a squad duel, I would just bring your boys into the MA... you can find the DD's together any night. You can even shoot down my JU-88 and/or Ki-67 and then post about it!
It'll be a scream, see you there.
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See Rule #4
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Its pilot over plane every time IMO.
Fly Japanese planes , to slow to be called a runner and it will force you to fight, sometimes against numbers you can't live against.
I will agree with INK on one point, in my years of playing this game I have run into maybe only 6-8 fights with a P51 that I would actually call a fight. Most of the time a pony pilot is a one pass haul arse type. Or they call it "E" fighting. Which for a pony driver means , "if they ain't got "E" then they ain't fighting".
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So anyways, back to this ENY argument:
I'd like to see less useage of the PonyD. Not because they are gang-raping us, but because I am tried of seeing nothing but PonyD missions: CV sinking, base taking, fighter sweeping, etc, etc.
Drop its ENY down to 2 at the very least
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Pand, who flies the P-51B over the P-51D the vast majority of the time?
, he "runs" for the following reasons:
1. Pilot Wounded
2. RTB Fuel
3. RTB Ammo
4. Squad Responsibilities (i.e., he runs DD fighter wing, sometimes that takes precedence)
5. Squadmate in trouble - If, in a furball, any of the DD FS guys see/hear another one of us in trouble (and I know, because I usually am), they will disengage to help.
If you are implying that Pand is a one trick Pony
Not that long ago, he was all alone, once I climbed up to co-E with him; he kept running from my G2. The fight went like this for him;
Engage, get reversed, take a ping or three, run, repeat.
Even in the equal aircraft type he has ran from me, The nose goes down and to the nearest DD.
Actually he has 3 tricks. We can all name them without much thought; dogpile the con, pick the con, run from the con to other DDs.
By shackling his squadmates to such a restrictive doctrine he is stunting the skillset of his squad skill as a whole.
They have absolutely no individual flair and are easily killed once isolated from their group, exactly like vTards.
They are not even very good in their current BnZ state.
Picking to save a squaddie is all well and good, but has anyone of you looked back and thought why you needed to be saved in the first place?
I flew like a DD in a pony at alt and gained 10 kills in 2 sorties without the aid of any squadmates. :o
Stayandfightstang http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FsVXFpE7-s0&feature=plcp
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See Rule #4
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Amazing.
I think we are done here.
:rofl
typical
I already know I am amazing.....wife tells me every time she screams out Gods name.....but thanx for reminding me :aok
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I won't lie. I run from fights at times, but I don't do so only to re-engage the guy who was chasing me once he is busy. If it is not a ridiculous situation I'll fight.
Last time I recall running was in a Mossie VI from an F6F, but as soon as I had enough distance to turn and engage him without just handing him my six I did and as he we were both alone there was no ganging at all. I lost, but it was a fun fight.
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:rofl
typical
I already know I am amazing.....wife tells me every time she screams out Gods name.....but thanx for reminding me :aok
Regardless of the myriad opportunities you've left open for me to engage in the breaking of Rule #4, I have chosen to abstain.
I do not believe this behavior to be typical.
:salute
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It might be me, but I can't remember the last time I went to take a plane and ENY limit kept me out of it. So ENY to me only effects PERKS. I have 7,000 fighter perks because I fly perk planes on extremely rare occasions. So I guess it's kindof irrelevant to me. :salute
To Lusches' data, and the Pony thing. I've never had trouble killing a Pony in anything I've flown if the Pony tried to fight me. If they run they get away.
So the Noobs needs something to be safe in until they learn the ropes. I have no problem with the Pony population.
I have a bigger problem with verteran pilots, flying in packs, in single ENY digit planes. :rolleyes:
Perhaps what we need is PILOT ENY. As your Rank goes up, so does the ENY score of planes you can fly.
That would actually serve the balance, fairness, handicapping problem a lot better than applying ENY based on numbers of pilots per team.
Oh I can hear the whining just typing that. :D
In all seriousness, my thoughts are only for the noobs who get discouraged. I'd like to see more players in the game. As for vets and what people fly. I all for freedom. :salute
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Vinkman the problem with that idea is veteran pilots who don't care for GV'ing or Bombing - will always have a very high rank.
Only one who will hurt from it are the pizza faces who believe rank means anything period, score tards will be screaming left and right.
Then again those are the ones who fly a Tempest and pick from 20k, so it doesn't hurt the furballers at all, except we would get access to a 262 any time :D
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I won't lie. I run from fights at times, but I don't do so only to re-engage the guy who was chasing me once he is busy. If it is not a ridiculous situation I'll fight.
Last time I recall running was in a Mossie VI from an F6F, but as soon as I had enough distance to turn and engage him without just handing him my six I did and as he we were both alone there was no ganging at all. I lost, but it was a fun fight.
I do the exact same thing haha... if I break contact, I will return immediately once the danger has passed - with an utter disregard for the soundness of my strategy.... :rolleyes:
It's simply attempting to choose the terms of the engagement... I have plenty of respect for those who "run"... I simply don't have the self-discipline... it's berserker rage, yank, spray, die. It's going to take me some time to get back into the swing of things.
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Vinkman the problem with that idea is veteran pilots who don't care for GV'ing or Bombing - will always have a very high rank.
Only one who will hurt from it are the pizza faces who believe rank means anything period, score tards will be screaming left and right.
Then again those are the ones who fly a Tempest and pick from 20k, so it doesn't hurt the furballers at all, except we would get access to a 262 any time :D
I don't want to see people be restricted from flying what they they want.
BUT... :D....Rank is a funny thing because it is NOT ENY corrected. So if player H---i flies 95% of his sorties in Tempest and racks up impressive stats, he wins over player D-----m who had a vertually identical score but did it a P-38J.
It would be interesting to see what would happen to ranks, if such a thing were implemented. :headscratch:
Would rank have a significant meaning in such a system?
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It might be me, but I can't remember the last time I went to take a plane and ENY limit kept me out of it. So ENY to me only effects PERKS. I have 7,000 fighter perks because I fly perk planes on extremely rare occasions. So I guess it's kindof irrelevant to me. :salute
To Lusches' data, and the Pony thing. I've never had trouble killing a Pony in anything I've flown if the Pony tried to fight me. If they run they get away.
So the Noobs needs something to be safe in until they learn the ropes. I have no problem with the Pony population.
I have a bigger problem with verteran pilots, flying in packs, in single ENY digit planes. :rolleyes:
Perhaps what we need is PILOT ENY. As your Rank goes up, so does the ENY score of planes you can fly.
That would actually serve the balance, fairness, handicapping problem a lot better than applying ENY based on numbers of pilots per team.
Oh I can hear the whining just typing that. :D
In all seriousness, my thoughts are only for the noobs who get discouraged. I'd like to see more players in the game. As for vets and what people fly. I all for freedom. :salute
there is no way to quantify the skill of a player...rank does NOT reflect skill in anyway shape or form.....
I can only think of a couple people who were as good as the rank they had....most of the highest ranking guys(by highest I mean lowest :D) are not very good fighters and would just die to anyone that actually fights.
the best way to change the ENY for the better would be a zone type ENY and take into account how many are in the air and not just on the side.
like you I cant remember the last time I had a problem flying my plane due to ENY....doesn't effect me at all.
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I don't want to see people be restricted from flying what they they want.
BUT... :D....Rank is a funny thing because it is NOT ENY corrected. So if player H---i flies 95% of his sorties in Tempest and racks up impressive stats, he wins over player D-----m who had a vertually identical score but did it a P-38J.
It would be interesting to see what would happen to ranks, if such a thing were implemented. :headscratch:
Would rank have a significant meaning in such a system?
Not entirely, one tour I flew a P38J and C.205 and ranked #1 in fighters vs 4 people that were all in tempest's and perk planes, reason I won is because of sorties flown and kill points - if they'd bother to get into actual fights and not worry about dying, they probably would of beaten me.
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Vinky,
just a spark of an idea... been thinking on a system where you have an "eny bank", the average eny of the planes you fly should remain above a number, lets say, 12. If you want to fly 262s and tempests, you have to do some sorties in a lesser eny ride. It would filter out the score tards for sure while still giving them the ability to bust the 50 plane missions in jets when its needed. Also would give a meaning to the less popular rides.
In the other hand, it would limit your plane choice what is against the freedom, but heck, we got a really awesome 12 hours rule too, so where is the freedom, damn it.
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Not entirely, one tour I flew a P38J and C.205 and ranked #1 in fighters vs 4 people that were all in tempest's and perk planes, reason I won is because of sorties flown and kill points - if they'd bother to get into actual fights and not worry about dying, they probably would of beaten me.
you are right Butcher I think Rank is more about how you play, then what you fly or how "skilled a dog fighter" you are.
And before I restricted access to planes for high ranking pilots, I'd like to see the Scoring system adjusted per ENY.
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Vinky,
just a spark of an idea... been thinking on a system where you have an "eny bank", the average eny of the planes you fly should remain above a number, lets say, 12. If you want to fly 262s and tempests, you have to do some sorties in a lesser eny ride. It would filter out the score tards for sure while still giving them the ability to bust the 50 plane missions in jets when its needed. Also would give a meaning to the less popular rides.
In the other hand, it would limit your plane choice what is against the freedom, but heck, we got a really awesome 12 hours rule too, so where is the freedom, damn it.
I think the perk system does that. It's very hard to earn Perks in a perk plane. to fly a 262, you have to kill a bunch of people in a plane with 20 or higher ENY score. I think mathimatically, it works out exactly what you said. :salute
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People pay $15 to do whatever they want to do, if you want to sit in a pony all tour then so be it - I don't care unless someone shoots their mouth off when in fact they run from any given fight if they have a disadvantage.
It's one thing to run while in a P40C to regain some alt, or get away from a horde, but doing it in a P51D is totally unacceptable to me.
Why? One prefers a fight, the other runs, then again people are spending $15 and not learning anything, just watch the countless dora's and 51s try to ho and run.
I can't say I could train anyone any better, I do try to give my best advice and help others learn, but frankly I see VERY few that actually go in the training arena and get any help, probably because they feel more comfortable sitting at 15k and boom and zooming.
I think there is a rational fear of dying which is the main problem, not sure why - I went through the same gig when I first started playing - then you slowly realize its boring... in my case I simply got tired of not fighting - I tried doing the DA, problem is its not comparable to the MA.
I wish one day someone would say "Hey! Can you show me some tips in the C.205 or such?"
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Come to think of it, I would replace Hit% in the Ranking system with PERK EARNED.
Hit% is big descriminator, but seems a bit useless as a descriminator. If you a better shot thatn everyone else, the other stats will simply go up accordingly. In that way it's redundant. But PERK EARNED would be a measure of how many of the those points, and kill ratio, etc...were earned in lesser palnes than the people you shot down.
Hmmm I like that. Over to the Wish list....
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People pay $15 to do whatever they want to do, if you want to sit in a pony all tour then so be it - I don't care unless someone shoots their mouth off when in fact they run from any given fight if they have a disadvantage.
It's one thing to run while in a P40C to regain some alt, or get away from a horde, but doing it in a P51D is totally unacceptable to me.
Why? One prefers a fight, the other runs, then again people are spending $15 and not learning anything, just watch the countless dora's and 51s try to ho and run.
I can't say I could train anyone any better, I do try to give my best advice and help others learn, but frankly I see VERY few that actually go in the training arena and get any help, probably because they feel more comfortable sitting at 15k and boom and zooming.
I think there is a rational fear of dying which is the main problem, not sure why - I went through the same gig when I first started playing - then you slowly realize its boring... in my case I simply got tired of not fighting - I tried doing the DA, problem is its not comparable to the MA.
I wish one day someone would say "Hey! Can you show me some tips in the C.205 or such?"
never did that here...from day one I attacked the biggest red dar I could find.....funny the guy that let me play on his system for the first time...says to me while I am fighting...."you cant do that"
it was all about saddling someone....now I go more for angles and utilize my E to the fullest possible...
as far as the 205 goes....
all ACM is the same, does not matter what plane you are in, minor differences in what can be done...or WHEN something should be done....timing is I feel one of the most important factors second only to AIM and equal to SA...
the same maneuvers you do in a 190/spit you do in a 205 it truly is just when and where they are done that is different.
drain the wing tanks in the 205 first....rolls better.
all this talk of flying makes me wanna up my KI :rofl
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you were a marine...haha you people who bring real life into a GAME make me laugh my arse off...when you get called out for lame game play you come up with any excuse to make yourself feel better....leave no one behind...you are pathetic...you are a disgrace to the core....Marines are supposedly about Honor you dishonor all who have died when you act like this game is the real world and must save your buddy :rolleyes:
how honorable is it to attack 1 guy with 6 or more????? please explain that to me mr marine....
you say he is a better fighter then I...I say he wouldn't win one real fight against me without the help of all his friends...hell we don't need to go to the DA we can do it right in the MA...call off his squadron of helpers and put up or shut up...
he wont last 3 minutes....show me some HONOR mr "marine".... step up to the plate....get some frog legs and leap....
or be a typical wannabe and just hide behind your delusional thoughts :aok
I truly can't believe what some people post here. The total lack of respect for a veteran, and using this as a negative is embarrassing to our community. Obviously the moderators are too busy to police this thread, so I offer up an option.
1. Print out this thread, and read it to your children tonight for their bedtime story. Be sure and highlight "daddy's" responses.
Or for a less dramatic effect, just think about the following questions:
1. Is this a thread you would be proud to show your children?
2. Is this the example you wish to set for them on how they should handle themselves?
While I'm confident of the continued sarcastic responses, everyone should try to remember their age, and just because we're shielded by the internet doesn't mean we should act like a teenager with no care for anyone but ourselves.
If everyone brought a little real-life respect into this game, I feel it would better for everyone.
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all this talk of flying makes me wanna up my KI :rofl
Thanks to your skin, Ki-84 has been my main ride ever since, I just gotta stop taking 100% fuel, although it does fly wonders if you burn off wing tanks first - gives amazing loiter time looking for bomb****s or run51s.
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I wish one day someone would say "Hey! Can you show me some tips in the C.205 or such?"
Even tho i could list like 20 people who could kill me 10/10 in the g6, some asked me for 109 tips. Some of them are known, respected pilots, i wont throw out names here. By the time i come back, they will be fluffin badarse beasts in any plane, im telling you... not couse of my advice, im not good and and even worse as a teacher... couse of the willing they showed towards the improving. Guess how it felt seeing them getting better on each flight.
Btw Vinky, thats a good idea and it might worth a posting on the wishlist.
Pand: take your chill pills "in", you call Ink yet you seem to be agressive.
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Pand: take your chill pills "in", you call Ink yet you seem to be agressive.
Nope, just disappointed.
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I truly can't believe what some people post here. The total lack of respect for a veteran, and using this as a negative is embarrassing to our community. Obviously the moderators are too busy to police this thread, so I offer up an option.
1. Print out this thread, and read it to your children tonight for their bedtime story. Be sure and highlight "daddy's" responses.
Or for a less dramatic effect, just think about the following questions:
1. Is this a thread you would be proud to show your children?
2. Is this the example you wish to set for them on how they should handle themselves?
While I'm confident of the continued sarcastic responses, everyone should try to remember their age, and just because we're shielded by the internet doesn't mean we should act like a teenager with no care for anyone but ourselves.
If everyone brought a little real-life respect into this game, I feel it would better for everyone.
:rofl
maybe you should look in the mirror :aok
I teach my kids first and foremost TRUTH second RESPECT and thirdly HONOR
if you take offense at what I said....when I did not insult you as a person but spoke the straight up truth about your lame game play....YOU are the one with the issues.
because you or he is a "vet" you should be respected even though you show NO respect or HONOR what so ever...please....
he talks about being a marine and having those values of "leaving no one behind" in a GAME when your GAME play is anything but Honorable. that to me is pathetic and dishonors those that died as as Veterans...and is as bogus a reason for cheap game play there is
I asked him...I will ask you...where is the HONOR/RESPECT in attacking one con with your whole squad...please explain that to me....
so ya now that you are here I hereby challenge YOU to the DA/MA in a 1vs1 fight your plane against my plane best of ten.....personally I don't think you will win one....actually I don't even think you will take me up on the offer because you have NO CLUE what HONOR/RESPECT is and are far too worried about your cartoon life to actually fight....without your squad backing you up.
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Thanks to your skin, Ki-84 has been my main ride ever since, I just gotta stop taking 100% fuel, although it does fly wonders if you burn off wing tanks first - gives amazing loiter time looking for bomb****s or run51s.
thank ya man..take 50% and drops leave the drops on for anything like 190..p51's P47's ECT ECT..(unless they show aptitude) .get rid of them for anything else, she will still give ya plenty of time to fly around loitering :D
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ink,
How did you decide to pick up the Ki-84? The usual progression from somebody liking a Hurricane, but wanting more speed would be a Spitfire of some kind. The Ki-84 is relatively obscure.
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ink,
How did you decide to pick up the Ki-84? The usual progression from somebody liking a Hurricane, but wanting more speed would be a Spitfire of some kind. The Ki-84 is relatively obscure.
I actually started with the zero and moved to the N1k then the hurri from there, while trying all the planes in the Hanger, but the Hurri was great for fighting a couple guys, due to its punching power and being a bit tougher then the zero's and turning ability close to the zero's (with my horrible aim those 4 20's was a huge help)...I flew the Hurri for 4 years and got well over 7000 kills in it all while flying solo against the hoard (for the most part) but I always got pissed when they ran so wanted something a bit faster,
by this time I had tried every fighter in the hanger, flew the LA7 for a bit and the spits but they are a bit too easy and I honestly felt like I was cheating.... they were to easy to fly...I remember one of the first times in the KI I was fighting a 38 (don't remember who) he tried to take it in a zoom climb and the KI stayed with him all the way up...I don't think he realized I was already at 400+ I caught him and blasted him out of the sky......something the Hurri would not have been able to do...I like how fast the cannons fire...I love how it has viscous reversals (had a nme tell me that about my KI :D) it really does have insane reversal ability a snap stall reversal that has pissed off many a spit drivers.... and just enough speed to keep it competitive to chase someone down long enough to get a couple of those fast firing 20's into them...been a love affair ever since.....if we ever get the 4 20mm ohhhh I wont ever fly anything else :pray :pray :pray
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If you think spits are cheating ink than you must think the hurri2 is aswell lol. Other than its speed comeon :D
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La-7 eats lighting and craps thunder.
Better watch for them La's they awsome planes.
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the speed is a huge factor... its way to slow to be really dangerous....and very easy to avoid.... keeping up SA that is....and spotting a bad situation ahead of time....the cannons are what makes the Hurri dangerous its turning is good but not the best.... its climb sux its speed sux....
It still comes down to how it is flown..... yes it is easy but not like the spits or LA....although like most planes in the hands of someone who really knows it, and who is great at ACM....it really is extremely dangerous more so then most...
the big difference between the hurri and the spits.... is the spits are good/better then average at everything....they are extremely forgiving planes.
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:rofl
maybe you should look in the mirror :aok
I teach my kids first and foremost TRUTH second RESPECT and thirdly HONOR
if you take offense at what I said....when I did not insult you as a person but spoke the straight up truth about your lame game play....YOU are the one with the issues.
because you or he is a "vet" you should be respected even though you show NO respect or HONOR what so ever...please....
he talks about being a marine and having those values of "leaving no one behind" in a GAME when your GAME play is anything but Honorable. that to me is pathetic and dishonors those that died as as Veterans...and is as bogus a reason for cheap game play there is
I asked him...I will ask you...where is the HONOR/RESPECT in attacking one con with your whole squad...please explain that to me....
so ya now that you are here I hereby challenge YOU to the DA/MA in a 1vs1 fight your plane against my plane best of ten.....personally I don't think you will win one....actually I don't even think you will take me up on the offer because you have NO CLUE what HONOR/RESPECT is and are far too worried about your cartoon life to actually fight....without your squad backing you up.
I wish you would re-read your mr. marine post.
We already did a 1v1 back in LWTour147 (apparently we met twice, but I don't recall the other).
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/newscores/killsinm.php?playername=Pand&selectTour=LWTour147&kindex=78&pindex=45
I remember it very clearly as you did not act RESPECTfully or HONORably after the fight was resolved.
1. I came in at 12,000ft, about 6,000ft above you, west of furball island.
2. You were in an KI-84, I was in a P-51B. I utilized my energy and was forced to burn off most of it to get down to a slow enough speed to maneuver for a shot, without letting you overtake my energy advantage.
3. Took me way longer than it should have, 6 or 7 passes, because you are a skilled pilot in your 84.
4. Piece by piece, pass after pass, with my 4x50's, I was eventually able to nibble a wing off to complete the engagement. I'm sure it was just luck, or maybe a bit of discipline, that I didn't pull *too* hard and bleed enough energy to give you the edge you needed to land a cannon round and blow me up.
We have two different fighting styles:
1. I fly fast and utilize my aircraft to it's advantage. I enjoy the challenge of landing enough of my 4x50's into a guy to execute enough damage necessary to take a critical piece of his airframe. I fly with a team, a group of people I now call my friends, and we have fun fighting and working together. It gets to be real fun when we have another squad in the same area doing the same to us :) We also work and plan base captures, fly FSO's, scenarios, fighter sweeps, etc, all in good fun, and we try to simulate as much realism as possible.
2. You fly in the turn, lone wolf style, and utilize your aircraft and weaponry to it's advantage. As many people as you can bait to come in and turn fight with you, you're going to school them on what a Ki-84 is capable of, kill them and be ready for the next sucker. Congratulations, you are a skilled dog fighter with the 1v1 in mind, and that aircraft can maintain a low and slow fighting style, engagement after engagement.
I'm not going to put on a show for the masses, and I am not going to continue this back and forth; however, I will keep my eyes open for a ki-84 on the deck spinning circles around my fellow countrymen. I will say we might run into each other more often if you were up around 15K--- but then again that's unlikely since you'll have a 50mph disadvantage vs my Bravo up there.
I'm not the best dogfighter in a P-51B (for fightin) or P-51D (for bombin) and will never claim to be. I do feel that I utilize each aircraft well for what it was designed to do. Have to try to lead by example.
I am surprised that no one is piping in about my countless engagements I've had low and slow on the deck, winning some and losing some, as if I am nothing but a 20K pony that never comes down. A little disheartening, but as such, so is life.
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I still think its one of the easiest planes to fly. Im not taking credit away from you flying it. Just saying its not all that difficult to fly..
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So... you came with 6k advantage in a much faster ride that can dive at 550mph and you won? Even proud you havent even tryed to give him a fight? Congrats. Whatever you call your pi... ehm flying style, it wont change our opinion about you. My 2 cents.
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Vinky,
just a spark of an idea... been thinking on a system where you have an "eny bank", the average eny of the planes you fly should remain above a number, lets say, 12. If you want to fly 262s and tempests, you have to do some sorties in a lesser eny ride
It's already in the game, as it's virtually impossible to fly 262's without regularly going back to higher ENY rides. Next to nobody is able to sustain 262 flights without a bigger bank of perks. At an average perk bonus one would need an average K/D of 600 to be able to sustain jet operations on the perks earned by the jet alone. For a Tempest, you'd still have to get a theoretical average K/D of 150. Of course you could try to optimize that by flying at times with high perk bonus and targeting low eny fighters, but you can push it only so far.
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So... you came with 6k advantage in a much faster ride that can dive at 550mph and you won? Even proud you havent even tryed to give him a fight? Congrats. Whatever you call your pi... ehm flying style, it wont change our opinion about you. My 2 cents.
Do you realize just how idiotic statements like this are? "you havent even tryed to give him a fight"... should he have made an appointment? Chopped his throttle to give his enemy an advantage?
You keep spewing this garbage, and it's impossible to take seriously.
20 ENY LW plane vs 20 ENY MW plane. 20 ENY LW plane lost. Crying ensued.
End of story.
(EDIT: Site says Ki-84 is 15 ENY... this is apparently not the case, and should be changed as in-game the plane is 20 ENY)
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In 1 year I fly nothing above 20+ eny rides and massed 10,000 fighter perks.
If I didn't quit the game so many times I Probably would of had over 40,000 fighter perks I would guess over the years, thus being said - I rarely hop in Perk Planes, and its generally a drunken state because I will lose 2-3 262s screwin around.
I think with the amount of perks we have, certain planes like Spit 16 and P51 should be perked, why? if I can mass this many perks - what else do I have to spend it on? F4u4? 262?
Its not entirely hard to drum up some perks, fly a few low eny rides and you can afford luxuries.
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It's already in the game, as it's virtually impossible to fly 262's without regularly going back to higher ENY rides. Next to nobody is able to sustain 262 flights without a bigger bank of perks. At an average perk bonus one would need an average K/D of 600 to be able to sustain jet operations on the perks earned by the jet alone. For a Tempest, you'd still have to get a theoretical average K/D of 150. Of course you could try to optimize that by flying at times with high perk bonus and targeting low eny fighters, but you can push it only so far.
And THIS is why 262s are as deadly as they are.... 262 addicts hone their skills saving up their perks flying the higher ENY planes. I can tell in about 10 seconds whether or not the 262 saddling up on my bomber is for real or not. Unfortunately, most ARE... :eek:
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Snail,
i brought up that idea couse if an aircraft is perked, you would like to avoid the hot situations becouse if you get killed, you lose the perks. In the system i sketched, the average eny would be based on the sorties flown, ergo upping a high end aircraft would take your quota anyway, dogfighting (and eventually dieing) in them wouldnt make you lose what you lost already by upping it.
Thats why its better than the "put a perk price of 1-2 to the pony", it isnt encouraging the cowardice.
And over this, the oroginal perk system could still remain, couse the usage of the 262s and temps should be very heavily limited imo.
Btw Mr Tunnelrat, chill plz i wasnt calling you names. Never said BnZing should be forbidden, it just gives me more satisfaction when i play my opponents game (for example turn a 109g with a spit) and still win.
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In 1 year I fly nothing above 20+ eny rides and massed 10,000 fighter perks.
If I didn't quit the game so many times I Probably would of had over 40,000 fighter perks I would guess over the years, thus being said - I rarely hop in Perk Planes, and its generally a drunken state because I will lose 2-3 262s screwin around.
I think with the amount of perks we have, certain planes like Spit 16 and P51 should be perked, why? if I can mass this many perks - what else do I have to spend it on? F4u4? 262?
Its not entirely hard to drum up some perks, fly a few low eny rides and you can afford luxuries.
I am waaaaay too newb to make a suggestion of this nature without the caveat that YES, I KNOW I AM A NEWB AND THIS IS PROBABLY STUPID, but:
I think any plane sub-10 ENY (and maybe higher than that) should be 1 perk minimum. Yes, even the P-51D. I dunno, something about having some skin in the game makes things more exciting to me.
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Do you realize just how idiotic statements like this are? "you havent even tryed to give him a fight"... should he have made an appointment? Chopped his throttle to give his enemy an advantage?
You keep spewing this garbage, and it's impossible to take seriously.
15 ENY LW plane vs 20 ENY MW plane. 15 ENY LW plane lost. Crying ensued.
End of story.
No disrespect intended but at MA altitudes, 51B is little different from the 51D in the role being described here. It's not that much of a hindrance going from a D to a B.
Wiley.
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Snail,
i brought up that idea couse if an aircraft is perked, you would like to avoid the hot situations becouse if you get killed, you lose the perks. In the system i sketched, the average eny would be based on the sorties flown, ergo upping a high end aircraft would take your quota anyway, dogfighting (and eventually dieing) in them wouldnt make you lose what you lost already by upping it.
Thats why its better than the "put a perk price of 1-2 to the pony", it isnt encouraging the cowardice.
Debrody, are you saying that... say a plane is 10 perks, you simply lose those perks when you up it? I.e., may as well go for broke? Or am I reading that wrong? Because that is definitely an interesting idea.
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My 2 cents.
Keep the change, thanks! :rofl
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No disrespect intended but at MA altitudes, 51B is little different from the 51D in the role being described here. It's not that much of a hindrance going from a D to a B.
Wiley.
I agree to a loose extent... you lose 1/3rd of your firepower, you can rip wings in high speed maneuvers quite easily... the Ki-84 is plenty fast, and packs far, far more firepower, but the 51B is still a good plane.
The point is, no matter what happens, unless Pand decides to walk into a fight like an idiot - giving up all his advantages, and playing into his enemies advantages - it'll never be good enough... and the bleating will continue.
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So who fights is an idiot. Thank you for sharing us your absolutely intelligent opinion. I will keep it in mind when i try to subscribe a combat game next time.
:salute
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No disrespect intended but at MA altitudes, 51B is little different from the 51D in the role being described here. It's not that much of a hindrance going from a D to a B.
Wiley.
I prefer the B as it turns a little tighter and I get much more performance out of it at altitude. The big hinderance is the 4x50s, I will often have to land multiple snapshots for a kill while those cannon birds only need one.
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I see his point if I come into a fight with an advantage I am going to try and keep it. If it starts to take too long to kill him I will give it up to try and end it.
In the MA environment the longer the fight last the bigger chance you are going to get picked.
As for Pand I have never seen him low and slow, although I am sure it has happened.
I have seen him run off a couple of times.
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So who fights is an idiot. Thank you for sharing us your absolutely intelligent opinion. I will keep it in mind when i try to subscribe a combat game next time.
:salute
Good sirah,
I never called you (or anyone else) an idiot.
Are we having a language barrier issue here? <-- I am saying this with all sincerity, as we appear to be failing to understand each other.
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I prefer the B as it turns a little tighter and I get much more performance out of it at altitude. The big hinderance is the 4x50s, I will often have to land multiple snapshots for a kill while those cannon birds only need one.
That's about my (very limited) experience with it as well. In my experience 4x50 vs 6x50 doesn't make that much of a difference in a snapshot. 50s don't really meet my criteria for 'effective snapshots' unless you've got 8 of em or he happens to be at convergence. :)
Wiley.
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So who fights is an idiot. Thank you for sharing us your absolutely intelligent opinion. I will keep it in mind when i try to subscribe a combat game next time.
:salute
No, I believe what is being implied is that he who enters a fight at a disadvantage and loses is not evaluating the situation properly (assumuming your goal is to stay alive-- if you're there for a different purpose then all power to you).
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Yups, you got it.
My goal wasnt to stay alive. Just wanted a fight. The ones i respected the most, came down to me, gave me a fight instead of the BnZ, played my game and still won. I found their behaviour generous and honorable, also fun. I can list names if you want... Joachim, Spek, Krup, Tongs, Latrobe, RedBull, IrishOne, Greebo, Ink, Kazan, 8spade, Shemp, etc etc
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I'm sure we can all agree that a Ta152 "should" be flown in an "energy" style much like the ponies. The difference between "bore-n-zoom" someone to death and "fighting" is apparent in this film posted in the 190 thread. Moot "Fighting" in a Ta152 (http://www.gamefront.com/files/21788655/film23_tatersssssssssssssssssssssss_0705_ahf)
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Yups, you got it.
My goal wasnt to stay alive. Just wanted a fight. The ones i respected the most, came down to me, gave me a fight instead of the BnZ, played my game and still won. I can list names if you want.
Posting names is unnecessary. However, were they immediately picked by the next one or two guys that came along now that they were low and slow? Likely, at least that's my reward for winning a low and slow turnfight in my pony.
9 or 10 years ago, I used to fly different aircraft and go for the turn fighting glory, but kept getting picked by those pesky faster aircraft. Solution, become one of the pesky faster aircraft and have some amazing team dogfights against similar aircraft between 15-22K. Good fun! :aok
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That's about my (very limited) experience with it as well. In my experience 4x50 vs 6x50 doesn't make that much of a difference in a snapshot. 50s don't really meet my criteria for 'effective snapshots' unless you've got 8 of em or he happens to be at convergence. :)
Wiley.
That is the true key, and what makes it difficult. Make everything happen at convergence. I would say that my accuracy in the Bravo is very good, and I'm effective at utilizing the 4x50's. When we're doing a jabo run and I'm in the Delta (for the 2 1000lbers and rockets) fighting after an attack, to me the 6x50's feel like I'm shooting cannons. :joystick:
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yes I am talking out my arse
because your countless "engagements" are in your mind and not reality.... now if you talk about your countless gangs well then you may be speaking the truth.
I don't need to reread that post I know exactly what I wrote....your point is????? I should respect him because he is a vet????? talks about Honor and Respect when he has none????? pfft I give exactly what I get..... you deserve respect you get it from me...you act like a tard I call you out on it.....
exactly how did I "act" ???? I doubt I "cried" about dieing I don't often say anything to anyone when I die..although "good shot" or "nice one" is often sent forth to a good nme......lets see some screen shots of my crying.....or better yet a film on youtube :aok if you HOed there is a good chance I called ya a HO tard but even that is not often.....
I can post the one I have named "pandtard" of you running away while I am trying to catch you...but realizing your cowardly ways you wouldn't fight me and seeing about 9 other red guys BELOW me so I try engage them and THEN you want to come and fight....while I am fighting other red guys you pick me ....even then I didn't say anything to you.....
so I take it you wont step up and fight me..without all your friends around........figures.....
another couple wannabe lying tardly names to add to the tard list :aok
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<<standard fare>>
When I found out Debrody was a kid, it made a lot of sense.
You sir, are a conundrum.
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When I found out Debrody was a kid, it made a lot of sense.
You sir, are a conundrum.
sorry...but once you are placed on the tard list...I have nothing for ya.... I come to realize you are so low in intelligence I refuse have a convo due to hurting my brain.
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because your countless "engagements" are in your mind and not reality.... now if you talk about your countless gangs well then you may be speaking the truth.
I don't need to reread that post I know exactly what I wrote....your point is????? I should respect him because he is a vet????? talks about Honor and Respect when he has none????? pfft I give exactly what I get..... you deserve respect you get it from me...you act like a tard I call you out on it.....
exactly how did I "act" ???? I doubt I "cried" about dieing I don't often say anything to anyone when I die..although "good shot" or "nice one" is often sent forth to a good nme......lets see some screen shots of my crying.....or better yet a film on youtube :aok if you HOed there is a good chance I called ya a HO tard but even that is not often.....
I can post the one I have named "pandtard" of you running away while I am trying to catch you...but realizing your cowardly ways you wouldn't fight me and seeing about 9 other red guys BELOW me so I try engage them and THEN you want to come and fight....while I am fighting other red guys you pick me ....even then I didn't say anything to you.....
so I take it you wont step up and fight me..without all your friends around........figures.....
another couple wannabe lying tardly names to add to the tard list :aok
I truly hope that this is just your developed internet persona, and that your family/friends in your real-life do not have to appease this behavior. Good luck and good hunting. :salute
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I truly hope that this is just your developed internet persona, and that your family/friends in your real-life do not have to appease this behavior. Good luck and good hunting. :salute
Ink is a fantastic person, I would take his side over many others in this game.
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Ink wasnt calling out anyones family or friends.
Btw Mr Tunnelrat, its pretty weak trying to offend me by my age. Just saying very quietly, im far from being a kid (unfortunately). Im 21, spending money what i earned with work. Allright, thanks.
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When I found out Debrody was a kid, it made a lot of sense.
You sir, are a conundrum.
It's not that much of a conundrum, they just put a lot higher value on low alt stallfighting as how they define skill.
Different strokes and all that...
Wiley.
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Its all opinions. This argument shouldn't have happend.. Ink likes it low and slow. Pand likes to be fast and basically make it back to the base. Nothing wrong with either
stlye..
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Ink is a fantastic person, I would take his side over many others in this game.
:salute
I truly hope that this is just your developed internet persona, and that your family/friends in your real-life do not have to appease this behavior. Good luck and good hunting. :salute
yes I live my life by the Truth, sorry if that offends you....oh wait no I aint :aok
still waiting for the film on youtube of me "crying"
hell man name it INK Crying....back up your words.....I most certainly will a little screenie from the film....
(http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w246/fieldsofink/pandtard.jpg)
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Its all opinions. This argument shouldn't have happend.. Ink likes it low and slow. Pand likes to be fast and basically make it back to the base. Nothing wrong with either
stlye..
opps I am not low or slow in that pic :o
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LOL!! I think about the only time you'll find INK 10k over anyone is if he went AFK and forgot to come back!
(http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w246/fieldsofink/pandtard.jpg)
(http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRZYywMzhl49UXxMqHsIuRC29mHdayjM3aawromw27FBvr2nmz5nw)
:devil
:bolt:
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Ink is a fantastic person, I would take his side over many others in this game.
It's sad, then, that Ink already made how good a person one is a moot point...
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yes I live my life by the Truth, sorry if that offends you....oh wait no I aint :aok
still waiting for the film on youtube of me "crying"
hell man name it INK Crying....back up your words.....I most certainly will a little screenie from the film....
*Sigh*
As far as a youtube, I never said you 'cried', you just handled the situation similarly to how you've handled this thread. I also don't keep films of fights from many tours ago with intent to incriminate anyone.
Also, nice shot of the film, only one guy there is my squadmate and he's not even in a P-51. I fly more by myself then most think.
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opps I am not low or slow in that pic :o
Generally youll fight till your dead. Sometimes we all go up that high.
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Only because Pand asked...
Every time I've come across Pand it was getting shot in the tail feathers when I was fighting someone else. (sorry Pand, not a personal attack, just a testomony to your flying style) :salute
There is nothing wrong with E-fighting. Even in a Pony. :salute
as for the squad thing...
BUT Picking, is not e-fighting. Winging and "Team tactics" are excuses used by pickers to justify thier picking. I'll be clear in my support of Ink's position....
If you want to use team tactics, fine. Go find a team to use them against. Using them against single pilots, or a few un-coordinated noobs, is overkill. If you are there with your squad of ace pilots and one crummy Fw-190 tries to dog fight one of your P-51, for goodness sake don't all jump on the guy the minute he turns in. If the 190 wins the next hot shot can jump in and have turn. Your squaddie isn't really dead. It's a game. Show some restraint in the name of competition. If a furball develops, we all know anything goes, blah, blah.
I know for emmersion sake, it's sometime more realistic to put on your "save my buddy" hat. But war isn't fun. The more you bring real war thinking to this game, the less fun people are going to have. Imagine a football game where one side showed up with 4 guys and the other side came with 11. Would anyone think of playing 11 v 4? Who would participate in such a game? Would the side with 11 brag that they were smarter for bringing 11? How stupid would that argument be? A game thrives on sportsmanship, not on simulating the actual dispare of the lopsided conditions that we strive to create in a real war.
So show a little restraint in your picking, ganging, winging, and everyone will have more fun. :salute
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(http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRZYywMzhl49UXxMqHsIuRC29mHdayjM3aawromw27FBvr2nmz5nw)
:devil
:bolt:
:rofl
gotta climb up there now a days to even have a chance against the ganging tards, its not like I have grizz or Butcher aim....I was known for staying low for many years...I gave that up with the hurri :neener:
Generally youll fight till your dead. Sometimes we all go up that high.
:aok you know it.
very well said Vink
*Sigh*
As far as a youtube, I never said you 'cried', you just handled the situation similarly to how you've handled this thread. I also don't keep films of fights from many tours ago with intent to incriminate anyone.
Also, nice shot of the film, only one guy there is my squadmate and he's not even in a P-51. I fly more by myself then most think.
do I know that? they all red to me. and flying "alone" in a cloud of red is not quite "alone" now is it....notice I am ALONE
and then I :rofl :rofl :rofl
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:rofl
gotta climb up there now a days to even have a chance against the ganging tards, its not like I have grizz or Butcher aim....I was known for staying low for many years...I gave that up with the hurri :neener:
If you are getting up now, does that mean I have to come down? There is only so much room for us alt monkeys in aces high... :headscratch:
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If you are getting up now, does that mean I have to come down? There is only so much room for us alt monkeys in aces high... :headscratch:
:rofl
you always get me laughing
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Only because Pand asked...
Every time I've come across Pand it was getting shot in the tail feathers when I was fighting someone else. (sorry Pand, not a personal attack, just a testomony to your flying style) :salute
What do you normally fly? Most of my kills come from someone else trying to pick one of my squadmates that pursue them too long.
There is nothing wrong with E-fighting. Even in a Pony. :salute
as for the squad thing...
BUT Picking, is not e-fighting. Winging and "Team tactics" are excuses used by pickers to justify thier picking. I'll be clear in my support of Ink's position....
If you want to use team tactics, fine. Go find a team to use them against. Using them against single pilots, or a few un-coordinated noobs, is overkill. If you are there with your squad of ace pilots and one crummy Fw-190 tries to dog fight one of your P-51, for goodness sake don't all jump on the guy the minute he turns in. If the 190 wins the next hot shot can jump in and have turn. Your squaddie isn't really dead. It's a game. Show some restraint in the name of competition. If a furball develops, we all know anything goes, blah, blah.
This is all relative to what each individual considers fun. I don't agree with this... when flying as a flight of 4, we go up as a group, we come home as a group. What makes it fun is all 4 getting home, landing kills and me going, "wow I had 3 la7's inside 200 and I still made it out of there alive, thanks for clearing my six guys, those guys were sprayin and prayin!"
To the 190 part, we wouldn't sacrifice the E of a flight of 4 to engage one 190, but we would bail out our friend if he's getting chased. If we didn't then why have a squadron? Just let all your friends/countrymen die, never engage unless it is 1v1, and NEVER engage a target that is shooting at another friendly. We'd never have anything to fire at. Yes it's a game, and we try to simulate that it's not--- it's what makes it more fun for me and others.
Regarding finding a team to go up against... this is just not feasible. Should it be our responsibility to find 'teams' of people to play against? How would we even know if a group of 4 baddies shows up if they're flying together or just happen to be in the area together. We do occasionally run into a crew and it gets to be a lot of fun, but if you let your guard down, you're dead and I don't like dyin :)
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BUT Picking, is not e-fighting. Winging and "Team tactics" are excuses used by pickers to justify thier picking. I'll be clear in my support of Ink's position....
If you want to use team tactics, fine. Go find a team to use them against.
Some of us do. It's all those other guys with the red icons. I'm there to fight side vs side. Why is it up to me and my squad to disperse because the other side isn't coordinating? If the hapless 190 is the only thing for 4 sectors around, sure. Send in a guy to kill him. If he's at the front edge of a decent sized bardar, sorry he's to be put down ASAP so we can deal with the next threat.
By your football analogy, if someone on the defensive line gets by their blocker, is the rest of the team supposed to go, 'Yay for you! Have a free shot at the QB!'
If you are getting up now, does that mean I have to come down? There is only so much room for us alt monkeys in aces high... :headscratch:
There's PLENTY of room up high. It's got a long, long way to go before it's crowded above the clouds... ;)
Wiley.
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K4 = K/D 1.48 and usage 2.81%
Ironicly, a bit below and a hair behind the Dora.... :devil
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What do you normally fly? Most of my kills come from someone else trying to pick one of my squadmates that pursue them too long.
This is all relative to what each individual considers fun. I don't agree with this... when flying as a flight of 4, we go up as a group, we come home as a group. What makes it fun is all 4 getting home, landing kills and me going, "wow I had 3 la7's inside 200 and I still made it out of there alive, thanks for clearing my six guys, those guys were sprayin and prayin!"
To the 190 part, we wouldn't sacrifice the E of a flight of 4 to engage one 190, but we would bail out our friend if he's getting chased. If we didn't then why have a squadron? Just let all your friends/countrymen die, never engage unless it is 1v1, and NEVER engage a target that is shooting at another friendly. We'd never have anything to fire at. Yes it's a game, and we try to simulate that it's not--- it's what makes it more fun for me and others.
Regarding finding a team to go up against... this is just not feasible. Should it be our responsibility to find 'teams' of people to play against? How would we even know if a group of 4 baddies shows up if they're flying together or just happen to be in the area together. We do occasionally run into a crew and it gets to be a lot of fun, but if you let your guard down, you're dead and I don't like dyin :)
If you are showing restaint, great. If you are using your squad of 4 to fight large furball groups and win Fantastic! If you are winging to kill that pack of TopGun guys then I'll join your squad ;)Assessing the situation, and playing as "fair" as possible is all anyone really wants. Respect your squaddies...of course. Respect the bandit too, he's just a guy in his basement, looking for a small victory after a day of having his tailfeathers kicked by life. Not ganging him is giving him a fair chance to have a little success. :salute
If your not a ganger, picker, then my comments are miss-directed if they seem aimed at you :salute
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If you are showing restaint, great. If you are using your squad of 4 to fight large furball groups and win Fantastic! If you are winging to kill that pack of TopGun guys then I'll join your squad ;)Assessing the situation, and playing as "fair" as possible is all anyone really wants. Respect your squaddies...of course. Respect the bandit too, he's just a guy in his basement, looking for a small victory after a day of having his tailfeathers kicked by life. Not ganging him is giving him a fair chance to have a little success. :salute
I can agree with that. Most Gangbangs happen low on the deck, and 99% of the time you wont find me sacrificing my energy for someone already being tailed by the green gang. The other 1% its to save a squadmate because the green gang isn't getting it done. :salute
If your not a ganger, picker, then my comments are miss-directed if they seem aimed at you :salute
This gets into different definitions relative to the idea above.
Is this Ganging: If we're trying to take a base, and enemy la7's are upping and flying to town to kill troops, then I'm a ganger as I'm in to kill that plane ASAP in an effort to protect the troops and capture the base.
In a sense isn't everyone a picker? Hasn't everyone shot a bad guy that was tailing a friendly and not actively avoiding your fire?
Example: Friendly in trouble, dive in to save him, kill the guy who didn't see it coming (or maybe he did but refused to break off).
Enemies call this PICKING, Friendlies call this "Thanks!"
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If you are showing restaint, great. If you are using your squad of 4 to fight large furball groups and win Fantastic! If you are winging to kill that pack of TopGun guys then I'll join your squad ;)Assessing the situation, and playing as "fair" as possible is all anyone really wants. Respect your squaddies...of course. Respect the bandit too, he's just a guy in his basement, looking for a small victory after a day of having his tailfeathers kicked by life. Not ganging him is giving him a fair chance to have a little success. :salute
If your not a ganger, picker, then my comments are miss-directed if they seem aimed at you :salute
Oh sureeeeee bring Top Gun into this! *Drinks another beer
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I can agree with that. Most Gangbangs happen low on the deck, and 99% of the time you wont find me sacrificing my energy for someone already being tailed by the green gang. The other 1% its to save a squadmate because the green gang isn't getting it done. :salute
This gets into different definitions relative to the idea above.
Is this Ganging: If we're trying to take a base, and enemy la7's are upping and flying to town to kill troops, then I'm a ganger as I'm in to kill that plane ASAP in an effort to protect the troops and capture the base.
In a sense isn't everyone a picker? Hasn't everyone shot a bad guy that was tailing a friendly and not actively avoiding your fire?
Example: Friendly in trouble, dive in to save him, kill the guy who didn't see it coming (or maybe he did but refused to break off).
Enemies call this PICKING, Friendlies call this "Thanks!"
I call it interrupting my fight....feel free to NEVER dive down on a con or any amount of cons.....I am fighting...unlike you I dont need or want help fighting......
I just noticed your time line...here since 01...hmmm you would think after all this time you would have learned a thing or 2.....hell man I have only been flying since 04 off and on at that, never flew a combat sim before that...you should take me up on my offer and put a whopping on me and put me in my place :aok with all that experience you should be able to kill me easy 1vs1.......
why do I think that's not what would happen..why do I think you wont even get rounds near me????...seems like you also feel that way when you cant even rise to a challenge...that's the difference between someone who actually fights and does not depend on his "squadies" to fight for him.....sad man all this time and you are this timid....in a combat GAME :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
funny I read your posts and you are so full of crap it is coming out your mouth.
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I call it interrupting my fight....feel free to NEVER dive down on a con or any amount of cons.....I am fighting...unlike you I dont need or want help fighting......
I just noticed your time line...here since 01...hmmm you would think after all this time you would have learned a thing or 2.....hell man I have only been flying since 04 off and on at that, never flew a combat sim before that...you should take me up on my offer and put a whopping on me and put me in my place :aok with all that experience you should be able to kill me easy 1vs1.......
why do I think that's not what would happen..why do I think you wont even get rounds near me????...seems like you also feel that way when you cant even rise to a challenge...that's the difference between someone who actually fights and does not depend on his "squadies" to fight for him.....sad man all this time and you are this timid....in a combat GAME :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
funny I read your posts and you are so full of crap it is coming out your mouth.
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,333517.0.html (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,333517.0.html)
This thread is all you need to know what gets taught in the squad, pick pick BnZ.
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Yups, Butcher.
Some thinks that stuff is awesome and clap their hands. Whatever you say, however you prove its wrong, you will never be able to make them to change their minds.
My career wasnt too long in here yet i had a load of experience. Both good and bad. The worst was when many are gangraping you then bragging how awesome whey are, thats why i went ballistic in that thread. I apologize. In the other hand the best was when a better pilot could beat me in my own game using nothing but skill. You know that feeling, "woah, hows that possible? plz come, show it again in the DA". And usually "that was the beginning of a beautiful friendship".
:salute
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Friendly in trouble, dive in to save him, kill the guy who didn't see it coming (or maybe he did but refused to break off).
Enemies call this PICKING, Friendlies call this "Thanks!"
The other side of the coin and more often the case: Picker comes across 1v1 doesn't ask if the friendly needs help, swoops in and picks off the con in one of the usual uber rides and just heads off looking for next pick while thinking about the glory of having his name "landed 5 kills" and 2 seconds of message time for everyone to see.
Some players will hold off, ask if you need help and some like myself will even hold off if I see a 1v1 and unless the friendly asks for help I don't interfere. Nothing is gained by just picking off players other than respective attempt to pad your own score/stats.
Coming across the usual 3-5 cons chasing one friendly, different story generally because the guy is already calling for help before you get there.
Squads are bascially small hordes with better comms and generally play in the same style looking to see what they can overwhelm with numbers and get easy kills. Some squads I have a great raport with and enjoy going up against them for the challange, others I stay clear of as they show little or no respect and aren't worth the time.
There is far more to the game than just gunning for kills as easily as possible, once you reach that stage you'll enjoy ACM side of the game far more, and if you do that from high eny ride the rewards are even greater.
Of course some will cry back take it to DA rant rant rant, been there done that plenty. But at this point in time I might be in MA and a little respect goes a long way.
<S>...-Gixer
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Wait... here's the overview of Usage alone:
(http://img839.imageshack.us/img839/5659/clipboard02ci.jpg)
But keep in mind it's including all kind of kills and deaths. For air-to-air kills & deaths alone the chart should look a bit different. But then, air to air combat has an ever declining importance in this game ;)
That graph says it all. The proverbial "elephant in the room" that nobody seems to notice. Probably because everyone in the room is in a P-51. ;)
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That graph says it all. The proverbial "elephant in the room" that nobody seems to notice. Probably because everyone in the room is in a P-51. ;)
uhhhummmmm.....I mentioned it before many times maybe even in this thread :neener:
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,333517.0.html (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,333517.0.html)
This thread is all you need to know what gets taught in the squad, pick pick BnZ.
I saw that then and laughed then :rofl
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My post from a long time ago on how I see proper BnZ:
The way I use BnZ is like a club, I pound my opponent down and down and down. I force him to convert his altitude into E in order to dodge me, eventually he either tries to hang onto too much E or he runs out of "down" and I bleed him of the rest of his E and kill him. You can't do that if you are not aggressive as the target will rebuild its E while you p u s s yfoot around with silly "extending". Maintain your E advantage by not bleeding it out for low chance shots, but press the target and make him spend his E to dodge as you climb back above him only to drop back down like a hammer on his nail. Make him bleed it out like that and soon you are rewarded with a shot that is not a low chance shot as he gets desperate and does something reckless or simply runs out of the E needed to dodge effectively.
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My post from a long time ago on how I see proper BnZ:
excellent short write up.....had a typhy jump me recently, he had about 3 or 4 K at the start after his first pass he never went more the 2K above me I think even less then that and kept at it and killed me, I immediately sent him a <S> on a job well done.....THAT was how you use E and great ACM
one of the first typhies that really fought the way it should be done....I was just about equal E with him when he got me and I may have been able to climb with him on that last pass but he made a great shot and ended my sortie.....I would much rather that kind of ending then some "friendly" come in and Pick him off me.
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for the life of me I cant remember who it was :headscratch:
someone I fought before and have respect for being a fighter..... :headscratch:
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That graph says it all. The proverbial "elephant in the room" that nobody seems to notice. Probably because everyone in the room is in a P-51. ;)
:lol
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excellent short write up.....had a typhy jump me recently, he had about 3 or 4 K at the start after his first pass he never went more the 2K above me I think even less then that and kept at it and killed me, I immediately sent him a <S> on a job well done.....THAT was how you use E and great ACM
one of the first typhies that really fought the way it should be done....I was just about equal E with him when he got me and I may have been able to climb with him on that last pass but he made a great shot and ended my sortie.....I would much rather that kind of ending then some "friendly" come in and Pick him off me.
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for the life of me I cant remember who it was :headscratch:
someone I fought before and have respect for being a fighter..... :headscratch:
I ran into someone last tour who did this - was in a tiffy and I was amazed when I started a rolling S, he stayed with me! I forget who it was as well, but if it wasn't for the 109 trying to hO me I would of gained the edge and shot him down - instead he got me when I took the Ho shot and lost position and gave up my 6.
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uhhhummmmm.....I mentioned it before many times maybe even in this thread :neener:
Oh, sorry about that. You do quite a lot of bragging, so I mostly just skim through your posts. :angel:
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Oh, sorry about that. You do quite a lot of bragging, so I mostly just skim through your posts. :angel:
:rofl
confidence is often mistaken for bragging from the lesser humans....... :bolt:
:P
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Lesser, as in less weight perhaps. :angel: :bolt:
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Lesser, as in less weight perhaps. :angel: :bolt:
I am only 225 now a days....I would agree when I was 270.... :D
even then I could do a split.....oh damn there I go bragging again :t
ahhh I am in a strange mood today...being up 2 days straight does it I guess.
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Oh sureeeeee bring Top Gun into this! *Drinks another beer
You fellas can handle it. :D :salute